I'm returning to Malifaux and new to 3E. I was hoping for some advice to get me started with an ES master!?

[apes-ma]

Hi all. I played a LOT of M2E, but having a kid, then COVID, put a pretty hard stop to gaming. Now that the little one is a bit more grown up, and things are looking up as far as face to face gamin goes, I've decided to get back into Malifaux! I want to start a new faction, and looking at the models/art/fiction for Explorers Society, I think this is the faction for me.

The thing is, I haven't played any 3E yet, so it's hard for me to parse the new cards in the context of what they are meant to do in a game, how they might play out etc. I thought perhaps you guys might help me in choosing a master to start with?

I used to play Outcasts in 2E, my favourites being Parker, Jack Daw and Von Schill. I also enjoyed playing Leveticus post-nerf when the crew played a strong attrition game. With that in mind, do any of the ES master's play a game along similar lines? How can I think of the currently available master's in terms of 2E outcast touchstones?

Thanks for you help pals... I'm looking forward to finally choosing and getting some paint on some models!

 

 

[admiralvorkraft]

Jack Daw actually feels a lot like he used to, though the tricky movement and control is more distributed across the crew rather than focused on his card. It's not obvious reading it, but it feels familiar on the table. 

[Maniacal_cackle]

I didn't play 2E, but I imagine Parker and Von Schill were still shoot-y crews. Might be worth looking at Lord Cooper for how shoot-y he is?

[apes-ma]

6 hours ago, Maniacal_cackle said:

I didn't play 2E, but I imagine Parker and Von Schill were still shoot-y crews. Might be worth looking at Lord Cooper for how shoot-y he is?

Well, Parker's crew was very tricksy with scheme markers and manipulating enemies, with a minor theme of ranged combat. Von Schill was more like a durable jack of all trades, master of none crew, as opposed to a perdita-style shoot them off the table crew.

[Maniacal_cackle]

11 minutes ago, apes-ma said:

Well, Parker's crew was very tricksy with scheme markers and manipulating enemies, with a minor theme of ranged combat. Von Schill was more like a durable jack of all trades, master of none crew, as opposed to a perdita-style shoot them off the table crew.

Oh, maybe look at Anya, I think her crew is all schem-marker-y, and we have a full list of Syndicate now (though the Outcast syndicate aren't in the app, so you have to check the forums or waldo's weekly).

[apes-ma]

5 hours ago, Maniacal_cackle said:

Oh, maybe look at Anya, I think her crew is all schem-marker-y, and we have a full list of Syndicate now (though the Outcast syndicate aren't in the app, so you have to check the forums or waldo's weekly).

Sweet - I'll have a look! Also, are there any "necessary" boxes for ES (versatile models etc.) that are good across the faction and/or needed to make Anya's crew box up to 50SS? I've also taken a look at Lord Cooper - very cool! It seems like that guy just wants other keyword models to get up to 50SS, but less clear with Anya?

OoK hiring seems like something I should forget about for now for the sake of my wallet! Same re. English Ivan (since it seems like half his crew box and one of his keyword boxes seem like they want to start play off the table!)

[HomelessOne]

Odds are you want the Effigy/Emissary box.

[touchdown]

Based on my memories of m2e outcasts and your description, I think you would like McCabe quite a bit.

Unless you want that attrition game, in which case probably Jedza.

Anya looks really fun too but I don't have any experience with her.

[Mycellanious]

I think there is a good chance you would enjoy Jedza. She plays kind of like a combination of Parker and Leveticus. Her crew is based around healing in order to proc their Chronicle Abilities, which means they want to play as a bubble and get stuck in, though it is less of Levi's "grind them down," and more of a, "withstand incoming attack." Furthermore, the crew has a TON of Marker Shenanigans, including Scheme Markers. They are one of the best crews in the game at dropping Scheme Markers thanks to Jedza's Bonus Action, Leap, as well as Lamplighters. The super interesting thing about the crew however is that they have a subtheme of creating and manipulating various Terrain Markers, such as Lamp Markers, Geode Markers, Ice Pillars, etc. 

