jonahmaul Posted August 7, 2015 Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 I've not finished the Peacekeeper yet but he is in quite a few parts. Torso is four separate parts plus two armour plates. Then there is the jaw and the flamethrower attached to that along with separate waste and pelvis. Legs are in two parts each. That's as much as I've assembled so far but each arm is in a couple of bits. Lots of parts but as it's plastic once it's together it almost certainly isn't coming apart! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zFiend Posted August 7, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 Sounds a bit of a hassle once again. Anyway thanks for posting those pictures, could you post a scale picture next to a 30mm model as well? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonahmaul Posted August 7, 2015 Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 As soon as he's built I will do. Might not be until Sunday now though as busy couple of days Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zFiend Posted August 7, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 No rush mate. Does anyone happen to have a confirmation did Lucius' Emissary change from the beta files? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirial Posted August 7, 2015 Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 The Lucius Conflux looks like a ton of fun, judging from beta. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zFiend Posted August 7, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 So another game today. Which was quite clear cut on turn 3? Against Neverborn Zoraida, 3 Waldgeists with From the Shadows and my crew was doomed. Seriously 4" ml, Armor 2, 7 wounds and that was it. It took 2 turns for Ryle to take one down to free my Riflemen and after that another just walked in the midst of my crew and they were tied up again. I'm seriously struggling to see why would I ever actually pick Lucius apart from "Amazing theme and amazing models to gimp myself entirely for new players" level. Anyway I have another game coming up next sunday and I'm going full retard. So what are actually good models with Lucius? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deluge Posted August 7, 2015 Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 So another game today. Which was quite clear cut on turn 3? Against Neverborn Zoraida, 3 Waldgeists with From the Shadows and my crew was doomed. Seriously 4" ml, Armor 2, 7 wounds and that was it. It took 2 turns for Ryle to take one down to free my Riflemen and after that another just walked in the midst of my crew and they were tied up again. I'm seriously struggling to see why would I ever actually pick Lucius apart from "Amazing theme and amazing models to gimp myself entirely for new players" level. Anyway I have another game coming up next sunday and I'm going full retard. So what are actually good models with Lucius? Young Nephilim, Illuminated, Doppel... oh guild? Pass 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trikk Posted August 7, 2015 Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 Confucius once said: "No master help crappy player" And the serious note: What other master would have done better and why? Think about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonahmaul Posted August 7, 2015 Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 McMourning has a lot of fun with Waldergeists! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zFiend Posted August 7, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 What other master would have done better and why? Think about it. Alright then! Perdita: Well does she seriously need explaining? Okay, just kills everyone. Sonnia: Kinda in the same boat as Perdita. Well okay, just kills everyone. Hoffman: Well his crew is damn durable with all the heals and also some serious hurt on the enemy. McCabe: Does the whole minion thing better but also boosts Henchmen and all the other models, is quite fast, buffs, debuffs, endures some beating. Lady Justice: Well at least she'd be a threat not to charge into my crew and try to lock it down. McMourning: Hello armor! Also scheming, damage, durability.. Also Nurses. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trikk Posted August 7, 2015 Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 I`ll rephrase You don`t know what you`re up against except Neverborn and the scheme/strats. What now? Did he know you play Lucius? Did you know he will play Zoraida? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonahmaul Posted August 7, 2015 Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 I don't think Lucius would ever make my pick in a competitive game regardless of what factions/strats/schemes were on offer! I've played him a few times lately for fun/fluff reasons but it's really hard to see him as competitive. Every strat/scheme seems to have a better option IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trikk Posted August 7, 2015 Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 The goal is not to say "What other master to pick?" but "How can ZGuild master Lucius?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zFiend Posted August 7, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 Did he know you play Lucius? Well yeah my whole meta does know that, that's the shit part of playing a fixed master for 2 months. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Math Mathonwy Posted August 7, 2015 Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 Confucius once said: "No master help crappy player" And the serious note: What other master would have done better and why? Think about it.I think that we're pretty damn even skill-wise with ZFiend (he has more experience but I have the mighty power of believing I'm utterly beaten from deployment onwards) yet it was utterly lop-sided. I waltzed into his lines with a Waldgeist and Candy and tied everything up. Then stuff started to slowly die all the while I was getting points from the Strategy.I have absolutely no idea how Guild Lucius should've beaten that list and I tried to make a nice enough a list. For example, Focus is super good against Zoraida and Candy. Were I to come with full-on Gremlins - I don't think it would be pretty.I really don't see what the strengths of Guild Lucius are supposed to be. He can do certain Schemes really well and deny others very nicely but so can McMourning. He can buff Minions but so can McCabe (who also can do some Schemes completely trivially). And the rest can just kill the opposition. Guild Minions, though rather nice in a way, are squishy and their killyness is sorta limited in some ways. Loading up on them the way Lucius "needs to" (in that if you don't, why are you playing him?) doesn't lead to good lists.Maybe Wave 3 will help with the Mounted Guard and Master Queeg and the Emissary. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zFiend Posted August 7, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 The goal is not to say "What other master to pick?" but "How can ZGuild master Lucius?" So if I combine all of those masters I get up to a need list of: - Staying power: Guardian? Lawyers? - Damage: Ryle? Riflemen? - Scheming: Lucius obviously. Dogs? - Swift threat to keep models away from my models: Death Marshals? Executioners? Mounted Guards? - Buffs: Well uh, Guardian? - Debuffs: Uh.. At a loss. And then how to add all those together and fit them into a 50ss list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trikk Posted August 7, 2015 Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 Its the 3rd game you got beat by armour and no CC models. You should really consider armour negating stuff? What was your list vs Zoraida? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zFiend Posted August 7, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 Lucius: Secret Assets, Legalese Ryle 3x Riflemen 2x Dogs Sergeant 2x Traps Death Marshal I think that was it? Also yeah I'd need something to negate armor but 7ss Ronin is a tough fit. Also the Guild Constructs needed for that job are one's I don't have. I need to proxy the Peacekeeper probably then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ludvig Posted August 7, 2015 Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 (Rant-whining) What master does better when you don't know what you will face: McCabe... Always McCabe. He gives out lots of AP, gets you pushes and makes your hounds significant so you can do any scheme with ease and can negate almost all the conditions models use to survive in the entire game (though not impossible to wound). No matter what the enemy declares and regardless of schemes and strats McCabe is going to be crazy good, he gets good mileage from any model in the entire guild and he can fill out with hounds to out-activate anyone except Gremlins. Izamu with a Grave Spirit behind him, yup goes down after one or two 3ss dogs charge in... Enemy brought only spirits, yup I do my usual damage... You engaged my shooter, nope, pushed him and made him nimble. There was a discussion a while back on Colette which transferred into a discussion on Lucius. A lot of people had a hard time seeing his strengths and the ones who liked him all played him in neverborn as far as I remember. The good news is I can play him against the newer players in our local group since they don't appreciate facing Sonnia anymore (/End rant-whining) On the actual topic i have a few suggestions: I use 1 Rifleman, maaaybe 2 but 3 is never worth it in my opinion. Any opponent who is half-capable can lock them all up T1 or 2 if they stay together. They can also take a shortcut and just kill them about as fast since they are sturdy like wet paper bags. The trap is that you try to keep them together which makes the enemy's job easy. I've had some success using a single Rifleman who hangs around another shooter like a Pathfinder or Austringer, preferably with someone to block off the obvious aproach to them. Pathfinders do good work against Waldgeists if you can get them before they engage you. For countering melee threats you might want to go to our old auto-include Francisco Ortega with his two favourite upgrades since he can push your dudes out of melee or wipe the floor with the foolish enemy who tried to engage your Riflemen if you keep him within charge range and activate him late in the turn. He actually buffs you and wrecks face so he fits two of your categories above! Not sure about his own staying power but compared to Riflemen he fits that category On the topic of our favourite family I have another (Warning: untried and volatile) idea: Papa Loco gives dynamite to a minion *gasp*, I think probably a Pathfinder for sweet, sweet blasts. Minion then shoots twice and Lucius then forces it to shoot two more times (and you might want to give it defensive since the enemy is gonna hate that poor sucker). Should also work on a decent melee minion that you try to get to charge in near Lucius for to attacks (not sure on the activation order here). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zFiend Posted August 7, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 Thank you Ludvig. Never really even thought about Franc with Lucius.. damn Guild crutch. you have given many good ideas, cheers for those. I will try out a few of em and report back. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myyrä Posted August 7, 2015 Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 Take Papa Loco, use him to buff whatever, then charge in to melee with Lucius and use what lackeys are for to trade Papa in instead and chain activate with a companion. Proceed to kill all your own models in the vicinity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zFiend Posted August 7, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 Take Papa Loco, use him to buff whatever, then charge in to melee with Lucius and use what lackeys are for to trade Papa in instead and chain activate with a companion. Proceed to kill all your own models in the vicinity. Boom goes the Riflemen! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
admiralvorkraft Posted August 8, 2015 Report Share Posted August 8, 2015 I'll second the single Rifleman with an Austringer suggestion - that's my set-up unless I'm running Dashel, usually in Reconnoiter. I want to see the Orderlies since boring minions with great stat blocks seem like a fit for how I play Guild Lucius. Lucius himself can do a surprising amount of work up close by abusing Lackey's. If there's a single model messing up my crew I'll usually Lackey out something important and try to slap Red Tape on the model (Secret Objectives can be useful here if you set up in advance), then I can order another minion (or two if I was able to 0 Secret Objectives) to walk away because disengaging flips are suddenly way less of an issue. Knowing that Ronin have Flurry I'm going to have to proxy one in and see how that goes. What Lucius does better than other masters is projection - aside from Raspy he probably has the broadest sphere of influence in the game. He extends the threat range of any model on the board by 12"+ really easily and all of his abilities have crazy range if you play in-theme. Commanding Presence has an 18" range! Issue Command is 14" for Guardsmen and Mimics! Combined with a Watcher you can pull off positioning tricks like no other master in the game. That being said, I find that McMourning running with the same exact crews gets better results more reliably. Because he's a worthwhile model by himself. If Issue Command was slightly less limited, or Lucius had Critical Strike on his sword cane, or a remotely decent damage spread, or a 2" engagement range, or Ml 7, or Commanding Presence had a lower TN, or Lackey's wasn't once per turn, or, or... But whatever, something about wishes, horses and beggars. I still enjoy playing him. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zFiend Posted August 8, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 8, 2015 If Issue Command was slightly less limited, or Lucius had Critical Strike on his sword cane, or a remotely decent damage spread, or a 2" engagement range, or Ml 7, or Commanding Presence had a lower TN, or Lackey's wasn't once per turn, or, or... But whatever, something about wishes, horses and beggars. I still enjoy playing him. These are very much what I've thought and not really understood why they are so goddamn limited. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carcosa Posted August 8, 2015 Report Share Posted August 8, 2015 *puts on hard-hat* *puts on scorn proof jacket* Because the guild is frigging balanced!! :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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