Does a studio paint job enhance a miniature or scare away a customer?

[Nathan Caroland]

So the debate has been held before on whether or not a studio paint job enchances the look and appeal of a miniature or whether or not it scares off a potential customer, either in that they won't purchase the miniature or once purchased, don't paint it due to there being an excellent example of it already out there.

Not surprisingly, I'm of the thought that a well painted and presented miniature will bring interest to a miniature and hopefully help sales.

That being said, I've had it said to me more than once, from several directions, and even in offhand remarks, that well done studio work freaks some customers.

Thoughts and comments? I'm curious on this for obvious reasons. Not that I'm going to fire off the painters any time soon .. if I could clone them I would.

[Hinton]

Short answer (for me): Yes, it enchances the miniature. I would prefer to see a well-painted and properly presented miniature.

[supervike]

It is a interesting dilemma. I have to admit, when I see a gorgeously painted studio miniature it does make me want to buy it...but on the other hand, I am not necessarily inspired to paint it. I think intimidation is a bit of a factor there.

I remember hearing about how GW would 'dummy' down some of their 'Eavy Metal paint jobs for just that reason. I don't know if they really did or not, but I agree there may be something to that logic.

Wyrd, however, is a different animal. IMHO, It caters to more premier mini fans. One that usually consists of artist that aren't just picking up a brush for the first time.

I don't know if anyone is 'scared away' from buying....possibly, but I doubt it. Scared away from painting....ah yeah.

Speaking from personal experience...I usually shy away from miniatures that have been painted alot, or in many of the Wyrd minis, painting amazingly. I suppose as an 'artist', my ego needs the occasional boost...and that probably isn't going to come if I paint cheap knockoffs of well known paintjobs. So to 'stick out' I find myself painting minis no one has seen painted versions of, or very few painted versions.

I'd never NOT want to see the gorgeous Wyrd paintjobs. It's become a trademark of the company.

[Stupidcow]

I feel a good studio paintjob works more towards making someone wanna buy it then freaking them away. It's rather how complicated and detailed the sculpt is that deters I feel.

[EricJ]

Look at the recent PP mini release, not horrible sculpts, but the paint jobs are simply awful, and from the responses I've seen, it doesn't look like a whole lot of those will be flying off the shelf...

[green stuff]

Eye candy is important IMHO. Wyrd has an open universe that doesn't force customers to paint the mini in such and such way (as opposed to let's say more "codex" ranges). The paint jobs are here to highlight the cool details. Have you ever compared sales where the mini was presented just with a green, primed, or fully painted? (BtW I'm not asking you to publish that sort of results ).

[cdukino]

For me a good paintjob definatly peaks my intrest and makes the mini stand out better. It doesn't shy me away from painting it, even if there are a lot nice paintjobs of a certain mini. Though it might delay painting as I do wnt to try and do something new/different from the excisting paintjob (usually that is, sometimes logic prevents it or the colour scheme is just to good).

The other way round though. A crappy paintjob on a good miniature sculpt hides the sculpt up to such an exten I might not dare buy it as I don't have a good view on the mini itself then. Unless I know of a picture of the cast or green, which makes me able to see through the paintjob then.

Preferable a picture of the cast/green combined with a picture of the cast/green (or shown earlier in some shape or form, doesn't need to be presented side by side)

second best, a good paintjob

thirth best, a good picture of green/cast (cast dipped)

last crappy paintjob... hurting sooner then helping depending on how readable the sculpt still is

[r2-j1]

Look at the recent PP mini release, not horrible sculpts, but the paint jobs are simply awful, and from the responses I've seen, it doesn't look like a whole lot of those will be flying off the shelf...

Well some of the new sculpts are just not good, paint or no paint. But the PP studio is definitely starting to show what a big loss Fluffy was. Thats not to say they don't still have some pretty good painters, but none close to her caliber.

On the issue at hand I love to see lights out paint jobs on stuff. I think in the end it only brings eyes to a product and will improve sales. I'm sure there might be a few who it freaks out. But for every one it scare it probably will impresses, inspires, or draws in 50 others.

I can say flat out some of the Wyrd paint jobs have caused me to buy minis I probably wouldn't have gotten otherwise. I have a few that I doubt I'll ever get around to because once I got them I realized they just weren't quite my style of mini.

[callumrice]

Eric makes the best point. You have 2 options, paint your studio minis with the potential of scaring a small margin of people away or paint them like some of reapers pre painted stuff and get slated on forums like this and probably experience a downturn in sales!

