Solutions for Coryphee

[jasonbeauchene]

Right now my two favorite crews are Collette and Kirai. I played Collette recently in a tournament and other than a close game against Pandora, I went untouched. Facing a VonSchill crew next I lost Cassandra to a poor choice, but otherwise was unscathed.

The success of Collette/Coryphee seems to have many from my local gaming group declaring the Coryphee undercosted/overpowered/unbeatable. I like playing the crew, but want to still have people to play with, so I am shelving the Cory's for a while and playing with some other toys.

The reason for this post is to ask what tricks/tactics you have used seen used against the Cory's. I hope we can come up with some good general tactics for each faction so I can post it on my local scene's web pages and go back to playing the Showgirls.

[Mawdrigen]

The coryphee are good.. but they are fragile, leave them out on show and they WILL get killed. They also have low WP, so on turns when they attack someone they are susceptible to things like Obey which can draw them back into range to attack (I go sword dance and soulstone use on attack rounds, soulstone use and lost in dance on moving rounds)

[MrNybbles]

You're probably asking about the Coryphee Duet. It's difficult to believe your entire store thinks a 4 Wd model is overpowered.

Here is a list of Models that have killed my Coryphee Duet. It's not a long list, but a Duet is basically a 14 Soulstone model.

1) McMourning. This guy can discard body part counters to become fast. He is also a beast in melee. One-on-one McMourning should be able to kill a Coryphee Duet.

2) Ramos. Ramos and his crew are armored and decent in melee and also have Steampunk Arachnids which can lower the Coryphee's Df with Latch On. Exploding Spiders and the Electrical creation are also problematic because they can get around terrain without much trouble.

3) Lady Justice. Yeah, Lady Justice is a Melee Expert who can take out Coryphee Duet in a single activation.

To kill Coryphee Duet first take a Master and crew who is at least decent in melee combat (both attacking and defending). Lilith is a good example. Second, have some Soulstones to make sure those Strikes hit hard. Third, don't isolate your Master from the rest of your crew. The Showgirls are very good at killing Isolated models.

[Rathnard]

As a general rule of thumb, Corphee are most vulnerable to Wp-based attacks, and models who are fast enough to engage and attack them without having to charge.

Wp-based attacks would be the likes of Obey, Lure (Lure!), Menace and anything else that can draw them into range of your own crews attacks or severely hamper them in other ways.

The latter usually comes down to models with leap (Silurid, Necropunks, Sabretooth), a way of moving and attacking without charging (Ronin, all the Riders...Corphee... ) or with a high Wk and possibly fast or melee expert (McMourning, Lilith, Viks).

Ranged attacks without would also get around their bullet proof and evasive, but they're not common. Pandora, Candy (ie. Self Loathing) Leveticus and the Stitched Together all have a ranged, non- spell spell or ability that does damage. There's also the option of an overwhelming volume of firepower (ie. Gremlins), where you're plinking off 1 damage at a time, about a hundred times.

One other thought - Poison, Burning and Blight Counters would deal additional damage regardless of whether it came from a ranged effect, so that's another option.

[Sholto]

Most Showgirls players will go for the exposed model, so you can use that to lure the Coryphee in for an "easy" kill. Depending on your crew, you are set up to expect the Coryphee, and you then have probably a single activation to make the kill, because if you spring a trap that does not kill immediately, Collette will Illusionist them out of them (and herself). Companion or simultaneous activation will help enormously here, of course. Even with Bulletproof, sheer weight of fire will down them.

The alternative type of trap is anything that can force them out of Collette's 18" Illusionist range, and Rathnard has several examples of that. Beware, though, since Collette can simply Illusionist with another Showgirl to get in range, and then pop the Coryphee out of harm's way (and then, naturally, herself!)

They really frustrating as hell, and pulling your own nasty trick to catch one in melee with a heavy hitter is about your best option.

[mythicFOX]

On the cost issue; the Duet is (in effect) a 14ss model, making it one of the most expensive models in the game. Anything you spend 14ss on needs to be a game changer, because it's 40% of an average (35ss)crew.

On dealing with them. They're much more squishy if you can get the imitative and take them out before they activate and gain Use Soulstone.

It's also very important to play a positional game against them. Don't leave them in position to attack optimum targets from safety and then get back into cover again. Make them choose between staying safe and making effective attacks.

