Math Mathonwy

Aye, "When this model is deployed, choose another non-Peon model." (bolding mine). I suppose you could swap one Bokor for a Bushwhacker and make her Magical. Or try and fit in Trixie with her Upgrade and make her Magical.

You should try him with Reva, Tara, and Yan Lo at least as well. I was down on the guy at first but I've been shown the error of my ways. I guess time will tell.

I think that it's very easy to argue that Gremlins are the faction who offer the least amount of support/synergy for McTavish. Other Factions have several ways of buffing him better and have better Upgrades for him to take. On Burt I agree with you (he has access to a ton of support in Gremlins). Dead is pretty boss, actually. I except that we'll start seeing him quite a lot.

So what are your thoughts on Bunraku now they are 5SS? They look quite nice, I think. Good stats (Wk 6 is nice), Armor and a baked-in Trigger for Df that isn't bad, a useful (0)Action and a nice Push to pop Pounce and such (I find that I often have few things that can activate the Changeling Surprise when Emissary Summons them). And naturally all the Puppet synergy. It looks like a nice package. How many should be used? Just one for spice? Or would it be overkill to take three?

I, too, have had good experiences with Gupps. The important thing to realize about them is that you don't need to Leap with them all the time. Consider what you're trying to do and Leap when you need to. I've used Spawn Mother quite a bit with Zoraida (as she really likes having two Wisps around and the other Wisp can help Mother) and she's been fine. Not spectacular because she doesn't do much damage or survive much of anything but she's a big presence and the Charge is a good deterrent. She basically acts as a counter punch when needed. The Gupps are the real deal there. That said, she is far from an autoinclude.

I disagree. I don't think that Gremlins ever were all that super random. Random is a spice for them in the form of some mandatory triggers and such but things like Dumb Luck or Pigs and Roosters Charging around aren't really random as such as they can be controlled and the risks can be mitigated. Or the opponent can outwit you and you end up paying but that's the way it goes. I don't think that it is random per se.

I think that both, Stuffed Piglets and Bayou Gremlins should be comparable to Guild Guard in that all are 3SS. I think that's a very unfair reading of what edopersichetti wrote. Doppelganger is pretty bonkers and could easily have had her cost raised to 8SS. I don't think that there would be any more complaints about that than about anyone else whose cost was raised. So edo's point was that maybe people should be more vocal about such things. Now, personally, I do agree with edo in the sense that loudness shapes at the very least the public opinion and that probably does have an effect. I mean, of course people should be honest in their criticisms, but I don't think that edo was suggesting dishonesty and shouting stuff down in order to get an advantage from it as a faction as you seem to have read from it. I dunno, the whole idea that someone would honestly think that seems rather bizarre. Which was rather needed yes. But it's a bit different from McTavish's price increase, I think. Nurse, Yasunori, and Terracotta Warrior are better comparisons. "Ruin Mercenary Mechanics" is maybe going a bit far, don't you think? I mean, he did merely suggest raising the Merc tax by one for two models. Some models in fact had this rule in the first edition. It is a valid point that it wouldn't help with the Nellie problem.

Yeah, it's a shame about Teddy. Especially as it's such a super iconic model for Malifaux and Wyrd. Kade got a stone cheaper, I guess Does Vasilisa have any game without her Upgrade?

@zFiendonce slapped Dreamer to death on turn one

She used to be sort of a discount bin version of Collodi but these days she has her own thing. Compared to Collodi you can run a far more elite crew and don't need to focus on Minions (or Puppets!) so that makes a huge difference and Wisps doing Voodoo Doll stuff and her Obeying the enemy models to Charge one another is very powerful nowadays. She also likes Pigs so it's worth considering, I think.

Mah can have various lists. Usually you want some melee Gremlins and after that you can take whatever, basically. She buffs a bit and beats face nicely but her main strengths are being a massive distraction (traps and her giant melee range can annoy immensely), being insanely mobile trouble shooter, Pushing your models around, and pruning your hand.

I am? Holy crap! Thanks, dude! nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf Whooohoo!

I agree that it really should be "friendly non-Leader Puppet models". It would be a big n€rf but she would still be really good.

Mah is a fine possibility I think. She can make good use of Survivors and the Mech Pork, she likes other Pigs well enough, and she loves the Criers. She is also extremely different from Ulix. And Trixie rocks. The only strike against her is that three Bushwhackers is a ridiculous amount (but then again, so is three Iron Skeeters). Wong is also a good choice as he can work with anything, basically. And Lightning Bugs are great and can even heal a bit. Swine-cursed are amazing with Wong but they can be used with Mah and even with Ulix. So yeah, based on what you wrote, I'd suggest (not in any specific order): Mah Wong Criers Mech Pork Survivors Sparks/Swine-Cursed/Slop Haulers/The Sow

I wouldn't put all that much stock in the doom-saying, personally. IME you can't say much about a given GG's meta until well into the spring. Give it three months at minimum. I think that @Dogmantra made an excellent point about how cheap models can claim an empty quarter just as well as expensive models. Outactivation given alpha strike is still probably valid and so on. Some people are painting this as an immediate giant shift into a very tiny pen but we shall see. Besides, unless you are super evenly matches skill-wise with your opponent, it's still most often the skill that decides how things turn out. Taking a somewhat "sub-optimal" list might also result in the opponent being ill-prepared for it. Finally, Schemes can make a huge difference. Cheap stuff does Schemes better than expensive stuff much of the time.

