How has balance been in M3E so far for you?

[ShinChan]

19 hours ago, Stonewall78 said:

I would be fine with playing on a table like that. Sure it could use a bit more but not much. Sometimes theme and setting are more important than having a perfect 1/3rd table of terrain.

 

I agree with that, but I always try to include at least 1-2 elements of severe terrain (at least the typical small forest), because in M3E, since pushes are affected by severe terrain, it became more important.

[Math Mathonwy]

It's also important to not go completely overboard with terrain. Ulix for example becomes completely unplayable if there's too much terrain as big-based Pigs with long Pushes and 0" reaches simply become impossible to properly maneuver. In M2e I once played a tournament game on a table that essentially made Pushes of over 3" for 50mm bases useless as there were no straight lines to Push through. Too much terrain can also make stuff like Ice Pillars insanely oppressive.

As for balance, I think that it's important to remember that M2e took a lot of errata to get where it was. For M3e the hilariously herculean task was to balance hundreds of profiles in one go. It being perfectly balanced would be a completely crazy miracle of design.

[trikk]

9 hours ago, Math Mathonwy said:

It's also important to not go completely overboard with terrain. Ulix for example becomes completely unplayable if there's too much terrain as big-based Pigs with long Pushes and 0" reaches simply become impossible to properly maneuver. In M2e I once played a tournament game on a table that essentially made Pushes of over 3" for 50mm bases useless as there were no straight lines to Push through. Too much terrain can also make stuff like Ice Pillars insanely oppressive.

As for balance, I think that it's important to remember that M2e took a lot of errata to get where it was. For M3e the hilariously herculean task was to balance hundreds of profiles in one go. It being perfectly balanced would be a completely crazy miracle of design.

Nobody cares about pigs! Spam the fences and walls! 😛

[CD1248]

9 hours ago, Math Mathonwy said:

It's also important to not go completely overboard with terrain. Ulix for example becomes completely unplayable if there's too much terrain as big-based Pigs with long Pushes and 0" reaches simply become impossible to properly maneuver. In M2e I once played a tournament game on a table that essentially made Pushes of over 3" for 50mm bases useless as there were no straight lines to Push through. Too much terrain can also make stuff like Ice Pillars insanely oppressive.

As for balance, I think that it's important to remember that M2e took a lot of errata to get where it was. For M3e the hilariously herculean task was to balance hundreds of profiles in one go. It being perfectly balanced would be a completely crazy miracle of design.

Stuff like this is why the rules deliberately put master selection after terrain definition. You see a table like that, bring in Zipp and laugh all the way to the bank.

It's the same way you see strat/scheme/deployment before selecting your master and crew, if you drop a traditional M&SU blob into Plant Explosives on Corner deployment you'll probably have an equally bad day as Ulix in a hedge maze.

[Math Mathonwy]

9 hours ago, CD1248 said:

Stuff like this is why the rules deliberately put master selection after terrain definition. You see a table like that, bring in Zipp and laugh all the way to the bank.

I'm not saying that you can never have a table that invalidates a Master (or does something else weird), I'm saying that if people are arguing that in order to have a balanced table you always need a ton more terrain than in the example that was given, then that invalidates entire Masters completely.

I also once played on a Terraclips city table against Kirai in M1e. Not balanced! 

[newsun]

Some second Masters and combinations are extremely strong. Kirai as second plus almost whoever. Zoiraida as second with dreamer is getting tons of models and replenishing hand along with Z handing out lots of actions via 2ap obeys.

 

Unsure if it's a problem with two Masters, those combos or other fixes such as ss cost in keyword.

[Starrius]

So from playing a lot of factions/masters 

 

Some masters seem to work a but better than others, that's always gonna happen but overal the balance is good.

 

There are a few models that problematic like the riders, I think they need looking at some keyword abilities I believe need shuttle changing as they can provide a negative play experience (this isn't  the tournament scene this is for casual) example of this is in my option abundant growth, making the terrain destrucable would allow players to deal with these,

Second masters, this isnt anything I've had experience with as the UK doesnt do second masters an tbh I dont agree with having a second master because their ss costs feels abaritary not actually costed correctly.