Maniacal_cackle Posted February 7, 2021 Report Share Posted February 7, 2021 Oh, the only thing I'm a bit salty about with the crew is that the master is essentially immune to conditions. Stunned and slow would be really good tools against Ivan if you could use them. I don't really like design where a model is just immune/near immune to the natural counterplay for it's kit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whut Posted February 7, 2021 Report Share Posted February 7, 2021 3 minutes ago, Maniacal_cackle said: Oh, the only thing I'm a bit salty about with the crew is that the master is essentially immune to conditions. Stunned and slow would be really good tools against Ivan if you could use them. I don't really like design where a model is just immune/near immune to the natural counterplay for it's kit. Well, he isn't Immune... it's just that all conditions are drawn in by the gravitational field of Mordrake's massive ungentlemanly cojones as he dives in to his death over and over. Ya gotta kill him first with Manos Can you post the lists and Scheme Pool from your game? I'm quite interested 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maniacal_cackle Posted February 7, 2021 Report Share Posted February 7, 2021 1 minute ago, Whut said: Well, he isn't Immune... it's just that all conditions are drawn in by the gravitational field of Mordrake's massive ungentlemanly cojones as he dives in to his death over and over. Ya gotta kill him first with Manos Can you post the lists and Scheme Pool from your game? I'm quite interested In this game, we were limited to 15 stones of versatiles and OOKs, so Manos wasn't there 😧 But yeah, having them shunted off to the totem would maybe be okay. Shunting them to a near invincible totem was not cool xD He is basically immune to anti-heal auras as well! (since he teleports before healing). The pool: Recover Evidence on Wedge, Automatic Lighthouse map (terrain made a huge difference, I picked my deployment zone poorly). Claim Jump (Mordrake, Crooligan) Take Prisoner (Mordrake) Spread Them Out (for Ivan's team) Sabotage Breakthrough His crew: Ivan & Mordrake Flush With Cash on Ivan (I think Hidden Agenda might be better) Austera & Twigge Archivist (very solid model!!) Gibson Flush with cash Operative x2 (not great models I would have thought, but were remarkably annoying). Those built in positive flips is really good for pinging away damage without relying on the cards that you're feeding to the rest of the crew. Nocturne (ehhhh... Not a fan of these as a hire). My crew: Molly & Machine Dead Rider (saved Molly with Ride With Me when she was stupid, then died) Rogue Necromancy (killed an operative and took its token, then died) Archie (did some useful beats, then died) Forgotten Marshal (summoned a bit, then died) The Whisper Carrion Effigy (did a few heals, mostly ran around). Crooligan (scored 2 points). Definitely regretted not having a backup crooligan to just throw away and let it die. They're so useful!! Molly is pretty tricky to play without OOKs & Versatiles (since she is a control/denial master, so she does a LOT of tech picks), but Ivan also seems a bit weaker in keyword so balanced out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maniacal_cackle Posted February 7, 2021 Report Share Posted February 7, 2021 Oh, he scored three recover evidence, one claim jump with Mordrake (but then I attacked him last activation of the game for 3 damage with a crooligan, so he couldn't cheat). And one spread them out (but my crooligan picked up a marker to deny a point last activation of the game). So last activation the crooligan got claim jump + take prisoner, and denied claim jump + spread them out... 4 point swing in one activation xD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whut Posted February 7, 2021 Report Share Posted February 7, 2021 36 minutes ago, Maniacal_cackle said: In this game, we were limited to 15 stones of versatiles and OOKs, so Manos wasn't there 😧 But yeah, having them shunted off to the totem would maybe be okay. Shunting them to a near invincible totem was not cool xD He is basically immune to anti-heal auras as well! (since he teleports before healing). The pool: Recover Evidence on Wedge, Automatic Lighthouse map (terrain made a huge difference, I picked my deployment zone poorly). Claim Jump (Mordrake, Crooligan) Take Prisoner (Mordrake) Spread Them Out (for Ivan's team) Sabotage Breakthrough His crew: Ivan & Mordrake Flush With Cash on Ivan (I think Hidden Agenda might be better) Austera & Twigge Archivist (very solid model!!) Gibson Flush with cash Operative x2 (not great models I would have thought, but were remarkably annoying). Those built in positive flips is really good for pinging away damage without