[Bozzy]

I actually run coryphees in my marcus crew all the time..are they strong..yes..are they over powered.no... 14 ss is a big investment....my main crews are pandora and zoraida both of which never have much trouble...and my two side crews marcus and soniaa not devistated by a coryohee duet either..thiers lots other models I hate seeing more than a duet lol.

[LoboStele]

The Viks often give me more trouble than anything, as it's not uncommon for them to knock me out in one hit. (darn Fury spell) As said above though, catching them before they've had a chance to activate Soul Dance (for Use Soulstone) is really the key though. And you pretty much have to hit them with something that has a 6 or 7 Cb, or has Use Soulstone themselves.

[jasonbeauchene]

Good stuff so far.

I did mean the Duet, as the individuals are much easier to deal with, I rarely split them up for that reason, unless I have a need to do so.

For losing the initiative I keep Mechanical Doves around for the soulstone flips before the Coryphee have activated. That way I still have acces to 1-2 soulstones even before they activate. With a 20" move they can usually stay in range.

I think things that can Obey with Soulstone power are very dangerous, like Perdita, Obeying them to Dance Apart (preventing them from dancing together that turn) then shooting the crap out of one of them.

What about others?

[LoboStele]

Good stuff so far.

I did mean the Duet, as the individuals are much easier to deal with, I rarely split them up for that reason, unless I have a need to do so.

For losing the initiative I keep Mechanical Doves around for the soulstone flips before the Coryphee have activated. That way I still have acces to 1-2 soulstones even before they activate. With a 20" move they can usually stay in range.

I think things that can Obey with Soulstone power are very dangerous, like Perdita, Obeying them to Dance Apart (preventing them from dancing together that turn) then shooting the crap out of one of them.

What about others?

Um....pretty sure they can't use Obey to force you to Dance Apart. Obey typically says that the model cannot be killed or sacrificed as a part of the action, doesn't it?

At any rate, Obey can still be frustrating, as they can make the Coryphees Walk away from the Doves or other things like that. And yes, if you can keep Doves nearby, that helps. But for instance, a smart Viktoria or Perdita player will kill the Dove(s) first, then plaster the Coryphees.

[Buhallin]

I've been playing Rezzers a lot lately, and they've got a number of good options for dealing with them. Seamus and his girls especially - Luring is incredibly effective against such a fast model, and Undead Psychosis may not shut them down completely the way it does some, but it does make their life difficult. Shikome targeting their Wp instead of Df, Hanged stopping their healing and making their Wp even more vulnerable... Enough potential there that it's not a single choice for dealing with them.

[Jonas Albrecht]

As evidences, Masters tend to have little trouble dispatching a Coryphee. I play against them just about every week, and I've come to believe that they are minion killers only.

Plus, being so expensive and fragile, few players are willing to risk them for anything more than objective completion.

But I also use Perdita, so killing them hasn't really been an issue...

[LoboStele]

As evidences, Masters tend to have little trouble dispatching a Coryphee. I play against them just about every week, and I've come to believe that they are minion killers only.

Plus, being so expensive and fragile, few players are willing to risk them for anything more than objective completion.

But I also use Perdita, so killing them hasn't really been an issue...

LOL that's funny. Because one of our main Perdita players in the fall league never even came close to beating my Colette crew. Bulletproof, the , and Use Soulstone was just WAY too strong for him to tackle. Sure, Perdita and Nino would hammer it from time to time, but with the long range, Nino was usually the first to die, and Perdita usually didn't last long 1-on-1 with Colette (thank you Magician's Duel).

[Jonas Albrecht]

Really? Is he playing Perdita + Random Guild stuff, or did he make an Ortega crew?

[Mentat_Canis]

The easiest way to kill it is if you get activation first target it because it is much worse before it gets use soulstone. It is only 8 wounds so if it is ever near a performer or Manniquen shoot that with a blast I mean it can mitigate but every damage point matters. Most Melee masters can murder them, black blood really hurts, so do shatter.

They are great for 14 points and to get objectives accomplished they really are the best but they are very survivable and has decent damage for the 14ss. Worst thing to do to them is shot them with Seamus because he makes them insignificant.

Side note about the crew in general is that if you are running Cassandra and the Duet, colette tends to be a ss machine and less front line, Not that, that is bad but it is different.

[LoboStele]

Really? Is he playing Perdita + Random Guild stuff, or did he make an Ortega crew?

Ortega crew, but in his defense, we were all somewhat new to the game, and he was trying out a few different things from time to time (like mixing in a Peacekeeper or Executioner). I learned very fast to make sure my whole crew engaged his various pieces all at the same time, so he wouldn't have the option to focus fire on one model with Companion.

