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4thstringer

Our Worst Models

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I've had pathfinders perform very well. It's all about not getting greedy with their deployment. They should be about one or two walks out of your deployment in a spot where they will hurt an enemy moving aggressively but safe from a turn one charge. A high spot so they can shoot but can't be charged is ideal. Board dependent so not autopicks but definitely not bad in my opinion. For a fixed list an 8ss hench and finding the stones somewhere elsr might be better but on some boards they are a force to be reckoned with.

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I think a lot of the Guardsman themed stuff suffers from being good with the appropriate support, but lackluster otherwise. Plenty of henchmen and most of the newer models just do their thing reliably and independently,  so there's way less chance for you to mess up running the crew, or your opponent to interfere with it.

I don't think this is a colossal issue at the moment. There are so many models that it's inevitable that some of them are redundant and the fact that things like the Riflemen can shine when the fates align for them makes them at least feel playable. Sure, you're almost always going to be better off with the boring but solid "best of" models but I don't think it's reasonable to expect the game to give you...60 odd models and combinations thereof that are all just as cost effective as eachother.

The only model I've enough experience with to say it's completely useless is the Governor's Proxy. The totem design space is a lot more cramped and pretty much every faction has one or two options you just don't take. Luckily there's nothing that relies on him working properly and he's so obviously bad that you don't waste many games trying to get him to work. 

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2 hours ago, lusciousmccabe said:

I think a lot of the Guardsman themed stuff suffers from being good with the appropriate support, but lackluster otherwise. 

The only model I've enough experience with to say it's completely useless is the Governor's Proxy. The totem design space is a lot more cramped and pretty much every faction has one or two options you just don't take. Luckily there's nothing that relies on him working properly and he's so obviously bad that you don't waste many games trying to get him to work. 

As far as the guardsmen go, the it's clear that wyrd doesn't want a synergies based game.  But it makes models that are dependent on synergies (guardsmen, Hoff boots) a little lackluster.

As far as the proxy goes, I guess we are lucky.  If he was really good like old cranky then we would have 7 totems to complain aren't worth taking.

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The only two models I think are useless in Guild are Governor's proxy and Exorcists. The proxy is not fast or resiliant enough be at the frontline to heal stuff and can be a real liability if your opponent has Obey-type actions. And the Exorcists are bad even against undead, which they are supposed to be the counter to. They wound need better damage for their close combat attack and some built in triggers to even start being useful at their current cost.

I haven't played with either Wastrels or Orderlies.

I don't think that riflemen are bad if they have the right support. With Dashel and preferably Lucius they are OK in my opinion. At least in schemes where you can keep some of your models back for a few turns. But there certainly are better minions in Guild. And without Dashel they are really bad.

Another model which I really don't like the rules for is the Scales of Justice. I can see how drawing two cards and wasting an activation can be worth 3 SS, but it is such a wierd mechanic. You don't really use the actual model for anything. It is more of an upgrade. I really wish they would redesign it to play a more active role.

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But at least the scales is a quite good "upgrade" now - , cheap activation, draw 2 cards most of the time, and +1wp for everyone in 6" can be essential in some games :)

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I take back everything I've said about the guild Sarge.  I haven't played it yet, but pairing them with an investigator or two looks to create a true hail of pushes.

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15 hours ago, 4thstringer said:

I take back everything I've said about the guild Sarge.  I haven't played it yet, but pairing them with an investigator or two looks to create a true hail of pushes.

That looks like it might bypass the one trouble with the investigator: after awhile there’s a fine net of scheme markers 4” apart and no room to interact for more.

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39 minutes ago, Gnomezilla said:

That looks like it might bypass the one trouble with the investigator: after awhile there’s a fine net of scheme markers 4” apart and no room to interact for more.

Guild needs more stuff like malifaux provides and the rougarou that would eat those markers.  Investigators just don't do it fast enough.  I do really love the idea of the guild Sarge planting evidence, the investigator insisting"everyone stay back, that's evidence", and then picking it up and using it as evidence against someone else.

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The absolute best fluff thing would be Lucius killing something with finish the job and then the guardsmen make it into evidence to score setup. ;)

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I really like the pathfinder with Sonnia as another trap laying device. The ability to move traps is also golden. I have been starting games with two traps and with luck can drop a 3rd first turn....moving them into decent blasting range is where i use them. I've also red jokered my damage flip on them for the last 3 shots so the damage has been great. Obvs lucky but for 6ss with a summons I really want in Guild, i'll run one any day of the week.

 

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With models that are poor, i've simply never used the Proxy, Exorcists, Mounted Guard, Riflemen, Guild Sergeant, Dashel, Orderlies, Heartsbane, Grimwell....the problem is I think we just have better options.

I even struggle with Executioners for the same reason.

 

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Mounted Guards have the unique movement trick for supporting non-master beaters. They may seem, however, a bit costly and less flexible when compare to Investigator. But still Lucius, McCabe and Nellie would love to have one of them in the crew.

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I like using Orderlies as scheme runners but admit to having never even tried to heal with them.

Mounted Guardsmen are great for Nellie, who often crams her crew full of exactly the sort of model he likes ferrying around.

I’d put Heartsbane pretty high on the list.  On paper she looks good but in practice she’s a card sucking vampire who wishes she could use soul stones.  Sometimes the cards are working for you and she shuts down something important.  But it’s not reliable.

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4 hours ago, Clockwork_Fish said:

Sometimes the cards are working for you and she shuts down something important.  But it’s not reliable.

Truer words have never been spoken.  But man do some of my regular opponents have some PTSD from her glory moments for me.

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18 hours ago, 4thstringer said:

Truer words have never been spoken.  But man do some of my regular opponents have some PTSD from her glory moments for me.

I have gotten a lot of use out of her. She’s usually so far down on my opponents hit list that she ends up shutting down a whole flank or scoring a scheme for me single handedly. She is super suit intensive, and having one of those baked in would be nice, but if you’ve got the cards she’s a real headache for your opponent.  She’s also not bad at chasing down and killling scheme runners with her push and long charge. 

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