relying on the cards that you're feeding to the rest of the crew. Nocturne (ehhhh... Not a fan of these as a hire). My crew: Molly & Machine Dead Rider (saved Molly with Ride With Me when she was stupid, then died) Rogue Necromancy (killed an operative and took its token, then died) Archie (did some useful beats, then died) Forgotten Marshal (summoned a bit, then died) The Whisper Carrion Effigy (did a few heals, mostly ran around). Crooligan (scored 2 points). Definitely regretted not having a backup crooligan to just throw away and let it die. They're so useful!! Molly is pretty tricky to play without OOKs & Versatiles (since she is a control/denial master, so she does a LOT of tech picks), but Ivan also seems a bit weaker in keyword so balanced out. I'm not at all surprised he couldn't cross the centerline with that crew composition against DeadRider/RogueNecro/Archie. Not what I would have taken, although also I hadn't thought of Archivist in DUA-Umbra so you can Siphon Mordrake for free, that's genius. Unfortunately idk much about Molly, so my comments are broad/general stuff here without matchup knowledge. Also take everything with a grain of salt, I could be wrong Not having Eva is a mistake, she has "broken beyond belief" potential for 7 stones. I would have taken her over Austera. Speaking of whom, did Ivan consistently heal enough to make her Chronicle worth it? EDIT: Vernon and Welles I assume would have been better for SpreadThemOut against Molly too, although I only say that cause I know she attacks WP The double FWC is confusing, they can't both trigger off one death, right? I like the idea of Hidden Agenda but Ivan should always have double plus (one plus crow) be winning most duels on the flip so secret cheating isn't good - at least on paper. Also FWC has the "NO REAP panic button" which is crucial with Ivan being so important to his crew. I'm confused about the "severely card hungry" - Like sure, Ivan is card hungry but at least on paper it doesn't seem at a problematic level Was Distracted/Focus stacking good between Gibson and the Nocturne? Was he cheating his simple duels down on everyone? How did the Operatives do? Particularly did Infiltrator do anything? How often were they able to draw cards with SetUpFS? How often were they getting Ambush for free or were they discarding? What did Ivan get to summon each turn? And were you able to kill that so easily that he couldn't get any pressure on your half of the board at all, or...?  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maniacal_cackle Posted February 7, 2021 Report Share Posted February 7, 2021 20 minutes ago, Whut said: I'm not at all surprised he couldn't cross the centerline with that crew composition against DeadRider/RogueNecro/Archie. Not what I would have taken, although also I hadn't thought of Archivist in DUA-Umbra so you can Siphon Mordrake for free, that's genius. Good point, it is probably specifically against Ressers thing. We're much better in melee than he is. 21 minutes ago, Whut said: Not having Eva is a mistake, she has "broken beyond belief" potential for 7 stones. I would have taken her over Austera. Speaking of whom, did Ivan consistently heal enough to make her Chronicle worth it? EDIT: Vernon and Welles I assume would have been better for SpreadThemOut against Molly too, although I only say that cause I know she attacks WP I was kind of hoping he would take Eva. I would have put an intel token on her and then when she came to interact I kill her on the spot (especially since Molly can eat her Quarantine marker). Vernon and Welles is solid tech as well, but I think I used my WP attacks a grand total of four times throughout the game. Austera and Twigge were super annoying. They could be so useful from super far away, so I could never find a safe place to kill Austera and Twigge. Constantly threatening damage really shaped my activations, as I had to be aware of randomly take 1 (or even 3) damage that I didn't want to take. They can create scheme markers at range (superrrrr good since I didn't want to cross the centre either). And the card draw/card selection was extremely painful for me. That said, I can see that dropping an operative for her would have been a good plan. Eva seems more effective than an operative at least (except operatives can't be treated as enemies!!! Repeatedly messed with me - no pouncing strike trigger). 