Twisted Metal Posted September 7, 2012 Report Share Posted September 7, 2012 I'm not sure how others feel about Mei Fengs individual scheme but to me it feel far tinvolved to be worth only 2vp. The amount of interactions it takes to complete it is insane. It's on par with Plant Evidence only more difficult because it requires you to place the markers with a 0 action instead of a 1 and the markers have to be in a line making your path predictable to your opponent. Not only that but it also potentially require more interaction than the strategy if you have a bad terrain set up. Am I missing something here? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tadaka Posted September 7, 2012 Report Share Posted September 7, 2012 Eh imho a scheme that does not make you kill the other master is useful. No i kill my own model to deny you points. Ya i see this as a good scheme. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twisted Metal Posted September 7, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 7, 2012 Don't get me wrong I love the concept of the scheme and the fact that you don't have to kill anything I'm just concerned about the number of 0 actions that you would need to take which handicaps some of the arcanists best objective grabbers such as a mech rider and kind of pidgeon holes pidgeon hole Mei Feng into taking the duet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FearLord Posted September 7, 2012 Report Share Posted September 7, 2012 What is the wording of it? It would not be the first time a scheme was a little much - check out Lady Justice's and tell me when you would ever play it over Assassinate? Instead of Picking one master or Henchmen to kill, you must kill all of them in play, and then perform her action near them to deal with their departed souls... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilus Posted September 7, 2012 Report Share Posted September 7, 2012 Take a look at her minion pool and see how many have (0) actions you will use every turn. Its not as bad as it seems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarsnick Posted September 7, 2012 Report Share Posted September 7, 2012 Take a look at her minion pool and see how many have (0) actions you will use every turn. Its not as bad as it seems. Isn't Vent Steam a 0 action? Since just about everyone in her crew can see through it while still using it as cover (and Creepy Fog as well), it would seem very important to keep it up all the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hateful Darkblack Posted September 7, 2012 Report Share Posted September 7, 2012 Honestly, it's one of my favorite schemes in the new book. You're building a railroad! How is that not awesome? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeleteAccount Posted September 7, 2012 Report Share Posted September 7, 2012 Exact wording or this is a one man dance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilus Posted September 7, 2012 Report Share Posted September 7, 2012 Isn't Vent Steam a 0 action? Since just about everyone in her crew can see through it while still using it as cover (and Creepy Fog as well), it would seem very important to keep it up all the time. It is, but not all her minions have it. Kang can give models an extra CB or make the Immune to Morale duels for a (0) but neither is going to happen every turn Metal Gaiman only have (0) In Trouble, so they can build as well most turns Rail Golem has several (0)'s but also instinctual so you can see him dropping a token on at least one turn(especially if he gains reactivate) Rail Works just have (0) Shove Faster, which is pretty situational So plenty of models that don't have must use (0) actions that can drop the counter down and build the line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Backno Posted September 7, 2012 Report Share Posted September 7, 2012 It is, but not all her minions have it. Kang can give models an extra CB or make the Immune to Morale duels for a (0) but neither is going to happen every turn Metal Gaiman only have (0) In Trouble, so they can build as well most turns Rail Golem has several (0)'s but also instinctual so you can see him dropping a token on at least one turn(especially if he gains reactivate) Rail Works just have (0) Shove Faster, which is pretty situational So plenty of models that don't have must use (0) actions that can drop the counter down and build the line. The 2 games I have played so far verify this tends to be the case. I never really had any issues putting down at least 1 counter every single turn using just a random Rail Worker that couldn't shovel faster on something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted September 7, 2012 Report Share Posted September 7, 2012 Mei Feng's vs Seamus'... nuff said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cats Laughing Posted September 7, 2012 Report Share Posted September 7, 2012 (edited) Honestly, it's one of my favorite schemes in the new book. You're building a railroad! How is that not awesome? This plus a 90' rotated 8... Between Mei's scheme and Jakob's 'end a turn with a straight' scheme, I think Wyrd really showed off the amazing potential of the Strategy + Scheme aspect of Malifaux. I can't comment on the other schemes yet as my book is in transit and I only briefly looked at the one book that did make it to the islands... I kind of have an idea for a Mei-only Strategy: Build a Railroad: Essentially the same as her scheme. Place a counter in each deployment zone and her crew gains the (0) action to place more counters. Counters create a path if no more than 6" separates each counter. No path counter may be placed within 3" of the center of the table. The path must connect both starting counters to score any VP. Divide the table into 4 corners, Mei scores 1 VP for each table corner her completed path goes through. Edit: As a reply to Fetid: Yeah I wish Seamus's scheme was on-par Mei's for coolness factor, reasonableness of completion and etc... I can only hope that Wyrd releases additional schemes in the future. (I personally want Henchmen schemes, for when Henchmen get taken as leaders) Edited September 7, 2012 by Cats Laughing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilus Posted September 8, 2012 Report Share Posted September 8, 2012 The 2 games I have played so far verify this tends to be the case. I never really had any issues