Keep them studio painted, we all have to aspire to something!

Everyone fancies themselves as being the next big painter, I certainly do, but know that we have many levels yet to get to the stage some of your studio painting is at. For me, it gives me something to look up to and I buy minis to try (unsuccessfully, but I do try!) to better the already great paint job. Keep the studio!!

(Sack Eric though, hes lazy.) :laugh:

[DrEvilmonki]

I am another who prefers display figures painted to display level. In fact I would say with the sheer amount of figures available in the hobby having paint jobs that stand out are vital. Yes some will be turned off but unpainted stuff just doesn't even register with me unless it is an absolute gem.

[Ritual]

I'd say the impact a nice looking paintjob have on the mass of people with a general interest in minis, but who are not actually looking for a particular mini to buy, is enormous. An unpainted, or badly painted, miniature will most likely be overlooked by this group of people, or at least the majority of them.

For a small company that may not have a large fanbase yet it is important to be viewed as a professional company to become well known in the general mini community. Good looking sculpts are of course the most important thing in this respect, but the studio paintjobs (or at least SOME way of getting good looking painted minis "out there") is also important. A company like Hasslefree, who don't have any studio painters per se (allthough they do have some painters who may or may not paint the new releases) still can be fairly sure that shortly after release of new minis there will be really high quality paintjobs out there with painters like Ali McVey, Cyril Abati, Mathieu Lalain etc. among their fans.

I'd say that the loss coming from people who are put off by professional paintjobs or would prefer seeing an unpainted version for some reason is neglectable compared to the gain coming from people who are inspired by the paintjobs or even discover the company through seeing the paintjobs.

[Malebolgia]

I love seeing excellent paintjobs. It shows how bloody great the miniatures are. What I do prefer with a miniatures release is a picture with Anders' paintjob and a picture with the inked metal sculpt (like Hasslefree does). I absolutely love what Anders does with a brush, but sometimes seeing an inked model helps me see the sculpt itself better. But that's just a personal preference.

[Coneman]

Painted or unpainted doesnt really bother me, if I like the sculpt I will buy it, but it is nice to be able to see both.

Good size pictures is all I ask for so I can see the sculpt.

Maybe set up a raw metal gallery and provide a link to the picture on the shop pages for those that want to see the raw product.

[Thryth]

Obviously, the choice is to go with a not horrible, but not great painter. Someone like, oh, I don't know... me!

Seriously though, I can't pretend to speak for anyone, so my ranting here is just my current feeling. A badly painted miniature is going to steer me away these days (back in the day not so much, but that is why I have some much lead that I have no interest in painting now). If the company's painted version of the miniatures looks less than great, I wouldn't expect mine to turn-out great.

I want a miniature with sufficiently sculpted detail that I have a chance of turning-out a decent looking miniature. I don't want to attempt to freehand that.

On the other hand, if there are a few really great painted versions of the miniature out there, I would be less inclined to use it for a contest. I don't want to be compared to Ana/Anders/Cindy/EricJ/etc. (EDIT: just for clarification: since they are so ridiculously much better at this than I am)

Just my ranting. Maybe I'll change my mind tomorrow.

[goblyn13]

A well painted mini should flesh out all the small not-so noticeable details that may arise on a miniature that may not appear on a an inked model. And while it can be appreciated to see a bare sculpt, a studio paint job can bring the miniature to life. While many folks may appreciate being able to see the bare metal. A good studio paint job can be the clincher that help someone sitting on the fence to decide whether to buy the particular mini or not.

[Jabberwocky]

I'd agree with the majority of folks here--a good studio paint job piques my interest. A badly done paint job can make a good sculpt average in my eye, and a average sculpt bad. For me, it the sculpt that sells the mini; a good (or great in the case of the Wyrd minis) paint job only enhances the product. I suppose for the very high end painters, one may or may not want to be compared to Eric or Anders. I would actually find it an honor to be considered with such distinguished company!

[Duende]

I'm also of the camp who'd rather see a quality paint-job in the store rather than a bare, green or inked metal mini. Worst is bad paintjobs that detract from a mini rather than highlight it's quatlites. Case in point is Fenryll minis; many of thier sculpts are hit-and-miss, but their mechandise isn't helped by the really bad paintjobs on thier site (granted the newer stuff has better jobs, but the older stuff.... urgh). I have a few of their minis and I'm more often than not surprised how the unpainted mini looks so much better than what I saw on the screen.