26 minutes ago, Whut said: The double FWC is confusing, they can't both trigger off one death, right? I like the idea of Hidden Agenda but Ivan should always have double plus (one plus crow) be winning most duels on the flip so secret cheating isn't good - at least on paper. Also FWC has the "NO REAP panic button" which is crucial with Ivan being so important to his crew. You can double soul stone with it, but it doesn't matter much as I didn't want to go into their bubble anyway. He did get two soulstones off of it, though. The NO REAP panic button is a good point, I'll watch out for that next time and line up two attacks to make sure I land it. That said, in Recover Evidence I was really not looking to kill his master unless he spoon fed him to me. 27 minutes ago, Whut said: I'm confused about the "severely card hungry" - Like sure, Ivan is card hungry but at least on paper it doesn't seem at a problematic level Well, note my crew composition has two models that he can make Brockens off of (Molly with serene countenance, Dead Rider with Willpower 7). DUA/Umbra seems like a keyword that relies on landing a few extremely impactful attacks. If your hand is 11/11/12, and I have 12/12/13, you might not be landing any hits depending on the cheating order. Additionally you telegraph when you're going for the big play (aka, setting up to get two crows), so it can be hard to land a summon unless you really work for it. Each turn a lot of severe cards were ear-marked for slowing down Ivan (which is fine, a lot of turns I drew 4-6 extra cards). 30 minutes ago, Whut said: Was Distracted/Focus stacking good between Gibson and the Nocturne? Was he cheating his simple duels down on everyone? Distracted/focus was something I suspect he could have done a lot better with (although I think he was doing other shenanigans with those models that felt decently impactful). But note Molly can just eat conditions at 8 inches anyway, so it isn't necessarily a good idea to super stack against her anyway. 31 minutes ago, Whut said: How did the Operatives do? Particularly did Infiltrator do anything? How often were they able to draw cards with SetUpFS? How often were they getting Ambush for free or were they discarding? Operatives were annoying to kill (because I couldn't treat them as enemies, get pouncing strike, etc). They were scary for Molly (they ignore serene countenance). But ultimately they couldn't get close enough to the action without risking death. So I'd not rate them (except in this tournament where you have to take keyword stuff anyway). 32 minutes ago, Whut said: What did Ivan get to summon each turn? And were you able to kill that so easily that he couldn't get any pressure on your half of the board at all, or...? He got two brockens and a daeva. Brocken was like turn 1 or 2, off my Dead Rider positioning. Nearly lost me the game but I killed it pretty fast since they're pretty easy to kill (I tried to single activation with Archie but didn't have the right cards). The Daeva was incredibly annoying. It attacked my Forgotten Marshal and the movement trigger to get away from it was super annoying. I essentially just wrote the Marshal off as dead and forgot about it, then the Daeva killed it and ran off to score another point. very good. The last Brocken killed Molly I think, but after she activated on turn 5 so didn't matter. Since it was freshly summoned, it couldn't drop a scheme which was really bad. So overall he had two impactful summons, so I was pretty happy with that outcome of trying to block his big plays. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whut Posted February 7, 2021 Report Share Posted February 7, 2021 1 hour ago, Maniacal_cackle said: I would have put an intel token on her and then when she came to interact I kill her on the spot (especially since Molly can eat her Quarantine marker). Good point, I forgot Molly has Lost Knowledge. In that case Eva would have to play a defensive shooty role and try to deny her Token, or if she goes in she would have to go in deep and engage/Lock Molly in such a way that Molly couldn't disengage away. Can Crooligans Teleport>Remove or only Remove>Teleport when discarding at start of activation? 1 hour ago, Maniacal_cackle said: You can double soul stone with it, but it doesn't matter much as I didn't want to go into their bubble anyway. He did get two soulstones off of it, though. Wait... you CAN get two soulstones from two copies of FWC, during a single death? I need this to be true, I'm gonna be Mr. Moneybags McMonopoly Investment Banker Man every game from now until the upgrade is banned if true. 1 hour ago, Maniacal_cackle said: Well, note my crew composition has two models that he can make Brockens off of (Molly with serene countenance, Dead Rider with Willpower 7). DUA/Umbra seems like a keyword that relies on landing a few extremely impactful attacks. If your hand is 11/11/12, and I have 12/12/13, you might not be landing any hits depending on the cheating order. Additionally you telegraph when you're going for the big play (aka, setting up to get two crows), so it can be hard to land a summon unless you