I think that those were very fair changes, agreed. It is maybe widely accepted but I'm not sure it's true. If we consider the first two books, Neverborn got the original Lucius and Collodi in the same book and Zoraida was already there. All three are control buff Masters but one was garbage, one wasn't very good and one was god-like. And if we consider the whole, TT has had things like the original Samurai and Oiran and Archers and Low River Monks and High River Monks and and and. And even after the somewhat massive buffs only LRMs are commonly seen. And then they now have Yasunori and Terracotta Warrior and Emissary and so on. Or howabout Guild? Lady Justice is one of the most iconic Masters in the game and she finally became sorta competitive in Wave 5! Original Lucius and McCabe came in the same book. There's Lawyers and Guild Guard and Governor's Proxy and so on and so forth along with Franc and the pre-nerf Loco-Box-Sonnia. Or Book 1 Outcasts. If you check what were in Book 1 and what was in Book 2 - sheesh! You can list with fingers from one hand the non-errataed Outcast models from book 1 that were being used. I really have no idea why Gremlins were somehow labeled as the least internally balanced faction. Probably because of the sudden uproar of cries of n€rf on our better stuff while the furor against other factions' OP stuff was more muted. Personally I blame all the quietly accepted narrative as the Gremlins as the punching bags and not a real faction and so on and then when they climbed to the lofty heights of being the fifth winningest faction in GG17 all hell broke loose and they were seen as crazy OP.

They still have their uses. They are excellent disruption pieces that you can land to deny important Charges or mess up with ranged models or certain types of Scheme runners and such. They are far from bad!

They really should've dropped the cost of Bag o Tools by a single SS while they were at it.

This kinda got me thinking. Eternal Fiend used to be a 20% price increase over the base cost while now it's a 29% price increase. I wonder whether it would make sense to take a naked Bad Juju these days under some circumstances?

I'm not sure I would take Wickeds even at 3SS so there it's a bit of a wash, I think.

We shall see. I like how you constantly hammer home absolute truths about what good players do, though

But I can kill four hounds way, way easier.

I think that the errata is great for the most part. One thing I'm really worried about is Guild Guard at 3SS. The -1 changes are greater the smaller the starting point and Guild Guard are very durable and very spammable due to how they can do all sorts of things. Not very well as such but weight of numbers is a thing. Desperate Mercs are slightly less worrisome due to them being far less durable but I'm a bit worried about that as well. Gremlins used to be the only Faction with good 3SS Significant Minions so this was a big blow against them. I doubt that we'll start seeing 10 Guard lists but four seems very likely to pad the numbers. All in all Guild seems to be going full speed to crazy town with them being arguably the biggest winners of the new book as well. As for the Gremlin changes, I do like all of them with one exception. Raphael LaCroix going to 6SS is just bonkers. The only thing "wrong" with him was that Francois and Burt outshone him at the 7SS bracket. Dropping him to 6SS makes him very close to an autotake. Won't break the game as he can't be spammed (like some others!) but seems really weird. Moon Shinobi are a bit weird but I really wouldn't want them to have Drunk & Reckless as they already die too easy and with that they would die to a stiff breeze. 5SS makes them interesting, though. Survivors become very interesting at four SS. Along with Mech Pork and Golem getting cheaper this might also make Sparks a more common sight. Bushwhackers are still a bit lackluster but they don't feel like you're completely shooting yourself in the leg with them. Might be interesting to test with the new Mah. Golem is good now. A competitive choice. Mancha is still a bit sad. His main problem is that he needs a ton of high cards and often at specific suits to really function. I think that -2SS would've been better and wouldn't have made him an autotake or anything. Wild Boars are cool now. Burt, McTavish, Francois - all needed and all are fair. McTavish is the only one I'm sad about because he was really at this best outside of Gremlins. But I expect to still see him so whatever. Zoraida is a bit sad at McTavish and Nurses, though, and I'm not sure that she needed the hit. But yeah, a huge errata with only one change that I'm seriously very worried about and then maybe half a dozen cases where I would've done things different. That's a very good showing, I think. Well done, people responsible!

I'd like if Teddy got a nice 0-cost Upgrade. Something that wouldn't outright outclass Retribution's Eye so something that didn't make him a better beater but rather did something clever. That way Summoning wouldn't be affected but he would become an interesting hire. Wicked Dolls are indeed quite bad but when I've been winning, I've sometimes summoned them up for a laugh. They can pile on quite some damage in a sorta weird roundabout way if they manage to survive. And the heal thing can be surprisingly useful. But the problem with both is that they are so ridiculously squishy.