That, and I probably had lucky Init flips, lol. When you've got two crews that can Alpha strike their whole crew at once....yeah, pretty much whoever is the luckiest on their initiative flip in the 'key' turn.

[Jonas Albrecht]

Sure, Alpha Strikes are nice and all, but the Ortegas real talent is being able to set up kill zones, which are now even better due to the change to how Companion can be chained.

If you can get Perdita to herd a CoryDee into an overlapping field of fire with Nino and Santiago, it will not survive.

[emissary]

If you are playing Zoraida, if you can bring a Coryphee into range via obey and then hex off the (0) Use Soulstone on one Coryphee, it will also remove it from the duet when summoned and if the duet later splits, it will remove it from both Coryphees. If you just cast it on the duet, then if it splits both singles lose it too. Really helps.

The same goes for Bewitch and remember that Bewitch will stay on the Coryphee or Coryphee duet while it is buried and the other form is out (but whichever form is in play at the end of the turn will have Bewitch fall off in the closing phase). Just remember that the other form (duet or singles) will only get Bewitch if it changes forms the same turn after Bewitch is successfully cast. Then when that form is unburied in a later turn, it will still have Bewitch on it for that later turn but the model(s) getting buried will not have it.

Edited April 5, 2011 by emissary

[Ratty]

Hitting them with a Hanged's Whisper from Beyond is really effective, halves their wounds and stops them using their (0) heal or soulstones to heal.

[dancater]

I tell you guys regardless of whether this helps others in playing the Corphyees I am loving this post as a side tactica for what I should be wary of when I field the Fashionator Duo.

I was thinking at 14ss for the pair in any game smaller than 35 they would be to rich, the more I read the more I realise I am both right and wrong. Essentially only the Masters seem to have the solid kill percentages and techniques unless I really head butt the gaming table: however if I let a master get a good drop; or do mess up; or get them trapped - gone is a massive chunk of points, intimidation (never to be underestimated) and strike power gone.

They are the poison chalice, massively expensive and deservedly deadly but it strikes me that the primary problem the opponents of this posts thread have is the intimidation factor. They have hit the table danced a whirlwind of death while gracefully avoiding harm and now their opponents virtually throw up the cards in defeat when they see them across the board. It's not how to beat them I think but more if you have already decided that they have beaten you.

Am I wrong?

Edited April 5, 2011 by dancater

[LoboStele]

It's not how to beat them I think but more if you have already decided that they have beaten you.

Am I wrong?

Precisely. Psychological warfare is a powerful tactic, in real wars or the table-top variety.

[Kharnac]

Panda + Collodi (sp?) = you've lost one Coryphee before you've even activated a model. good game.

[Wodschow]

Panda + Collodi (sp?) = you've lost one Coryphee before you've even activated a model. good game.

Care to elaborate a bit on this one?

[remy lebeu]

Recently tried them with my ramos crew and the brass arachnid giving them reacivate makes them just to powerful to deal with unless you knew going into the match what you were up against. dita and her pals shot them pretty good but didn't take them down thanks to a linked maniquin using mirrors then they got to heal twice from their normal and extra activation. every faction seems to have something like this where if you dont hire expecting them you're done.

[Kharnac]

Care to elaborate a bit on this one?

I'll elaborate more fully at such a time when a rulebook is present in front of me, however, the basic form is thus;

Collodi and a large complement of his boys (a large number of stones in terms of cost, twenty something i believe, but completely worth it for the sheer 'I win the damn game' factor) Activate on turn one, and using their stupendous amount of flexible movement (more than an entire boards worth by far) walk up to whatever model they damn well please and then decimate it with an almost equally stupendous amount of attacks (that gets more stupendous the less movement is involved). After this, dependant on the exact circumstance, they can leave their opponents threat range, or remain there, in a very hard-to-kill way. (again, will elaborate with actual abilities and such when possible)

Panda isn't even necessary for that part, she simply makes it more than likely that you will attain initiative on turn one by putting your opponent on minus flips. (This may have something to do with the doppleganger, but i may also be making that link up - refer to rulebook, all i know is the neverborn guys i play against regularly play lists that include collodi and his boys + panda + doppleganger + stuff).

In my locality at least, we were all expecting to see Collodi smashed through the floor with the cuddle-bat, and I for one am nothing but extremely vexed as to why this has not occurred.