[apes-ma]

1 hour ago, Mycellanious said:

I think there is a good chance you would enjoy Jedza. She plays kind of like a combination of Parker and Leveticus. Her crew is based around healing in order to proc their Chronicle Abilities, which means they want to play as a bubble and get stuck in, though it is less of Levi's "grind them down," and more of a, "withstand incoming attack." Furthermore, the crew has a TON of Marker Shenanigans, including Scheme Markers. They are one of the best crews in the game at dropping Scheme Markers thanks to Jedza's Bonus Action, Leap, as well as Lamplighters. The super interesting thing about the crew however is that they have a subtheme of creating and manipulating various Terrain Markers, such as Lamp Markers, Geode Markers, Ice Pillars, etc. 

Thanks for the reply! This is making Jedza sound SUPER interesting! It looks like her keyword models aren't available until next month, but that gives me the chance to save up a bit of dosh for them (core box + austere and twigge + Here Lies to get started?)!

[Mycellanious]

14 minutes ago, apes-ma said:

Thanks for the reply! This is making Jedza sound SUPER interesting! It looks like her keyword models aren't available until next month, but that gives me the chance to save up a bit of dosh for them (core box + austere and twigge + Here Lies to get started?)!

You could always try them out on Vassal if you are interested! The Vassal scene has exploded over the past year due to Covid. Oh, also I don't know how closely you have been following M3E but there is a new, free app that is fantastic and lets you see all the cards (including Explorer's Society).

[Adran]

Welcome back

The core rules changes aren't too huge between the two editions, that you can't get a decent idea of what a M3 model does just looking with an M2 head. 

Most masters can be played in an attrition style if you want, depending on exactly how you view attriton.

In Explorers, Jedza is the healing master with a lot of effects keying off models healing (both sides) and control of attacks in an area (In combination with Mikhail and the Emissary). 

Cadmus has a semi-shared wound pool, so it takes a lot to remove the key components of the crew. The master also  gets 2 free obeys at the end of turn to do general actions with eitehr your crew, or opponents models that you have given parasite tokens too (which also allow you to sort of include them in your shared health when you want to). 

Syndicate bring in hazardous terrain to scheme markers, making it relatively easy to have the opponent keep damaging themselves just doing the things they need to do to win. 

DUA largely work on making everything happen on negative flips, and then using those negative flips as positive flips. 

EVS lets you manipulate your card values (each model gets to count 1 suit of cards as a 9 or better when it cheats them in), and also can make use of the cards in your opponents discard pile when they cheat. 

 

I'm not sure I could fit Wastrel, Frontier and Apex into some form of attritional game.

 

[apes-ma]

2 hours ago, Mycellanious said:

You could always try them out on Vassal if you are interested! The Vassal scene has exploded over the past year due to Covid. Oh, also I don't know how closely you have been following M3E but there is a new, free app that is fantastic and lets you see all the cards (including Explorer's Society).

I got the app! I've been browsing ES to get a feel for the different keywords, and Outcasts to see what my old crews do these days too. I actually downloaded vassal, but I'm running it on Linux and I have a hidpi display and I can't get Javas UI scaling to apply to the module that I load (despite it applying to the overall vassal program) so everything is unuseably tiny on the screen!

 

And thanks Adran! Both Jedza and the Syndicate sound very cool. So does cadmus, but a bit of a book-keeping nightmare?! And free obeys sounds VERY strong...

[Thatguy]

21 minutes ago, apes-ma said:

free obeys sounds VERY strong...

They are. There's a whole thread complaining about it. You should check it out. lol

 

[Adran]

2 hours ago, apes-ma said:

 

And thanks Adran! Both Jedza and the Syndicate sound very cool. So does cadmus, but a bit of a book-keeping nightmare?! And free obeys sounds VERY strong...

It's probably similar book keeping to M2e Hamlin, so high but not stupidly so. It's certainly a strong keyword, but I personally think not as strong as some claim.