How bad is Leveticus now?

[Outcast]

I have not played malifaux for 2years and is coming back to see all the nerfs to my boy levi, how do he preform now?

And how do you build lista?

[Azahul]

There's actually an argument that the nerfs were nearly a buff. Going to Stat 6 alone makes Leveticus's attacks considerably more reliable, and if you pack stones for the crow trigger you can still force through a good amount of Irreducible damage.

 

I think the new Gaining Grounds is more relevant to the drop in Leve's popularity. The pool this season rewards Tara's mobility or Schill's flexibility more so than Leve's killing power. He still has a place in more killy pools though.

[Gheist]

I think if I ever finish to paint the Crew, i am going to start by playing

Levi with Servant of Dark Powers

+Totems

Alice

Marlena

Ashes n'Dust

a Scavenger

and 1 Slot for something flexible (or two, depending on Soulstone value)

[Outcast]

Played a game now with new levi and I must say he did not feel weak at all. I played a jacob list and levi did super good, killing a samurai turn 2 and then just keept going.

 

I did miss that scavengers lost weird device fast trigger, and my alice was a bit crazy when fast,

 

But i must say levi is still fun!

 

 

[Zebo]

I think worse nerf to Leveticus is nerf to both Scavenger and Necropunk. He's gone from having two reliable high-mobility minions to none. 

 

I've always thought that he wasn't so good to deserve a nerf, because all the changes to him had made him worse (remember not only his Attack Stat change, but many other things). 

[trikk]

I think Levi is super strong and probably isnt as popular cause Von Schill+ Yannic and Tara exist.

 

The few games I played with him oost errata he still evaporates stuff pretty fast and I usually manage to get 1-2 leaps off

[Axelst]

Scavengers did not get nerfed, they got sidegraded. They're still one of the best 6 stone minions in the game. Necropunks are also still good, though you'll probably not be using more than one anymore.

[Zebo]

Sorry, no more pseudo-leap, no more focus+fast, almost unseen out of keyword. 

It was undoubtedly a needed nerf, but it was a clear nerf.

I think Necropunks were too much nerfed, maybe they could have a trigger like this

Resourceful: immediately, add any suit of your choice to this model's final duel total. 

Or maybe a to their leap. 

 

They were too good before, bit now they're too mediocre IMHO. 

[Axelst]

Scavengers now hand out focus as a bonus instead of a regular action, which frees their actions up to do other things, they can move models with knock aside and they're one of only two non-master models in the faction that can remove any kind of marker. They're still absolutely great in keyword and not bad outside of it.

One necropunk is still a good scheme runner well worth 5 stones, though more than one would probably be hard to justify without the insane card draw of Transmortis.

[Zebo]

I'm not saying that Scavengers are bad now, because I don't think so. 

I think both nerfs were deserved, and even needed. Just think that Necropunk's one gone too far. Less than 25% chance of leaping from the deck is a huuge blow. Their only role is to be an scheme runner, and now they're not very good. Playable, of course, but mediocre. 

[Jordon]

I've actually had great success with the necropunks. Without even looking at leap, just have a 5ss model with 6wds, armor+1 and H2W is actually pretty tanky for their cost. You certainly are not killing them in a single go like many other low cost minions. 

Studied Opponent is also extremely good for cycling out the garbage from your hand. Heck even their attack is not all that bad given the triggers they have access too. All in all I think the punks are solid personally. 

[Maniacal_cackle]

Not to mention even 1 or 2 leaps per game is probably enough.

They're not like an expensive beater that needs to leap every turn.

[KID55]

Leveticus my main Master since 2016, so I have some thoughts about his keyword.

At first - he still strong. But now I should think a bit and prepare more.

Levi itself still killing machine, especially with Stat 6 at melee. But he becomes much more fragile: heal after ressurection only +1 wound from waif's health and not end conditions. Against heavy burning/poison crew you need Johan in roster. And Emissary always good addition.

For scavengers - yes we lost fast, that sucks. But now we can push other models and remove any type of markers. That's huge and won me games not one time. And wierd device is a bonus now, that's also cool. Tools for the job one of the best abilities in a game.

For necropunks - just keep low masks in hand. If you really need leap - prepare. For 5 stones they are really cool. With current GG I often take 2 in roster.

Nerf that I don't like is Alice movement. Downgrade to 4 is too much. Especially in current GG. 5 was enough. And argument that "she just disengage and shot you 3 times" is redicolous. Now we don't have easy fast, so even if she disengage it wiil be only two shots. But with move 4 she can even don't disengage. Her main purpose is shooting, and that not work very well now. But. Scavenger still can push her, as well as Emissary. So, nerf didn't "solve" problem and just make model worse. And her pit traps marker. There is no synergy with crew. It would be better if she will drop, for example, scrap for Ashes. I think she should receive her move back (at least 5) and change pit trap marker to something more usefull for crew.

Ashes and Dust - I think he should receive buff, because without build in crow trigger his damage output to low for his fragility. If he got splitted on to two parts - 95% he don't assemble again. Because he needs both parts alive and in btb. And there is A LOT of options how to move models. I think he should receive build in crow back OR make ressurection easier.

Marlena is good. Desolation I think should have def 4 or 2" or +flip on attack. If we check similar models in other faction the have it. Right now he too fragile to reach target by himself and you need to spend a lot of resources to move him with other models. And when you start attacking you often don't have enough card for good output (for his cost).

[Plaag]

leveticus crew must be nerfed-remove necrotic decay from levi's melee, remove tools for the job from scavengers, make necropunk cost 6

[Zebo]

Agree with Ashes & Dust needing something, but only because new changes to summoning. Removing the Summon token from Dust Storm would keep it playable as a fast, heavy, expensive scheme runner. 