really work for it. Each turn a lot of severe cards were ear-marked for slowing down Ivan (which is fine, a lot of turns I drew 4-6 extra cards). [...] He got two brockens and a daeva. [...] So overall he had two impactful summons, so I was pretty happy with that outcome of trying to block his big plays. This is all only partially True. If Ivan is losing card advantage and Gibson fails to grab a 13 he should be summoning Daeva using a decent Crow in hand / Gibson grabs. Especially in this matchup with 3 min-3 attacks to Mimic. With 3 attacks, plus flip to each, and +1 Stat Ivan should be able to win 2/3 on the flip and then either you cheat and I cheat up to hit 3 + Staggered if I can, or you don't and I cheat down the Crow to summon. I either summon or I pull cheating cards so I can summon on attack #3. I might even dump my 3rd attack on Archie or NecMachine just to ensure I get a Nocturne if I haven't summoned already and only have an 11. Just something to be aware of as an interested opponent. And for those who want to play Ivan PLEASE don't horse-blinder yourself and waste attacks and stones for a Brocken when you could happily deal 8+, Stagger 2 models, and have a Daeva or even a Nocturne. *Again, grain of salt. I could be too idealistic with how it seems on paper 1 hour ago, Maniacal_cackle said: But note Molly can just eat conditions at 8 inches anyway, so it isn't necessarily a good idea to super stack against her anyway Did not know this - super stacking would be a mistake, but Gibson/Noct should be able to load Ivan & Friends up with 2-3 at a time. Idk how far up the board Molly plays tho 1 hour ago, Maniacal_cackle said: Operatives were annoying to kill (because I couldn't treat them as enemies, get pouncing strike, etc). They were scary for Molly (they ignore serene countenance). But ultimately they couldn't get close enough to the action without risking death. So I'd not rate them (except in this tournament where you have to take keyword stuff anyway). Yea, I assume since Molly is too good at removing scheme markers they never got to draw those extra cards. When they did attack it was probably good tho - ignoring Terrifying and flipping positives. I think they rely heavily on Ivan & Umbra to keep enemies away from them. Did Ivan give the RougeNecro Staggered? That would be my #1 priority every turn until it's dead. It doesn't look like Molly has Condition Removal, does she? 1 hour ago, Maniacal_cackle said: Austera and Twigge were super annoying. They could be so useful from super far away, so I could never find a safe place to kill Austera and Twigge. Constantly threatening damage really shaped my activations, as I had to be aware of randomly take 1 (or even 3) damage that I didn't want to take. They can create scheme markers at range (superrrrr good since I didn't want to cross the centre either). And the card draw/card selection was extremely painful for me. Even with all the H2W, the 1 damage ping or possible 3 was that scary? I had thought that was A&T's hard counter. 1 hour ago, Maniacal_cackle said: Molly [&] Nocturne (ehhhh... Not a fan of these as a hire). Did Lethe's Caress do anything? I'm surprised you didn't mention it since Ivan, Nocturne, Archivist all want to spam a single action. I assume they leaped out of LoS before attacking or in the case of the Nocturne - healed up from Ivan? It's really a shame he took the Nocturne instead of Intrepid Effigy w/ Fate Upgrade. Even if he liked the rest of the crew the way it was, Effigy does almost the same pushy stuff but also heals and could have made a big difference later for just 1 Stone more. Nocturne is much better if you already have an Intrepid and are also DUA-heavy with Rook and Eva. Surprisingly despite the "not so much OOK" restriction, I stay more In-Keyword than 15 stones in 80% of my crews I would say EDIT: Not true, I thought the restriction was for OOK only (not versatiles, I use plenty of versatiles) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maniacal_cackle Posted February 7, 2021 Report Share Posted February 7, 2021 21 minutes ago, Whut said: Can Crooligans Teleport>Remove or only Remove>Teleport when discarding at start of activation? It is a bit ambiguous under the rules, but different people play it different ways. I play it that you do it after, but most of my opponents play it that the crooligan does it before. I always say I'm happy to play it that way, but it is actually stronger for me - the Crooligan can bonus action scheme markers away, so doing it before the teleport means I can remove a scheme marker, teleport away, and remove another. 