Henchman Hardcore crew discussion and tactica

[EntrepeNinja]

Arcanists Crew - 20 - Shoot Out

 

The Captain -- 3 Pool

 +Imbued Energies [1]

 

Cassandra [8]

 +Smoke and Mirrors [1]

Metal Gamin [4]

Silent One [6]

 

You trade out the second Gamin for a Silent One, who A) Can throw around heals, and improves Cassy's Murder Run. You can swap out Smoke and Mirrors for Imbued Energies, but the real deal is Cassy being able to: Nimble, Charge, Trigger Magician's Prop, Steal Freeze, Trigger Overpower (Or whatever it's called on their card), Cast Freeze again, then attack with the second charge (a) attack, and use the push away.

 

ENinja

[Tuttleboy]

One of the local guys has been playing Joss, 2x Gunsmith, and a Fire Gamin plus something on Joss that I don't remember now. When he gets burning from the FG onto something in your crew the Gunners can pretty much destroy it. The Hard Way is brutal and the ability to choose the ammo needed for the situation is just icing on the cake.

[EntrepeNinja]

It's almost one or the other- Hard way and chambers are both 0's. You gotta hope you flip the suit you need if you're getting the double positive (though You've got a better chance at straight up flipping the suit you need with the  :+fate ).

 

That being said, I love hard way. 

[Abbazabba1920]

Judge with armor

3 death Marshall's

Box everything!

[Rhonlore]

Resurrectionists Crew - 20 - Shoot Out

The Valedictorian -- 3 Pool

+Necrotic Preparation [1]

• Graveyard Spirit [3]
• Izamu the Armor [10]

  +Unnerving Aura [1]

• Ashigaru [5]

Here is what in thinking of playing. I also posted it on the ressur sub form.

[SpectreEliteGaming]

@FetidStrumpet - Dig the list, consider it stoooooolen.

@Zweigenkrieger - I've seen solid performance from that list - simple works. I've actually tried doppelganger swap because I assumed it would be hypothetically better but illuminated x2 seems to do better not sure why - just limited sample size maybe

Sue is a solid choice - never lives long enough to be super useful though - hard to think of a more (hypothetical) solid threat in this format.

Never been happy with Killjoy - eats too many points and once he's dead its tough to score Turf War (and a strategy willingly sacrificing your own model in a 4 model game aint cutting it).

Hannah/Strongarm package is solid, give it a try - If opponent has heals, use their healer for your heals otherwise go full out aggro and try to squeeze out whatever mitigation advantage you (might) have. Bringing a dedicated healer or dedicated support piece is a weak link (imo) - opt instead for hybrid models like Ryle, Lazarus. Needs more kill! - and it sucks to face Strongarm in this format.

I really want Sue to be good

Rusty Alyce lists are most solid.... I think :/

Ryle lists are great too.

As a bit of an aside I just wanted to say that I love this format - really appeals to the number crunching power gamer perfectionists and sparks a lot of convo - normal Malifaux games are difficult to hypothesize - too many ever-changing variables. There isn't a large Malifaux presence in Canada at all (if there is, please tell ) - so I usually play in a small 5-6 man group who are a) sick of warhammer BS and tired of Magic all the time and all have nothing else to do isolated in the "great" canadian north after work - we get a lot of games in, suffice to say... may or may not involve gambling

*Most important* about this format is be vigilant in your timing.

I personally feel that a major weakness in the current Smogcon Hardcore rules is the flexibility of time. Being +/- 4/8 activations between one game and the next does not lead to consistent or comparable results.

Here is a suggestion:

We utilize chess clocks - 10mins a player per game, final activation at 0:00 then opponent plays out remainder of his time left (goldfishing, if you will). That's 30 secs per model - aim for 20-25sec activations - you will gain time as your crew is whittled away and end/skip unimportant activations if needed. Excessive dogging on opponents clock is a thrown game - or at least rematched.

Without clocks you'll probably only get 3 turns in max (?) and the difference between having 4-8 more activations one game and not the next is too much descrepancy - if you're not gonna get the activations anyway you might as well skip less important ones to obtain key ones if you're running out of time. This would, however, remove oneself faaaaaar from the lands of the casual gamer making the format somewhat niche or inaccessable probably even elitest :/ - you'd probably start seeing perhaps even a Starcraft level of skill difference in players.

But then again that's hardcore, right! Games like this really spark interest - they are flashy no nonsense games and if they are particularly well done they are pretty epic to watch. I'd Iike to hear what the actual Malifaux community thinks of this - instead of just a bunch of Magic PTQ players lol.

TL;DR - I like hardcore. Hardcore is fun.

[EntrepeNinja]

The clocks are something we've debated about as well.

 

I know I really get into the speed playing, and it's also good practice for blitzing through turns in an actual tournament setting.