[ShinChan]

On 5/31/2022 at 4:39 AM, KID55 said:

Leveticus my main Master since 2016, so I have some thoughts about his keyword.

At first - he still strong. But now I should think a bit and prepare more.

Levi itself still killing machine, especially with Stat 6 at melee. But he becomes much more fragile: heal after ressurection only +1 wound from waif's health and not end conditions. Against heavy burning/poison crew you need Johan in roster. And Emissary always good addition.

For scavengers - yes we lost fast, that sucks. But now we can push other models and remove any type of markers. That's huge and won me games not one time. And wierd device is a bonus now, that's also cool. Tools for the job one of the best abilities in a game.

For necropunks - just keep low masks in hand. If you really need leap - prepare. For 5 stones they are really cool. With current GG I often take 2 in roster.

Nerf that I don't like is Alice movement. Downgrade to 4 is too much. Especially in current GG. 5 was enough. And argument that "she just disengage and shot you 3 times" is redicolous. Now we don't have easy fast, so even if she disengage it wiil be only two shots. But with move 4 she can even don't disengage. Her main purpose is shooting, and that not work very well now. But. Scavenger still can push her, as well as Emissary. So, nerf didn't "solve" problem and just make model worse. And her pit traps marker. There is no synergy with crew. It would be better if she will drop, for example, scrap for Ashes. I think she should receive her move back (at least 5) and change pit trap marker to something more usefull for crew.

Ashes and Dust - I think he should receive buff, because without build in crow trigger his damage output to low for his fragility. If he got splitted on to two parts - 95% he don't assemble again. Because he needs both parts alive and in btb. And there is A LOT of options how to move models. I think he should receive build in crow back OR make ressurection easier.

Marlena is good. Desolation I think should have def 4 or 2" or +flip on attack. If we check similar models in other faction the have it. Right now he too fragile to reach target by himself and you need to spend a lot of resources to move him with other models. And when you start attacking you often don't have enough card for good output (for his cost).

I agree with Mostly everything here.

Leveticus not removing conditions is a huge hit. Stunned is always bad on him and with Malifaux Burns there are new 13 models that can hand out Stunned either with an opposed or forcing a simple duel but without needing a teigger. Dying with Staggered could mean that he's never gonna see the fight for the rest of the game. Distracted can be really painful too, but manageable, altough now makes Channel completely useless. Burning and Poison can just permakill him. 

I would love to see some trigger in Marlena's attacks to make her more interesting.

I agree with A&D. The scrap synergy is stupid. It's too squishy and doesn't hit hard enough for its cost and now it gets a summoning token that doesn't even go away if Ashen Coren and Dust Cloud reform.

Alice Mv4 is a joke and completely unnecessary. I however, think that the pit traps are useful. 

The problem with the necropunks is still there, they're too tanky for their cost. They should drop to 4 wounds and get back the mask in the leap. The problem was never the leap with them, but that even if they were chased and caught, not even a min3 beater would have it easy to kill them, and that's still the case. 

Scavengers didn't get a nerf, it's more of a rework. They are still supergood in keyword. I understand the reason why the 9" leap and giving out fast needed to go, but rhey should have kept Forage, because it even fit them thematically.

[KID55]

1 hour ago, ShinChan said:

Dying with Staggered could mean that he's never gonna see the fight for the rest of the game.

But staggered prevent move effects from OTHER freindly models. Leveticus place himself with demise. Not other model.

[Maniacal_cackle]

1 hour ago, KID55 said:

But staggered prevent move effects from OTHER freindly models. Leveticus place himself with demise. Not other model.

I think the point is more that if he demise and teleports to some isolated part of the board with staggered, then he is going to be a while walking back into the action.

[KID55]

Ah, I this case yes. But usually you try to keep your waifs not so far away. And you have a scavengers they can push him. Or Emissary bonus action.

[Maniacal_cackle]

10 minutes ago, KID55 said:

Ah, I this case yes. But usually you try to keep your waifs not so far away. And you have a scavengers they can push him. Or Emissary bonus action.

Staggered models cannot be moved by friendly models, so he just has to walk it off. 

Although out of the game seems like hyperbole.

I think at best you'll miss one turn of the action?

[KID55]

Right.

[clockworkspide]

On 6/3/2022 at 4:06 AM, Maniacal_cackle said:

Staggered models cannot be moved by friendly models, so he just has to walk it off. 

Although out of the game seems like hyperbole.

I think at best you'll miss one turn of the action?

Does that include Obey and similiar effects that cause a model to take an out-of-activation walk?  Not relevant to Levi himself, but I've always wondered about that.

[Adran]

34 minutes ago, clockworkspide said:

Does that include Obey and similiar effects that cause a model to take an out-of-activation walk?  Not relevant to Levi himself, but I've always wondered about that.

If you obey a model to take an action and that model chooses a walk action (even if the choice is controlled by another model) then it is the obeyed model that generates the moves. Staggered won't stop this.

If you have an action that moves a model it's walk ( such as lure) then the movement is not generated by the target and staggered will stop it. 

Hopefully that helps. "Target model takes a walk action" has the movement generated by the target. "Move target model it's walk" has the movement generated by the "attacker". 

[ShinChan]

On 6/3/2022 at 4:06 AM, Maniacal_cackle said:

Staggered models cannot be moved by friendly models, so he just has to walk it off. 

Although out of the game seems like hyperbole.

I think at best you'll miss one turn of the action?

Not having a master for whole turn it's usually game deciding, specially one like Levi, who cannot just spend his turn doing some support (because he has none lol)