22 minutes ago, Whut said: Wait... you CAN get two soulstones from two copies of FWC, during a single death? I need this to be true, I'm gonna be Mr. Moneybags McMonopoly Investment Banker Man every game from now until the upgrade is banned if true. Yup, works that way, and I think it's been covered on the rules forums. Basically auras only don't stack on the affected model. In this case, the model that dies isn't the affected model (it is just the one generating the effect). I think it is probably the model with the upgrade that is 'affected' and gains a stone. 23 minutes ago, Whut said: This is all only partially True. If Ivan is losing card advantage and Gibson fails to grab a 13 he should be summoning Daeva using a decent Crow in hand / Gibson grabs. Yeah, he may have been too focused on Brocken, but also I play a very 'u' shaped game against Ivan. I basically shape my crew so there are only a few options to hit, and if he goes too deep he risks being blown up by the crew. Since most of my threats can attack twice at 14+ inches, he has to be a bit careful (especially if he accidentally takes 9 irreducible from Molly). And he did get some solid Tools, but I think they were often like 11 and 12s. Getting the timing to line up perfectly for a 13 or red joker is hard. Regardless, it wasn't much compared to my extra ~6 cards a turn. 27 minutes ago, Whut said: Did Ivan give the RougeNecro Staggered? That would be my #1 priority every turn until it's dead. It doesn't look like Molly has Condition Removal, does she? The Rogue Necro was super deep in my crew turn 1, and end of turn 1/2 I handed him the Dead Rider to kill, and then he followed up by killing Archie... And Rogue Necro too xD So yeah, he just nuked all of those by turn three I think. After that, though, Molly was guarding the rest of my crew and I kept eating the shadow markers that would let Ivan dive my crew (and I don't think he realised how powerful crooligans are, as realistically it may have been a valid strategy to let me kill Ivan in exchange for killing my crooligan, although he didn't know it was claim jumping at that stage). Molly doesn't have much condition removal beyond nurses (which are OOK, so no go this time). 30 minutes ago, Whut said: Even with all the H2W, the 1 damage ping or possible 3 was that scary? I had thought that was A&T's hard counter. The 1 damage ping was enough to kill Archie, so it forced me to activate him xD So it may have been lucky coincidence. But even after that, the possibility of a puncture trigger, or wearing down my crooligan/effigy/any hard to kill model (I had three hard to kill models), or even just blowing up my Necrotic Machine since it doesn't have hard to wound... Was a lot of pressure for me to play around. I had to have heals available constantly (not to mention the 20-40% chance that he flips all moderates and lucks out for high damage). 32 minutes ago, Whut said: It's really a shame he took the Nocturne instead of Intrepid Effigy w/ Fate Upgrade. Even if he liked the rest of the crew the way it was, Effigy does almost the same pushy stuff but also heals and could have made a big difference later for just 1 Stone more. Nocturne is much better if you already have an Intrepid and are also DUA-heavy. Surprisingly despite the "not so much OOK" restriction, I stay more In-Keyword than 15 stones in 80% of my crews I would say He couldn't take Effigy, he reached his 15 stone cap on versatiles and OOKs (special rule for the tournament). Both our crews would have been VERY different if not for that, I think xD So he'd have had to drop another option (and Emissary is a bit iffy against Molly, since she can do 9 irreducible to it). Granted, if he knew I was going to just throw away my Dead Rider, then effigy/emissary would have been a great pick xD 34 minutes ago, Whut said: Did Lethe's Caress do anything? I'm surprised you didn't mention it since Ivan, Nocturne, Archivist all want to spam a single action. I assume they leaped out of LoS before attacking or in the case of the Nocturne - healed up from Ivan? I think it did like 8-12 damage on Ivan? Didn't matter, he healed it back up. I think it may have harmed the Archivist as well. Gibson just sat behind other models so Molly couldn't see him. Something got the Archivist down to 6 life, so Molly just killed it in two hits. That was probably caress + siphon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maniacal_cackle Posted February 7, 2021 Report Share Posted February 7, 2021 For reference, the base crew I would have liked to take into that scenario if not for the restriction would be: Molly & Machine Anna Lovelace Dead Rider Archie Crooligan Crooligan The terrain wasn't ideal, but I think I could have done a better job of hiding Archie + Dead Rider. Molly/Anna/Machine could form a bubble so that no summons could take place there, and crooligans of course are virtually impossible to reach early game (and then give me supreme activation control). As is, I was struggling to get enough card draw AND activation control, and you really need both in this matchup. So have to have two minions for this matchup, I think (Molly can reactivate minions, so each minion gives me another activation control potentially). I did think maybe summoning would fill that gap, but not so much xD Makes for some awkward targeting for Ivan if he doesn't want to end up somewhere where he might get Dead Ridered/Archied/Murder Crooliganed/Storied. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mycellanious Posted February 7, 2021 Report Share Posted February 7, 2021 7 hours ago, Maniacal_cackle said: Oh, the only thing I'm a bit salty about with the crew is that the master is essentially immune to conditions. Stunned and slow would be really good tools against Ivan if you could use them. I don't really like design where a model is just immune/near immune to the natural counterplay for it's kit. Well he's not immune, you just need to hit him twice. If Mordrake already has Slow/Stunned, then he can't gain Slow/Stunned, so he can't use Black Mirror. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maniacal_cackle Posted February 7, 2021 Report Share Posted February 7, 2021 5 hours ago, Mycellanious said: Well he's not immune, you just need to hit him twice. If Mordrake already has Slow/Stunned, then he can't gain Slow/Stunned, so he can't use Black Mirror. Yeah, but hitting him twice is already quite the challenge xD But yes, it is technically doable. EDIT: note it may be stun three times, as Mordrake can activate and drop the stunned the first time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whut Posted February 7, 2021 Report Share Posted February 7, 2021 20 minutes ago, Maniacal_cackle said: Yeah, but hitting him twice is already quite the challenge xD But yes, it is technically doable. EDIT: note it may be stun three times, as Mordrake can activate and drop the stunned the first time. It could be stun an infinite number of times, cause Mordrake can be killed to clear conditions in a pinch 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adran Posted February 7, 2021 Report Share Posted February 7, 2021 33 minutes ago, Maniacal_cackle said: Yeah, but hitting him twice is already quite the challenge xD But yes, it is technically doable. EDIT: note it may be stun three times, as Mordrake can activate and drop the stunned the first time. You can just hit mordrake once and Ivan once, they don't have to both be Ivan. But yes it is some protection that you'll need to go for that solution hard if that's the way you go. You can't just put 1 model that can stun in and hope to ruin Ivan completely. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maniacal_cackle Posted February 7, 2021 Report Share Posted February 7, 2021 And I suppose it is possible that he would be farrrr too weak if a single stun could take him out, given how easy it is to grab stat 7 stun. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whut Posted February 7, 2021 Report Share Posted February 7, 2021 2 minutes ago, Maniacal_cackle said: And I suppose it is possible that he would be farrrr too weak if a single stun could take him out, given how easy it is to grab stat 7 stun. This is true. Every other Summoner can't be stopped (in 99% of cases), why should Ivan? I like this from a game design perspective Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whut Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 On 2/7/2021 at 3:26 AM, Whut said: This is all only partially True. If Ivan is losing card advantage and Gibson fails to grab a 13 he should be summoning Daeva using a decent Crow in hand / Gibson grabs. Especially in this matchup with 3 min-3 attacks to Mimic. With 3 attacks, plus flip to each, and +1 Stat Ivan should be able to win 2/3 on the flip and then either you cheat and I cheat up to hit 3 + Staggered if I can, or you don't and I cheat down the Crow to summon. I either summon or I pull cheating cards so I can summon on attack #3. I might even dump my 3rd attack on Archie or NecMachine just to ensure I get a Nocturne if I haven't summoned already and only have an 11. Just something to be aware of as an interested opponent. And for those who want to play Ivan PLEASE don't horse-blinder yourself and waste attacks and stones for a Brocken when you could happily deal 8+, Stagger 2 models, and have a Daeva or even a Nocturne. *Again, grain of salt. I could be too idealistic with how it seems on paper I'm doubling down on this, because I just realized Daeva can copy Archivist's attack and use it to draw cards (even at Stat 5) - solving the card hunger problem. Although... I also now realize Archivist doesn't ignore