Ressers go MARCHing on - vassal series.

[Maniacal_cackle]

The next series is up. What do people think? Very interesting sets of terrain.

Reckon the terrain is impactful enough to have different crews?

Map 1 has insane sightlines for Molly, so that's a consideration. Same with round 2, actually... We also have to be wary of getting shot to death on these maps. English Ivan seems super strong if we run up against him.

Map 3 - be sure to check out those crazy corridors. The water is IMPASSABLE. That means unless you're placing or incorporeal, you've got some really awkward progress channels. Tons of fog to cover our advance, though, so this feels like an incredibly strong map for us. Not to mention we can really abuse the movement pathways with our mobility. Valedictorian and Archie seem very strong here, so I imagine those are the sorts of crews we want here.

Map 4 I played against English Ivan previously. There are a LOT of good places to hide. Dead Rider is insane on this map due to unimpeded and hiding behind dense forests. EDIT: Actually Reva seems pretty good for similar reasons, but not sure the scheme pool favours her? Wish there was a catch and release xD

Thoughts?

P.S. Anyone mind that I've been doing these instead of RCTs? If people would like both, let me know and I'll put up a new topic.

[Graf]

32 minutes ago, Maniacal_cackle said:

Map 3 - be sure to check out those crazy corridors. The water is IMPASSABLE. That means unless you're placing or incorporeal, you've got some really awkward progress channels. Tons of fog to cover our advance, though, so this feels like an incredibly strong map for us. Not to mention we can really abuse the movement pathways with our mobility. Valedictorian and Archie seem very strong here, so I imagine those are the sorts of crews we want here.

P.S. Anyone mind that I've been doing these instead of RCTs? If people would like both, let me know and I'll put up a new topic.

To me, this map and pool looks like a wet (pun intended) dream for Daw. Limited corridors make is Mv debuffs even more effective, PE works for him and Claim Jump/Vendetta are usually good choices for him. 

 

Maybe switch a bit between both? I guess forum activity, which is rather low here in the tomb anyway, struggles even more with lockdown. So I can agree to RCT taking a longer break and focusing on online gaming for a bit, until we all can play IRL Malifaux again. 

[Graf]

What I wonder about in organized Vassal games... How many rounds are people expecting to play? I wouldn't say I'm a fast player and definititly slow on Vassal, 4-5h for a complete game I would say (with an at least equally slow opponent). This keeps me from playing with strangers atm, because I don't want to burden someone, who doesnt know that's coming for them, with that.

[Maniacal_cackle]

1 minute ago, Graf said:

What I wonder about in organized Vassal games... How many rounds are people expecting to play? I wouldn't say I'm a fast player and definititly slow on Vassal, 4-5h for a complete game I would say (with an at least equally slow opponent). This keeps me from playing with strangers atm, because I don't want to burden someone, who doesnt know that's coming for them, with that.

I generally expect to play 5 rounds, as I have gotten pretty fast with Vassal. Initially, it would have been much slower.

But the only way to speed it up is to get some practice in, and the series is great for that! I've seen other games ending on turn 3, since some people are a bit slower.  I think a lot of people are taking the series as an opportunity to get practice (both for Vassal and Malifaux generally), so I don't think it is a problem if you are doing the same. You could always ask in the Vassal thread as well.

I definitely suggest practicing your turn 1s on Vassal. Both because it will make you a faster Vassal player, and it really makes you think through the matchup beforehand. And you can do it by yourself!

Also learn your hotkeys!! This will make you a LOT faster, especially the aura hotkeys.

7 minutes ago, Graf said:

Maybe switch a bit between both? I guess forum activity, which is rather low here in the tomb anyway, struggles even more with lockdown. So I can agree to RCT taking a longer break and focusing on online gaming for a bit, until we all can play IRL Malifaux again. 

Great points, I'll probably do another one at some point, but glad to hear the long break is okay.

8 minutes ago, Graf said:

To me, this map and pool looks like a wet (pun intended) dream for Daw. Limited corridors make is Mv debuffs even more effective, PE works for him and Claim Jump/Vendetta are usually good choices for him. 

I really want to see more Daw matchups/videos, as he often comes up as a good choice into these pools!