 

That being said, I tried a few games with the 20 minute timer going, and you're right. We got to just about turn 3. So I can see the clocks being beneficial for people who do play quickly, and detrimental to those who have trouble. It's a question of pacing, and I'm really terrible at saying things like, "You're killing me. Go faster." Because I can't stop being polite.

 

A clock would say those things for me.

 

ENinja

[Clement]

A list I had some great luck with recently.

 

Hannah -- 3 Pool

 +Ancient Tomes

 

The Nothing Beast

+His Upgrade (forgot the name) 

Void Wretch

Void Wretch

 

Just like summoning can really upset the balance of the game, burying people can REALLY swing the balance of power in the game.  Also Hannah and the Nothing Beast are a great tag team since he gets 3 meaty hits a turn, and she can Make a New Entry to turn her 0 action into one more attack.  The Wretches are there to do the usual fast/slow shenanigans and put some teeth into bury.

[Hunt.er]

Arcanists Crew - 20 - Shoot Out

 

The Captain -- 3 Pool

 +Imbued Energies [1]

 

Cassandra [8]

 +Smoke and Mirrors [1]

Metal Gamin [4]

Silent One [6]

 

I don`t know if it was changed, but in Henchman Hardcore only one henchman is allowed, so The Captain and Cassy can`t run together.

[EntrepeNinja]

The way we played was you could hire what you want so long as it was 20 stones, and you ended up with 4 models. I'd never heard the one hench rule. :/

ENinja

[santaclaws01]

Arcanists Crew - 20 - Shoot Out

 

The Captain -- 3 Pool

 +Imbued Energies [1]

 

Cassandra [8]

 +Smoke and Mirrors [1]

Metal Gamin [4]

Silent One [6]

 

I don`t know if it was changed, but in Henchman Hardcore only one henchman is allowed, so The Captain and Cassy can`t run together.

There's no restriction on the number of Henchman you can take in the "official" HH format.

 

[Hunt.er]

okay, i get my informations from this side. Maybe they have used their own rules.

[Yvarre]

My TT List:

Ototo- Recalled Training (1), Call the Thunder (1)

Illuminated (7)

Chiaki (6)- Pull of the Graves (1)

Wastrel (4)

I find that close deployment maximizes Ototo, as he can typically spend all of his AP on killing.  The idea is to have Ototo and the Illuminated quickly engage and destroy with Chiaki and the Wastrel giving cover and healing.  With self healing, HtK, and 12 wounds, Ototo can be extremely resilient.  Add in an Autoheal for 2 from the wastrel, and a potential heal of 2 from Chiaki with a ram, you can really control his wounds for key moments in the turn.  Particularly, you want him at 6 or less when attacking for enraged and as high as possible on the defense, ensuring he stays above HtK and gets to 6 or less for his activation.  When you have their leader sucked into his engagement range, barring defensive triggers such as the Captain's, not many models can resist an enraged Flurry with Recalled training bonuses (8 Ml with a + and a ++to damage).  If things are a little too hairy (opposing flurries, Relic hammers, etc.) as a backup plan Ototo and Chiaki both have the option of handing out slow, which in turn gives Ototo a damage bonus.  I've more often tabled my opponent's crew before needing to use slow. but it is a nice option.

Chiaki also has the option of using her Purity tactical action to deny VP for the Strat.  As she likes to activate last for her manipulative defense and her potential condition removal/healing anyway, she can typically push a surviving enemy model or two out of range for the strat.

The illuminated just acts as a beater to take out smaller targets and a fairly effective AP sink, healing itself up each turn.

The Wastrel is mostly there for healing others, but it does have some occasionally relevant triggers on castoffs.  As it's going to hang back and there are more pressing targets, I find my opponents mostly ignoring it, sinking AP into models that just keep healing.

[Mununkulus]

The club i am playing at is picking up this format next month for a tournament, so I am looking for some fun Neverborn lists. My pool is rather limited, having mostly Zoraida and Lilith crew members. 

I was thinking about this:

Nekima for killing stuff

Graves for pushing ppl out of Turf War

2 Waldgeist for protection 

 

I just feel like Nekima will be pretty weak in this format without any SS in her cache. Thoughts ?

[H4ml3t]

I often use HH with no time limit to teach new players the game. The game changes like crazy when the time limit is introduced. I've found you probably only get 3 turns in and so you really have to focus on Assassinate to get a win.

My favorite crew so far has been:

Joss

Howard

2 Steam Arachnids

The 2 Arachnids move into the TW zone and go Defensive freeing Joss and Howard to go on the Assassinate run.

 

I've also had fun with

Joss w Imbued Energies

2 December Acolytes

Rail Worker

If I had Cassandra and Silent Ones I would definitely try a list with them like others have mentioned.