concealment. I assume this makes him quite a bit worse once some Concealment covers the board Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maniacal_cackle Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 3 hours ago, Whut said: I'm doubling down on this, because I just realized Daeva can copy Archivist's attack and use it to draw cards (even at Stat 5) - solving the card hunger problem. True, amazing ability to mimic!! Might be hard to get them positioned together, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiaden Posted April 24, 2021 Report Share Posted April 24, 2021 What do you think of a crew like that: English Ivan Mr. Mordrake Eva Havenhand Gibson DeWalt Intrepid Emissary Daeva Harata Ngaatoro 8 Soulstones left.  I value the Daeva over the Broken Spectre because thanks to the Mimic place it is more mobile on itself. Also it is such a flexible pic. Mimicing "Intimidating Roar" gives surprise mobility, "Carved Taiaha" gives more damage, "Secret Passage" for surprise scheming, "Reach Through" gives another chance of instant bury if the enemy has no hand cards anymore, ... soo incredible flexible. Harata is made for this crew. He support Ivans summoning with his "Distraction" aura. His "Haka->Ngeri" does get so much better if he has concealment which this crew provides. Even if no other model benefits from Haka it solves Haratas only problem of being squishy. The 2", Stat 6, Weak 3 attack is plain good and what the crew lacks. He can dish out Distracted with the shockwave attack or Debilitating Poison which thanks to DeWalt can also be used offensively not only defensively. It is even an Option to buff your Crew with Distracted on turn 1 with the shockwave attack since that 1 damage can easily be healed or even avoided thanks to the Emissary handing out Shielded. "Echoes of the Ocean" is also a small benefit. Because when Ivan wants to convert a scheme marker to a shadow marker you actually don't loose the scheme marker. Emissary gives mobility and additional protection for the more fragile models. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sagrit Posted April 27, 2021 Report Share Posted April 27, 2021 Harata looks interesting. Never tryed him yet, but will do one day. Eva is very situational... Secret Passage is nice, but i had few games when she actually did only that - Secret Passage, drop Marker, end of activation. I could have had the Marker on the same place with other options anyway. Hiring Daeva is something i don't like and 13 stones are too much, that what i think. Drop Daeva and hire Archivist or Finnigan. You will still get Daeva during the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whut Posted April 27, 2021 Report Share Posted April 27, 2021 Eva is a model who is very effective but cannot really do more than 1 thing. She's better defensively than offensively unless given Fast, and generally either threatens Passage-Scheme-LockAway to hold up enemy models or Passage-Walk-RemoveMarker with Treasure Map (and then Treasure Map pushes her back towards blocking Terrain, ready to Passage again) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Korrok Posted May 4, 2021 Report Share Posted May 4, 2021 I think Eva's value went up with gg2. As did the operatives imo. With how scheme marker heavy everything is and how movement based alot of things are I think both will shine considerably. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
izikial Posted July 5, 2021 Report Share Posted July 5, 2021 I have heard the recpmendation for lamp lighters and i like the spund of this. I feel like belhop porter has some validity in this crew. Giving shielded has a roal in protecting gibson or ivan. Same for his pull out of engagment also a 10" attack that can place a shadowmarker next to an enemy, perfect for the ivan crew, although admittedly less usefull when shadow is there as conceling will hamler him  1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gheist Posted July 7, 2021 Report Share Posted July 7, 2021 I Somehow Feel that extended Reach also has it's defensive uses, and depending on Terrain i think the +1 Size Boost to Ivan might do something, but that may just be wishful thinking As in my little playing group OOK is still considered ungentlemanly towards the noobs, i have to look towards the versatiles for a smattering of Power Gaming Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rufess Posted August 11, 2021 Report Share Posted August 11, 2021 I believe he is the new Ivan. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pallas4 Posted August 11, 2021 Report Share Posted August 11, 2021 !!! but I don't recognize what Ivan brings up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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