128th_king Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 (edited) Being many opinions on how Lady J will return, if she returns at all. What is your opinion, I know a fair number of people have provided the point that given she is dead, the only way she can come back is with the resurrectionists. however there are also another few sides to the debate, we cannot forget the other guild masters, We have Hoffman, an undercover agent investigating the Arcanist movement Lucius, with many rumours about how he is actually a Neverborn. Rumours of the Governer being a Tyrant..... there is a chance that while she may be undead, who's to say she won't come back in the Guild with the Undead rule, perhaps allowing certain undead models into a guild crew containing her, or allowing you to give the undead characteristic to Death Marshals, knowing how they're rather tainted by the knowledge they have obtained. what do you believe? will she come back as a master in the resurrectionist camp? or back to the Guild? will she be permanently removed from the game? Discuss if you will Edited January 24, 2011 by 128th_king quick fix to the Governer and Hoffman entry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wodschow Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 Hmm.. We don't really know how the Avatars will work at all.. Now they might simply be alternative masters (which seems to be the assumption you're working under), but I'm certainly hoping for something more Malifesque than that - seen it suggested that the Masters would 'evolve' into them during the game if certain conditions were met, but that one's probably just fanboy wishlisting. Could be that players agree before the game if it's pre-event or post-event or something sort of that way. Even if the Avatars won't hit us untill Book4, my guess is we'll get to know alot more after Book3's fluff (It would be strange to let Lady Justice lie beneath a building for an entire books worth of fluff..) Regardless I fully expect Lady J's Avatar to belong to the Guild. Unrelated: Isn't Hoffman still under the impression that the Arcanists killed his brother? Or did I miss something crucial there..? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mythicFOX Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 will she be permanently removed from the game? Discuss if you will :hijacked: I think this leads to a more interesting question about the future. We have 20 masters + 6 henchmen to lead crews at the moment. Plus multiple minions to support each one. Even if this only expands at a rate of five per book from now on we're going to reach a point where, for production / inventory and demand resons models will need to go out of print. One of the key issues Wyrd face going forward, after they've tackled Organised Play, will be how to handle this. Can OP models rules still be supported. How do you balance the interest of players who own OP models with those who don't have access to them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gensuke626 Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 (edited) Hmm.. We don't really know how the Avatars will work at all.. Now they might simply be alternative masters (which seems to be the assumption you're working under), but I'm certainly hoping for something more Malifesque than that - seen it suggested that the Masters would 'evolve' into them during the game if certain conditions were met, but that one's probably just fanboy wishlisting. Could be that players agree before the game if it's pre-event or post-event or something sort of that way. Even if the Avatars won't hit us untill Book4, my guess is we'll get to know alot more after Book3's fluff (It would be strange to let Lady Justice lie beneath a building for an entire books worth of fluff..) Regardless I fully expect Lady J's Avatar to belong to the Guild. Unrelated: Isn't Hoffman still under the impression that the Arcanists killed his brother? Or did I miss something crucial there..? as far as I know Hoffman still thinks that the Arcanists killed his brother and that the MS&U are not as strongly tied to the arcanists as they are. I got the impression that he's friends with Ramos, but doesn't think that Ramos is an Arcanist. I'd like to see Avatar be something that is in-game achievable, but I think "Epic" master is going to be more what they're like. Perhaps they'll be so powerful that they count as 2 masters in a Brawl... I think this leads to a more interesting question about the future. We have 20 masters + 6 henchmen to lead crews at the moment. Plus multiple minions to support each one. Even if this only expands at a rate of five per book from now on we're going to reach a point where, for production / inventory and demand resons models will need to go out of print. One of the key issues Wyrd face going forward, after they've tackled Organised Play, will be how to handle this. Can OP models rules still be supported. How do you balance the interest of players who own OP models with those who don't have access to them? This also assumes that we are going to see new masters with every book. I think it's highly likely that Book 3 will have maybe 5 new henchmen, no new masters, but advanced rules on Special forces, maybe new scenarios, and obviously a huge amount of new minis for special forces (Like the sorely lacking Horrors SF). Edited January 24, 2011 by Gensuke626 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massaen Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 What ever is done with the avatars (we are assuming multiples after all) i am sure it will be awesome! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dumb Luck Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 She'll be Zombie Lady Justice. Like the Judge - isn't his bottom jaw all rotted away? Lucius? A Neverborn? I thought he was just some realll creeepy guy ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mythicFOX Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 This also assumes that we are going to see new masters with every book. I think it's highly likely that Book 3 will have maybe 5 new henchmen, no new masters, but advanced rules on Special forces, maybe new scenarios, and obviously a huge amount of new minis for special forces (Like the sorely lacking Horrors SF). Even if that's true. It doesn't actually make any a difference to my post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magicpockets Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 I doubt they'll swap factions with Avatar forms - imagine collecting a Guild crew and then the Lady J avatar being a Resser master... that would p**s folks right off I've got a different idea about how avatar will work - rather than playing an avatar form from the start, perhaps you can "upgrade" your master mid game into their avatar form depending on certain conditions. That avoids the explosion in number of masters you're talking about and the risk of original models becoming obsolete. But who know huh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigasb Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 I hope they do bring her back as her model is the one that got me intrested in Malifaux. I would very P off if before I finished painting her and the Judge they were knocked out of the story, as there is many more intresting things you could do with her. But I'm sticking to the old saying that if I can't see the body and put a bullet in the head, I won't belive it to be dead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Absolution Black Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 But I'm sticking to the old saying that if I can't see the body and put a bullet in the head, I won't belive it to be dead. The Malifaux way of life. I'm hoping we haven't seen the last of Lady J either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathan Caroland Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 :lollypop: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WEiRD sKeTCH Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 :firedevil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elril Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 Well, we have already seen her art, so she isn't dead. She just got a hair cut I am not going to speculate on how the avatars are going to work. I know there are similarities between PP stuff and Malifaux, but I am hoping they don't just do the epic thing. Honestly, the power creep and never ending expansion of PP is what turned me off of them. I am excited to see what is coming though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratty Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 A traditional comic book stuff.. Dead characters come back with different haircuts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nerdelemental Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 :whistle: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XCoconutMonkey6X Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 Yea, I can see the Avatars being like PP's Epic Masters. Would kind of make sense from a rules perspective so Wyrd dev team doesn't have to not only balance out the Avatars with eachother and other masters but if they made the Avatars as like mid-game upgrades, they would then have to work to ensure balance on the upgrade conditions. That's a lot of work that can be reduced by just making them "Epic", so to speak. Course, if I had a choice, I'd like to see them as mid-game upgrades because I'd hate to see the normal Masters become obsolete if one can just take the super version. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sliver Chocobo Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 A traditional comic book stuff.. Dead characters come back with different haircuts. This is Malifaux, dying and comming back is just anther day at the Job Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waaagh5744 Posted January 25, 2011 Report Share Posted January 25, 2011 I really doubt she has died for good, I have no idea at all what her avatarform will be like though :suspiciou. As for the power creep I think wyrd can make "better masters" and still keep it balanced. Maybe if your taking an avatarform you deduct a certain amount of stones from your crew size to be able to field it or some other balancing mechanic. Avatarforms will be interesting to say the least but they seem to be very far away seeing as it looks like they are coming in at book 4. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Amos Posted January 25, 2011 Report Share Posted January 25, 2011 J was buried via the fallout that gave masters everywhere ungodly powers. It seems most likely that her avatar form empowered her, either by shielding her from catastrophe or by enabeling her safe return. Vivacity in the face of death is one of her trademarks, after all, and the power of the fallen star could potentially amplify it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eturns Posted January 25, 2011 Report Share Posted January 25, 2011 I really need to read a lot more of the fluff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Amos Posted January 25, 2011 Report Share Posted January 25, 2011 There needs to be more to read. I write what useless fanstuff I can myself (please read it in the useless fanstuff forum! And Comment!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nerdelemental Posted January 25, 2011 Report Share Posted January 25, 2011 I really need to read a lot more of the fluff Yeah! Everyone should! :cheer2: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Math Mathonwy Posted January 25, 2011 Report Share Posted January 25, 2011 Speaking of which - what's this about Lady J being dead? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratty Posted January 25, 2011 Report Share Posted January 25, 2011 She had a building fall on her head.. it's probably just a bit of a set back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sliver Chocobo Posted January 25, 2011 Report Share Posted January 25, 2011 She might just need a lie down and a nice cup of tea Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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