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Rosskov

Balanced Errata chat

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Alpha strikes used to be a risky option before, currently they are very easy to achieve with models having free focus/paired and atk value of 6 or 7. They no longer are chancy and cause tremendous damage if pulled off.

In retrospect, summoners are NPE as well and in a sense alpha strikers.

They create SS swings turn one without opponent interaction (raising the SS value of their crew)

So telling someone "its unfair for you to attack me turn 1 " is also saying "its unfair for you to summon models turn 1"

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Howard Langston reactivating and using imbued energies has been around since the sawn of m2e. Since wave 2 he could also get positives to his attacks from the 3ss toolkit and be promptrd by Colette three times.

The Vik slingshot has been around since wave 1 but the scion Vik sling is a worse.

The balancing factor seems to be activations as in not easily put-activating and not getting to chain into the actual strike.

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19 hours ago, PolishSausage said:

Nico is Df4 with a DF trigger on an upgrade I have never seen anyone take, arm2 from graveyard spirit is ignored.

Huh? Here Reaper Grin has been an autotake for Nico against Gremlins since book four.

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Just now, PolishSausage said:

Eat my Zip (lol)

 

I was honestly surprised that it isn't common in your part of the world. I can't remember the last time I've fielded Gremlins against Nico in these parts without him having Reaper Grin (since it so nicely curbs alpha strikes and since he really only has two must-take Upgrades).

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I agree its a must take, I just rarely see it on him as everyone "believes" they are safe.

Also our Nico player tends to shoot Kentaroi into your deployment on 2nd activation if he smells an alpha strike coming. (Asura is sooooo broken)

 

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I did an alpha kill on turn one... It was Pere with poorly handled explosives shot in the middle of the enemy crew by two (0) actions from ophelia, letting him possition himself and try to blow himself apart. With his last explosion he killed papa loco, a malifaux child, sonnia and francisco. It felt soooo depressing!! Once knowing the trick, I do not think I could ever do it again to the same player, nor would feel good by doing it, but I was scared about sonnia.

I play in a not very competitive meta, so we do not play the strongest combos all times, so my perception on models tends to be a bit naif. 

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The reason I suggested two cache adjustments at the beginning of this discussion was because they were minor tweaks to address to imbalances without nerfing a master into the ground.

 

I have always viewed the cache of a model as intended to balance them. More powerful masters or those who come with free henchmen have fewer than those which are weaker.  Models which can cross playstyles often have to buy upgrades which effectively reduces the number of available stones to build and fuel your crew (whether that is burning them for cards, suits or damage prevention). For example sandeep or somer taking upgrades to be able.to summon.

 

My understanding is that von schill relies on stones to survive and his play style is being in the thick of it.  He seems to be perceived as a weaker choice. If he is more survivable he should be better. 

 

If sandeep has fewer inbuilt resources then the player has to build accordingly.  This may be as straightforward as dropping a wind gamin or gambling that you will draw the suits you need etc. Sandeep is not unbeatable but he will generally be the first or second archanist pick for most strats or schemes in my local meta (and from what I have seen at tournaments). A tweak to his efficiency may help draw a distinction between whether he is first second or third choice for a match up.

 

 

 

 

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I don't have a massive issue with alpha strikes. It is pretty rare that you can do one in the first activation of a game (and of it is possible it should be easy to spot and deploy around).  They are a high risk strategy that works less against better opponents and becomes easier to play against when you get used to it. I often take an alpha strike option in my crews and use it for area denial through threat as much as anything else.

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4 hours ago, Rosskov said:

I don't have a massive issue with alpha strikes. It is pretty rare that you can do one in the first activation of a game (and of it is possible it should be easy to spot and deploy around).  They are a high risk strategy that works less against better opponents and becomes easier to play against when you get used to it. I often take an alpha strike option in my crews and use it for area denial through threat as much as anything else.

An alpha strike that happens on the second activation and has a threat range of 26" for a pretty easy 24 points of single target damage that goes through Armor and HtK is somewhat difficult to play around, though, even if you're good, and sort of twists the game in a weird way that I'm not a huge fan of.

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The fact Alpha Strikes exist is not a problem at all, I would even say it is good for the format (as combo mechanics are good in Mtg). Some Master mechanics are built around it, sisters, mc cabe, Ophelia ...
What is a problem for me is saying : "this master has to be alpha striked if you want to have any chance of winning the game".

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@bedjy McCabe? Are we talking TT and Yaz or every list? I pretty much never alpha'd with him when he was released in wave 2 so I have never considered alpha striking central to his design. Maybe I've been playing him wrong from the start.

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I mean, being able to launch a model through the whole table with +flip to lightning saber Actions, fast and reactivate. And kill a specific model

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As a guild player I've never managed to pull that off and I have still eon plenty of games with him so I don't think it is the only viable play style for him. It's definitely a strong option for him in TT. I've usually found it hard to keep the positives aura from promised on something if I charge it forward very far. McCabe only moves 14" if he is casting his reactivate. I guess TT cheat there as well with kamaitachi?

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9 minutes ago, Ludvig said:

I guess TT cheat there as well with kamaitachi?

Hey now! Watch the language, please 😄

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Could we get some rules Errata?

-Bury : "Buried models, may only be affected by the faction which caused the model to be buried", I feel that there are 2 kinds of burial in this game, the kind where a model is just meant to be temporarly out of the game/defensive (IE: Malifaux raptor, so it can move, Forgotten marshal, so it can be safe, dreamer so he can't act while LCB is in), and the other is offensive (IE: Tara/Lady Justice), and it seems to me that it would be better if they were separate, and doing this wouldn't hurt Tara and LJ's game, it would just prevent models like malifaux raptor to become useless because the enemy picked one of 2 masters.

-Summoning : "If a model is summoned, due to the model taking this action being killed or sacrificed, the summoned model does not count as being summoned", this would be added, so that models like fernidand vogel, would still be useful in ours, and henchman hardcore, and would apply to other models like, gremlin crier, forgotten marshal, gupps becoming silurids.

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As for actual model errata, this had been suggested before, but I would love to see desperate Mercs have an ability to pick a characteristic at the beginning of the first turn, and to keep it for the whole game.

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14 hours ago, wafew said:

-Summoning : "If a model is summoned, due to the model taking this action being killed or sacrificed, the summoned model does not count as being summoned", this would be added, so that models like fernidand vogel, would still be useful in ours, and henchman hardcore, and would apply to other models like, gremlin crier, forgotten marshal, gupps becoming silurids.

What does the summoning mess with in henchman hardcore? There was a discussion about this when summons wouldn't count for Ours, can't remember why it wasn't written into that strat.

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45 minutes ago, Ludvig said:

What does the summoning mess with in henchman hardcore? There was a discussion about this when summons wouldn't count for Ours, can't remember why it wasn't written into that strat.

You can't summon in hard-core, so you can never get the beast within. Summoned models don't count for Ours. 

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