Dracomax Posted March 18, 2014 Report Share Posted March 18, 2014 and none of those is particularly violent. Gory, creepy, potentially disturbing, yes—but not violent. All of the violence you accociate with them comes from fluff and your own head, not the mini. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Math Mathonwy Posted March 18, 2014 Report Share Posted March 18, 2014 It wouldn't. Beowulf fighted naked. Hercules fighted naked. Leonidas fighted half naked. David against Goliath. This is the handsome famous Achilles.Zeus as well as any other masculine divinity used their phisical appearance to fascinate the opposite sex for sexual purposes. And the same sex too (e.g. Ganymede).Now we have Arrow and Thor, who don't waste an occasion to show their abs, and receive appreciation...Valkyrie and Amazons only considered their chests when they were impeded by them.(What's wrong with Lilith, btw? o.O)First of all, nakedness does not mean objectification. Often the classic barbarian king is wearing less clothes than the hapless concubines at his feet yet the former isn't objectified while the latter are. It's about empowerment and whether the woman is a subject or an object in the depiction, essentially. Or the male, but men are actually rather seldom objectified.Second, I'm not saying that there is anything wrong with Lilith. I consider the pose somewhat awkward and kinda catwalk-style weird but I don't think that it is horrid. But I could see the argument that she is being depicted in a weird stance due to her gender (like I said, a male mini doing what she's doing would look extremely weird).Finally, I wish to stress that I don't think that Malifaux is especially sexist. There are some minis that go for the cheap exploitative angle (Viks and Ronins, for example) but there are many strong female depictions as well and all in all Malifaux is good about including women. There are certainly loads of minis ranges that are worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flindo Posted March 18, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 18, 2014 heres the video I was referring to, sorry that I did not post it from the start. http://www.miniwargaming.com/content/sit-talk-miniwargaming-5-years-world-100 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mythicFOX Posted March 18, 2014 Report Share Posted March 18, 2014 That's a 45min video, any idea where the relevant remarks are made? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r4st4f4n Posted March 18, 2014 Report Share Posted March 18, 2014 and none of those is particularly violent. Gory, creepy, potentially disturbing, yes—but not violent. All of the violence you accociate with them comes from fluff and your own head, not the mini. And what is the mini where sexuality doesn't happen just in your head? Am I missing anything Wyrd animated porn minis range? o.O Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dracomax Posted March 18, 2014 Report Share Posted March 18, 2014 Sex is different than sexuality. Sexuality is the emphasis of sexual attributes, which in women tends to be hips, buttocks, lips, and breasts. I don't think anyone would complain that the women of Malifaux are underdeveloped in these areas. That being said, I also said that I don't consider Wyrd to be a big offender; there are some examples of the more...sultry poses and cheesecake figures, but it runs the range. There were a few in the initial run that I could see being a bit to objectifying(as much as I love the original Lady J sculpt, it is basically a dominatrix pose for a cheesecake poster) I would also say there are a few that actually do approach the point of offputting violence(the aforementioned Kirai). It seems fairly balanced. Other mini companies have a much worse track record. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yool1981 Posted March 18, 2014 Report Share Posted March 18, 2014 Just a small post to point out that sexism is highly culturally subjective. There seems to be a lot of fuss around sexism in some countries (US) while in others (France for example), the same things are not such a big deal. I like painting miniatures of sexy women that are alive and I don't like painting putrefying zombies of ugly dudes. I still do my share of house cleaning at home and treat my girlfriend with respect. But that may be because I leave in Paris where you can see the cover of porn magazines advertising on the wall of newspaper shops just on the way to school (which is not especially a good thing...). 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalkris Posted March 18, 2014 Report Share Posted March 18, 2014 An employee of a facist regime shooting the children of the indigenous population directly in the face is fine. But boobs are bad. For a second there I thought you meant Hamelin, but nope. ~Lil Kalki Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgraz Posted March 18, 2014 Report Share Posted March 18, 2014 He's pretty open with his declaration that women with a particular tattoo are tramps. Of course he didn't explicitly state it at first, I took it from what he said. As the quoted post shows I was right. You seem to agree that supposedly women with a tattoo on their back are tramps. That's great and I think it casts a very specific light on the arguments being made so far. All I can say to this is........uhmm.....hahaha. It may be possible to right a good book or script in which sexual congress advances the story and solves problems effectively, but I've never seen it. Most that even attempt it come out sounding either pointless, or like they were written by a teenager who just discovered internet porn. Try 'Kushiel's Dart' (and the entire following series) by Jacqueline Carey. Great books, great stories....and all about progressing the story with "sex". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dracomax Posted March 18, 2014 Report Share Posted March 18, 2014 All I can say to this is........uhmm.....hahaha. Try 'Kushiel's Dart' (and the entire following series) by Jacqueline Carey. Great books, great stories....and all about progressing the story with "sex". You know, I had forgotten about those. read them some years ago, thought they were neat but got a little to gory in places, but you are right- it did an admirable job at that. It also mixed quite a bit of actual violence and politics in. Still, it is definitely one of the few exceptions where removing the sex would actually have any real effect on the story, let alone one that is actually written fairly well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mako Posted March 18, 2014 Report Share Posted March 18, 2014 You know what, I agree with MythicFox - this thread is nothing to do with anything, but full of accusations of various things at a range of people. We're watching this very carefully. I suggest not interpreting people's posts the way you want to, but carefully looking at what they meant. Otherwise, this thread will survive less time than an ice cube in the oven. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dracomax Posted March 18, 2014 Report Share Posted March 18, 2014 You know what, I agree with MythicFox - this thread is nothing to do with anything, but full of accusations of various things at a range of people. We're watching this very carefully. I suggest not interpreting people's posts the way you want to, but carefully looking at what they meant. Otherwise, this thread will survive less time than an ice cube in the oven. must...resist...urge...to point out...non-active ovens...fairly insulated... but seriously, message heard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joel Posted March 18, 2014 Report Share Posted March 18, 2014 How is this thread still active?!? Mods, please, kill it dead. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghulaf5420 Posted March 18, 2014 Report Share Posted March 18, 2014 That's a 45min video, any idea where the relevant remarks are made? Just finished watching the video - slow day at work - and the only remarks were at 9:30 and 42:30. All pretty vague and seem to be referencing an earlier video. He does do a disclaimer at the beginning that he does talk about his personal religious viewpoints and to not watch the videos if it might offend you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mythicFOX Posted March 18, 2014 Report Share Posted March 18, 2014 I'm not sure there was a topic here to begin with and four pages in we certainly haven't grasped one. I'm pulling the plug on this troll bait now rather than waiting for things to get any more ugly than they have already. </mod hat> 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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