[Alcathous]

1 hour ago, Graf said:

What I wonder about in organized Vassal games... How many rounds are people expecting to play? I wouldn't say I'm a fast player and definititly slow on Vassal, 4-5h for a complete game I would say (with an at least equally slow opponent). This keeps me from playing with strangers atm, because I don't want to burden someone, who doesnt know that's coming for them, with that.

The World Series events are running on a 3-hour time limit and most games are getting through 5 rounds.

As Cackle said above, practice is the only way to improve. There are plenty of folks who would be happy to play a longer game with you if you're looking to get faster in the digital space. Running through some T1s on your own is also a great way to get the hang of movement and shortcuts.

Once people have the hang of it, Vassal doesn't take much longer than a normal game. I think 2.5-3 hours is a reasonable goal, but it probably took me 20+ vassal games to reach that point.

[Stumpyfjord]

These have been enjoyable as they are grounded in specifics. You do good work for these forums.

Around timing, I’ve played both 5 hour games 3 hour games with people on Vassal. If you’re (fairly, kindly) concerned about being considerate of other players, I’d recommend starting in the Vassal LFG Discord channel and set the expectation that you’re new to vassal, might play a little slow. Let your opponents self-select and decide if they have time for a longer game. 
 

Most of the community is wonderful, despite recent shenaniganary, and more than willing to help.

[Stumpyfjord]

I played Round 1 the other day. Coming out of it, the scenario felt like it demanded a lot of AP. Most lists I’ve seen feature one or two dedicated symbol/breakthrough/sabotage scorers.
 

A lot of the game will likely turn on being able to eliminate these early and keep yours alive. If you get your opponent’s, they likely can pivot their models into the needed roles but will lose a lot of efficiency in doing so.

[Maniacal_cackle]

5 hours ago, Stumpyfjord said:

I played Round 1 the other day. Coming out of it, the scenario felt like it demanded a lot of AP. Most lists I’ve seen feature one or two dedicated symbol/breakthrough/sabotage scorers.
 

A lot of the game will likely turn on being able to eliminate these early and keep yours alive. If you get your opponent’s, they likely can pivot their models into the needed roles but will lose a lot of efficiency in doing so.

Interesting! Thanks to claim jump, you can also stack all the symbols near the centre on your side of the board and just camp the centre all game/defend your markers (if not against Don't Mind Me).

Yan Lo looks fantastic for it here, or any Toshiro variant.

[Stumpyfjord]

I don’t think I’ve ever played against anyone or tried to stack all 4 in the center 1/3 of the table. I’ve played a 3 and 1 split to protect a side which is pretty similar.

Toshiro and his bevy of 2” engagement buddies can’t help but make that strategy better.

[Maniacal_cackle]

5 minutes ago, Stumpyfjord said:

I don’t think I’ve ever hit anyone or tried to stack all 5 in the center 1/3. I’ve played 3 and 1 to protect a side which is pretty similar.

Toshiro and his bevy of 2” engagement buddies can’t help but make that strategy better.

Yeah, just don't use Toshiro into Don't Mind Me. Ends up working realllly poorly xD

[Maniacal_cackle]

I thought it might be easier for discussion (and for those who aren't participating in the actual tournament) if I post round details here. So here's round 1:

• Standard Symbols of Authority
  • Breakthrough
  • Sabotage
  • Assassinate
  • Research Mission
  • Claim Jump

For that map, worth noting how many bottlenecks there are for the left side of the map for getting out of and into that side of the map. I don't like the terrain for Reva, but the scheme pool seems brilliant for her. EDIT: But then I tried creating Molly lists for it and I was a lot happier, so guess that's the likely direction 😜

[Stumpyfjord]

News at 11: Maniacal Cackle loves Molly! (I think she’s probably good here as well.)

Yan Lo is probably a good play (more shocking news). Gokudo, Manos, Yin all good for the symbols/breakthrough. 

[Graf]

Hehe, I had the same thought. Reva propably is the only master where his comparative statement has any relevance 🤣.

