How do you counter Hard to Wound.

[Regelridderen]

I like facing off vs the Ressurs. It’s some of the coolest themes around. Sadly I haven’t gotten round to fielding my own, but they do look nice on the shelf.

But…

I do have issues with the daunting task of pounding dead flesh with Hard to Wound, so how do people get around this and what’s the ressur weakness?

[fire5tone]

Stuff like puncture triggers, focus, pings, and high min damage, but hard to wound is a real tough one

[Arlos896]

Student of Sinew is pretty amazing at it. Flay and puncture on a single model. Also has command corpse, situationally useful but good into Resser mirror.

[Maniacal_cackle]

Just hit us with min 3 a bunch xD

Some models can also combo focus + puncture to get to that sweet straight flip... But high minimum damage, or tons of consistent damage (like lots of pings) goes over well.

Most hard to wound models have 4-5 defense, so you can generally land a lot of hits on them. Just keep bopping them til they're dead. Also, hard to wound makes it so you're more likely to get hit by the red joker, so volume of attacks is helpful in that regard as well.

Unless coupled with armor, hard to wound and healing don't pair *that* well together, so you can usually just beat your way through models. A peacekeeper for example is going to tear up the vast majority of hard to wound models.

[Regelridderen]

14 hours ago, Arlos896 said:

Student of Sinew is pretty amazing at it. Flay and puncture on a single model. Also has command corpse, situationally useful but good into Resser mirror.

Sadly the student of Sinew doesn't moonlight with other factions

Sorry, I should probably have been more specific that I come from outside Ressurs. I play Neverborn, Arcanists and currently focusing on Ten Thunders.

[Shakyor]

I mean I think the best way is to think about it the other way, what does hard to wound not counter. Efficient min damage.

Hard to Wound is only good against Focus and stuff because it does not let the person cheat still. But having - - instead of - really does not do that much mathematically. So just do a lot of efficient min damage. Min Damge 3 is good, onslaught is good, ping damage from auras is good, conditions are good, shockwaves are good, blastmarkers are good, hazardous is good etc. Stuff like making damage based on conditions is also good!

Think about it this way, preventing max damage focused strategys is literally the ONLY thing hard to wound is good against. (which is unfortunately one of the best strategies)

So all of this true, until you reach Transmortis and they have armor as well ... xD

[Morgan Vening]

On 3/31/2022 at 11:48 AM, Maniacal_cackle said:

Most hard to wound models have 4-5 defense, so you can generally land a lot of hits on them.

Also, while it doesn't happen all the time, having a lower Df does give you more likely you can spike higher, especially with a Focus, but sometimes without.

Two similarly low card flips, and the lower Df means they have to cheat first. Unless they cheat in a low Moderate (high if the attack was Focused), there's a risk that you'll be able to push through the 11+ (6+) differential needed to get it to a straight flip. It's expensive, but if your damage curve is significant, it can at worst force more card use on their part. 

I mean, this is true for most combats, but the lower Df makes it more likely to happen over time.

[SEV]

Hire Alyce...

Seriously, I think Neverborns are well equipped to deal with hard to wound. 

[Regelridderen]

On 4/2/2022 at 3:57 AM, Morgan Vening said:

Also, while it doesn't happen all the time, having a lower Df does give you more likely you can spike higher, especially with a Focus, but sometimes without.

Two similarly low card flips, and the lower Df means they have to cheat first. Unless they cheat in a low Moderate (high if the attack was Focused), there's a risk that you'll be able to push through the 11+ (6+) differential needed to get it to a straight flip. It's expensive, but if your damage curve is significant, it can at worst force more card use on their part. 

I mean, this is true for most combats, but the lower Df makes it more likely to happen over time.

Counting on your opponent to flip weaks is a pretty poor tactic. And winning by 11+ is something that happens one in five games. Even if you flip a red joker, your opponent just needs to flip a 6 in Df 4 vs Stat 6 situation.

A good counter is something you can plan for and execute. 

[Adran]

37 minutes ago, Regelridderen said:

Counting on your opponent to flip weaks is a pretty poor tactic. And winning by 11+ is something that happens one in five games. Even if you flip a red joker, your opponent just needs to flip a 6 in Df 4 vs Stat 6 situation.

A good counter is something you can plan for and execute. 

Hard to wound is really a counter to cheatable damage flips, so if you don't try for cheatable damage flips, you have basically nullified it already.