Although my favorite method of presentation is Freebooter's, showing a great paintjob from various angles, a bare shot, and a shot of the mini in its pieces, how it looks when it arrives in the blister. Best of both worlds that way.

Just my 2¢!

[Nathan Caroland]

Believe me, never going to get rid of the studio painters, again, if I could clone them and do nothing more than ignore human rights and chain them in a well lit basement with nothing to do but paint, I would.

I was, and still am, interested in the point of views from folks as we have been doing this coming up on two years (actually, over two years, but I didn't start sales until December so I'll make that two years) and it has been a reoccurring discussion with some folks and then I come across someone like Jim above there who enjoys them, but is perhaps a touch intimidated by them and that once again gets my curiosity going about the subject.

Inked metal - bleah - I just don't like it and something I can't say will ever happy on or with Wyrd. Primed versions I can handle (and we have some of that in our stores, such as the Samurai Punks, and green versions as well I can do, such as Misaki, but the inking doesn't do anything for me.

From what I gather from some of ya'll though, you would like to see the painted versions as well as the greens, right? So something like this?

[Duende]

Just wanted to add, many times if a studio painted version "intimidates" me, I just do a search for more on CMON, esp as the more popular minis usually have a whole range of different painter's versions, so I can see other really great paintjobs, along with ones that I can look at and say, "I can do better than that." (Bad me, picking on other anonymous painters)

Which is why I really hate it when people don't title their minis there and just leave it at the default "Another Mini"! How am I supposed to find it in a search if they're not going to use the keywords! :mad: But that's another rant entirely.

[EricJ]

There was one piece which I did that seemed to scare people off, not sure if it was because of me, or because of the sculpt, but I swear it was 6+ months before another painted version of her showed up on CMON.

Female Cyborg

But then also my ramos got a lot of attention when I painted him, and dozens of him showed up rather quickly once released. So I can't really say! Is basically what I'm saying

[SteveB]

The paintjob on a studio mini can have a great effect on sales. A case in point: My 54mm Anastasia: The Bride. My original studio paintjob was quite weird with grey/purple skin and a green dress. She launched to fairly dead sales. Few weeks later someone posted one on cmon in a normal skintone and a black dress and sales immediately surged. Learned a lesson there. Studio paintjobs shouldn't be too off the beaten track with colour choice (I reckon Wyrd with it's subject matter, may do better than most in this respect).

I do feel a nice paintjob will sell more minis though.

I think the best way to show an unpainted mini is primed grey.

like that. Looks less messy than inked metal. And shows the detail if photographed right.

[EricJ]

I nearly forgot a story from last year at Gencon. We had just released the 3 sets of 3 catacomb crawlers and the night before I had painted up the ghosts to go in the case. The first day at Gencon we sold a ton of ghosts and none of the imps or zombies. So I painted up an imp, and sure enough, the next day we start selling imps. Finally Saturday we got a Zombie done, and sure enough the zombies started selling. It was pretty amazing really watching it happen.

Steve, I love that sculpt.

[tallghost]

I agree with SteveB that if you go unpainted, a nice grey primer really shows off the mini.

EricJ: The reason your sales went up was because I was running aound the dealer hall screaming "Look at these cool ghosts I got at the Wyrd Minis/Crunch Waffle booth! they have the coolest stuff!"

To be honest, the one thing that intimidates me about buying Wyrd minis, is not being sure what to do with the characters. They are very cool sculpts, and the personalities are vibrant and really show through inthe mini, but I'm just not sure what to do with them. Approaching the hobby as a gamer who is getting into painting, it is easier for me to assess a generic troop type and decided how I can make it fit my style, than it is to see such an obviously cool pre-made character and say "how can I tweek that?"

This, again, is one of my weird hang ups (like my issues with basing) and it is coming from the gamer side of the hobby, and Wyrd seems to be more into the painter side of things, but it is input none the less.

[Nathan Caroland]

No I like hearing this as well as frankly, I don't think many gamers pick up our stuff outside of folks using them for proxies for Privateer Press, Games Workshop or in the case of our Steampunk Spiders, a ton have sold to 15mm gamers.

That being said, hopefully that'll change next year if all goes well and the skirmish game comes into being. Till then, we'll just have to settle for having neat stuff.

[vincegamer]

Here's my heirarchy:

Good paint job

Unpainted

Bad paint job.

I'm a bit odd, as you know, but I am more interested in a well painted mini, mainly because it shows me where the details are, but it also makes me think "how can I do it differently."