 

The pool hardly puts any constrictions on crew selections. The amount of cluttered impassables definitly favors (elite) crews with high mobility, impassable ingoring and/or placement effects though. I can easily see Molly, Schtook, Yan Lo, Kirai and maybe even Daw here.

[Maniacal_cackle]

8 hours ago, Stumpyfjord said:

News at 11: Maniacal Cackle loves Molly! (I think she’s probably good here as well.)

Yan Lo is probably a good play (more shocking news). Gokudo, Manos, Yin all good for the symbols/breakthrough. 

I'm trying so hard to branch out and it never works 😭

Part of the issue is I prefer to play practice games in person, and only have assembled 3 crews (Molly, Reva, Seamus xD). Some of the vassal months I have fooled around with whatever, but I want three good placings, so will see xD

Maybe I should take next month easy and play new crews!

[Faceface]

I played Reva on this map before, it was a bit of a night mare! 

[Maniacal_cackle]

1 minute ago, Faceface said:

I played Reva on this map before, it was a bit of a night mare! 

 Love the pun xD

What was the problem, and what sorts of models did you use?

[Faceface]

4 minutes ago, Maniacal_cackle said:

 Love the pun xD

What was the problem, and what sorts of models did you use?

Tbf, it was fairly early on in learning Reva so I'd be better now. But Archie ended blocking the center, stuff got queued up behind him, and Emmisary didn't have great sight lines 

[Maniacal_cackle]

3 minutes ago, Faceface said:

Tbf, it was fairly early on in learning Reva so I'd be better now. But Archie ended blocking the center, stuff got queued up behind him, and Emmisary didn't have great sight lines 

Eek, yeah, that sounds brutal. I often run a lot of 50mm bases, so can imagine it getting very bogged down, especially if the opponent's models are in there as well.

[Graf]

5 hours ago, Maniacal_cackle said:

I'm trying so hard to branch out and it never works 😭

Yeah, it helps to dedicate yourself, no matter the pool and no matter results at tournaments. Personally I think learning a crew, playing tournaments and therefore really trying to win goes very well hand in hand. It's a tough but beneficial learning curve. Started playing Daw on a tournament. Got demolished first game, but first couple of games still got me 50% wins. 

But I know that approach is not everyones taste. Many prefer to learn without the extra pressure in casual games and that's fine. Some degree of dedication somewhere still is necessary though.

[Maniacal_cackle]

1 minute ago, Graf said:

Yeah, it helps to dedicate yourself, no matter the pool and no matter results at tournaments. Personally I think learning a crew, playing tournaments and therefore really trying to win goes very well hand in hand. It's a tough but beneficial learning curve. Started playing Daw on a tournament. Got demolished first game, but first couple of games still got me 50% wins. 

But I know that approach is not everyones taste. Many prefer to learn without the extra pressure in casual games and that's fine. Some degree of dedication somewhere still is necessary though.

Yeah, if I place 2-1-0 or better in three months, I'll definitely swap back to a more casual approach xD But not many opportunities to test my limits with Molly! I realised today I don't think I've lost a game with her in 16 months >.> (Granted I've probably only played 20-30 games with her in that time).

[Graf]

12 minutes ago, Maniacal_cackle said:

I realised today I don't think I've lost a game with her in 16 months >.> (Granted I've probably only played 20-30 games with her in that time).

Still sounds like it's time to write a Molly guide, wholey Maniacal flavour! 😉

[Maniacal_cackle]

Just now, Graf said:

Still sounds like it's time to write a Molly guide, wholey Maniacal flavour! 😉

I got through like 1/3 of it last night, so will see if I manage to finish it!

[Stumpyfjord]

9 hours ago, Maniacal_cackle said:

I got through like 1/3 of it last night, so will see if I manage to finish it!

Second third: Crooligans are the bees knees! The best in the west! The creepy undead child of the wild!

[belorey]

On 2/19/2021 at 9:09 PM, Maniacal_cackle said:

Map 3 - be sure to check out those crazy corridors. The water is IMPASSABLE. That means unless you're placing or incorporeal, you've got some really awkward progress channels.

The river is Severe no Impasable.

[SEV]

23 minutes ago, belorey said:

The river is Severe no Impasable.

Did they change the player pack again? Because it written as impassable for that map...