putting down at least 1 counter every single turn using just a random Rail Worker that couldn't shovel faster on something. Exactly, Its also worth noting that there is no limit to how many you can place. So if you don't have a (0) action do to there is no reason not to drop one down just in case the line you were working to achieve doesn't work out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savrys Posted September 9, 2012 Report Share Posted September 9, 2012 Exact wording or this is a one man dance. Alternate Route (Mei Feng Only) When a destination cannot be reached, the wise man finds an alternate path. - Three Kingdoms Proverb Setup After all models have deployed, place one 30mm Embarkation Marker completely within your Deployment Zone. The Marker must be touching a table edge within the Zone. Then place a second 30mm Destination Marker completely within your opponents's Deployment Zone. That Marker must be touching the opposite table edge. Special During the Encounter, non-insignificant models in your Crew may perform the Action: "(0) Building the Line: This model places a 30mm Route Marker in base contact with itself." This Scheme must be announced. Victory If at the end of the Encounter you can trace a line from the Embarkation Marker to the Destination Marker and that line passes through Route Markers no further than 6' from one another your crew placed, you score 2 VP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
decker_cky Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 Does the line have to be straight? If not, you could have fun laying tons of markers all over the place. I assume it just needs to be any line you can trace without breaking the 6" distance. BTW, for a 3 foot table, the minimum you'll need is 5 markers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rathnard Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 See, this is something I don't agree with when people talk about schemes. It's well known that some schemes are very easy and others are quite hard. But with maybe a few exceptions I don't think they need to be rebalanced to make them all equivalent. Personally I like the fact that some schemes are harder than others. In a tournament setting it adds another layer of strategy, since there are only a few easy schemes that you're usually best off saving for your toughest opponents (side note - this is also the main reason I'm against expanding the available scheme list). In casual games it allows me to tailor my schemes to the skill level of my opponent. Am I facing someone as experienced as I am? Maybe I'll take Bodyguard and Holdout. Is my opponent new to the game? I'll go for Exterminate and my Master's Scheme. It allows my to change my own difficulty level on the fly, making it a more enjoyable experience for both me and my opponent. As for Mei Feng's scheme, honestly I think it's one of the easier Master Schemes. Depending on the strategy and who they're facing, your models aren't going to want to use their 0 actions all the time. Even Vent Steam becomes considerably less interesting against a crew without shooting. So all it really requires is some good maneuverability and a decent supply of cheap minions - something a Mei Feng crew should not have difficulty providing. Honestly compared to many of the other Master Schemes, it's a cake-walk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
decker_cky Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 As for Mei Feng's scheme, honestly I think it's one of the easier Master Schemes. Depending on the strategy and who they're facing, your models aren't going to want to use their 0 actions all the time. Even Vent Steam becomes considerably less interesting against a crew without shooting. So all it really requires is some good maneuverability and a decent supply of cheap minions - something a Mei Feng crew should not have difficulty providing. Honestly compared to many of the other Master Schemes, it's a cake-walk. In a way it's easy, but it also forces you to advance in ways that will often expose models more than you want to. I think it's a pretty balanced scheme - achievable, but you do need to go somewhat out of your way to achieve it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osoi Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 Yes but if you combo in Power Ritual, Stake a Claim or Breakthourgh with it you are getting that level of movement anyway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edonil Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 Anyone else tempted to make railroad tokens for this scheme? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subötai Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 Anyone else tempted to make railroad tokens for this scheme? Already done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edonil Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 Any photos of them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merlinman Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 you able to measure the distance between a marker and one you are about to place or is it just place in base to base and place a lot and hope they make a path / eyeball 6" because 1 messup and you are done for Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edonil Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 Far as I read it, you get to use the standard Mk. I Eyeball, then measure at the end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeuroFire Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 You can measure how far you're moving, though, so if a minion already dropped a marker, just move it ≤ 6" and drop another one. And with Mei setting up chains of Constructs for Railwalker anyway (something I'm sure she'll do a lot) this Scheme is actually pretty easy. The big challenge is probably getting that last marker in the enemy deployment zone, and that's no more difficult than Breakthrough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harbinger Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 The big challenge is probably getting that last marker in the enemy deployment zone, and that's no more difficult than Breakthrough. The one in enemy deployment zone is automatic isnt it? so you only have to get withing 6 inches of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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