nunorod Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 Is it really playable as it is? I have alot of new players starting Malifaux and while I am an ok collection already of rezer models I never tried Molly yet. But because the new players only have crew boxes I wanted to keep things simple. Why not trying Molly? I thought.Is it playable? I have some spirits or horrors (transmortis) to summon so that's not the issue, I also have Sybelle, Belles etc, but the thing is, starter box... i somewhat feel it's a bit underpowered? Phillip looks cool...but... Crooligans are nice but no killers. So do I have to support myself on the summonings? Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjoewoo Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 (edited) Molly's starter is probably not playable out of the box--it's a good way to pick up Molly, her totem, a new henchmen, and a set of great scheme runners all in one place, but the contents aren't good for beginner games because there's no fight, just a lot of scheme running and some utility tricks. Phillip is "new" in the sense he came out in 2E.I think you have to buy at least one other crew box/blister--Nico and Seamus' boxes come to mind--to be able to play Molly's box largely as is. For example...you can play a 35-40SS game with the box, but Molly can only take the Forgotton Life limited upgrade if she wants to summon anything other than the Necrotic machine and she will 100% be using it to resurrect the ranks of small children you sacrifice to the pack of Nephilim chasing you. Edited September 9, 2015 by benjoewoo 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MEGAHORSE Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 What Ben said. Molly's box is a really bad box if that's your only resser models. She really wants Seamus's box for the Belles and Sybelle, and Nicodem's for the Punks as beatsticks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirial Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 I don't think any crew boxes are playable as is, perhaps aside from Ramos, Dita, and Ophelia. It's not their purpose. The Kirai box cannot even be fielded at all. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirial Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 As said, Kirai has around 14 SS which means that you aren't allowed to field a Master. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirial Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 He is. But he doesn't need any help in the first place. Especially now that he can Channel charges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daniello_s Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 He is. But he doesn't need any help in the first place. Especially now that he can Channel charges.Aye. He should even have -10SS penalty for what he can do to his opponent. Only against Ressers he should have +10SS bonus just to torment them even more than normally he does :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengt Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 I don't think any crew boxes are playable as is, perhaps aside from Ramos, Dita, and Ophelia. It's not their purpose. The Kirai box cannot even be fielded at all.It's explicitly given as their purpose in the box on page 58. Which crew boxes succeed depends on your definition of playable. All wave 1 (and some wave 2) boxes can make legal and somewhat fun 30 SS crews. Most wont be very competitive but I think they playable as a first crew to learn the game with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirial Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 Okay, just not to make a discussion out of it: I think that being fielded legally and being playable for more than a test game are different things. I also don't think that they are designed to be played on their own for more than test games. They also don't start a player with the game. Nothing of that contradicts the box on p. 58. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengt Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 Okay, just not to make a discussion out of it: I think that being fielded legally and being playable for more than a test game are different things. I also don't think that they are designed to be played on their own for more than test games. They also don't start a player with the game. Nothing of that contradicts the box on p. 58.To me any lack of "longevity" with the wave 1 boxes is because they are so few stones rather than having a poor or boring selection of models. For instance, do you think that the boxes you listed as playable (Perdita, Ophelia and Ramos) are the only viable selections for a slow grow league?I don't understand what you mean with "They also don't start a player with the game.". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirial Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 I don't think that Slow Grow Leagues work that well in this game. If I want to play the game with the nuances in Strategies and Schemes and all that, even those three don't work too well. And I meant that there is a starter box for good reason: the Master sets are not starter boxes like the WM/H ones. They start a Master... they aren't balanced against each other, and not all of them are beginner friendly. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nunorod Posted September 9, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 I do have more models but that's not the point I'm trying to make or the question in issue. I also think that crew boxes and "legal" crews are different things when you are starting. Even not being legal I can surely use the Kirai box for a game or two to get a feel of the game. Seamus box is quite competent as are others. Crew box games I dont believe are intended to use points, they are just there to get you to the game. When I first started I even realized you needed more then just the box but it was ok for some startup games. That's why I was asking about the Molly box because it's one of those I feel lacks something. Of course, it's great to try scheme running so maybe each master has it's own crew box specialty, hence Molly being more focused on schemes, but if Kirai box is already streaching it, Mollys bow while point wise is more then Kirai lacks really something to be playable in a startup game. So i guess it's out of the question to play the box as a startup crew. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjoewoo Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 (edited) Depends what you mean. I picked up the Perdita box so that when I play with new players, I can just put that in play with little to no investment and have a good game where new players will still find a challenge as they grow in skill and grow their collection. Once they've got a fair grasp of the rules and have enough models to field a 40SS + army that isn't too much filler, I bring out the ov...Seamus crew. Edited September 9, 2015 by benjoewoo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted September 9, 2015 Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 If you are mainly looking to play the box as is, then no Molly's box probably isn't a good idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nunorod Posted September 9, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 9, 2015 Yep... I guess I have to try Molly on "regular" Points games. No biggie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cats Laughing Posted September 10, 2015 Report Share Posted September 10, 2015 I do have more models but that's not the point I'm trying to make or the question in issue. I also think that crew boxes and "legal" crews are different things when you are starting. Even not being legal I can surely use the Kirai box for a game or two to get a feel of the game. Seamus box is quite competent as are others. Crew box games I dont believe are intended to use points, they are just there to get you to the game. When I first started I even realized you needed more then just the box but it was ok for some startup games. That's why I was asking about the Molly box because it's one of those I feel lacks something. Of course, it's great to try scheme running so maybe each master has it's own crew box specialty, hence Molly being more focused on schemes, but if Kirai box is already streaching it, Mollys bow while point wise is more then Kirai lacks really something to be playable in a startup game. So i guess it's out of the question to play the box as a startup crew. You can play the Molly box as is, but you will need to realize that it lacks killing power outside of summons (which would generally be an additional purchase, as summoning back crooligans hardly helps with killing) and Molly's own attack spell. You wouldn't be hugely competitive against players with free selection of models, but against certain other boxed sets you could do fine. For instance, the Molly box set is much better at running schemes than the Rasputina box, and has certain ways (impossible to wound, hard to wound, the mist -> soft cover) to mitigate Rasputina's killing advantage. In this case, your scheme running advantage is so big that if the scheme pool is some combination of scheme marker schemes and interact schemes (distract/cursed object), with no killy schemes you can almost guarantee a Molly box win.In another example, the Somer box is a matchup where your Crooligans might feel somewhat killy, as bayou gremlins are pretty squishy. I'm sure there are other boxes where the Molly box as is could hold its own, especially with a good scheme pool. Conversely, yes, there are boxes that would present stiff challenges to the Molly box. I don't think a starter box vs free and open crew selection list, will be a fair fight in most cases (again, there are a few exceptions). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
valhallan42nd Posted September 10, 2015 Report Share Posted September 10, 2015 I'd say the most compatible box with Molly is Nicodem. I tend to run Molly with Mortimer, as she's undead and can be pushed with his Fresh Meat action, and Punk Zombies tend to be my favorite summon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freman Posted September 10, 2015 Report Share Posted September 10, 2015 So get Nicodem first, as a playable box, then add Molly for more options, and the Seamus box to round of the trinity. Then I'd say McMourning, Yan Lo, and Kirai, then Tara to finish off the masters. Then it's just a matter of adding extras. The University of Transmortis is great for the Valedictorian and the Students, an extra Flesh Construct doesn't go amiss, then there's the Rogue Necromancy... or two... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nunorod Posted September 10, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 10, 2015 Yep Like I told you I already own stuff That was not the issue in question.I don't like Nicodem playstyle mostly because I don't like the punk zombies concept... I don't think I am ever going to get them. The same goes for McMourning, don't like the style. I'm only probably getting the nurses because they seam real good, but even so...I don't like the concept, cool looking models... but...I have Kirai, Molly and Seamus, Flesh construct, University box, izamu, And I wanted all the tormented and spirits... but i'm afraid they are not out yet... I think next is Tara so I can take a step to Outcasts and use the tormented on jack daw 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MEGAHORSE Posted September 10, 2015 Report Share Posted September 10, 2015 Yep Like I told you I already own stuff That was not the issue in question.I don't like Nicodem playstyle mostly because I don't like the punk zombies concept... I don't think I am ever going to get them. The same goes for McMourning, don't like the style. I'm only probably getting the nurses because they seam real good, but even so...I don't like the concept, cool looking models... but...I have Kirai, Molly and Seamus, Flesh construct, University box, izamu, And I wanted all the tormented and spirits... but i'm afraid they are not out yet... I think next is Tara so I can take a step to Outcasts and use the tormented on jack dawI was unimpressed with Punks until I used them You dont want to hire them, but summoning them you get a 30mm model that needs 2AP to be removed, and can dish out some impressive damage with always getting a postive twist to attack flips, a Flurry, and finally, his 3" aoe 3 damage DEF resisted spinny move that Pandora HATES. They're my favorite summon alongside Flesh Constructs for their ability to tarpit and still be a threat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nunorod Posted September 10, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 10, 2015 I believe you lol, What I don't like are the models/concept... punks? in victorian age? Well I know it's fantasy and you can justify anything lol but it doesn't fit my notion of victorian steampunk... with katanas??? Punks? with katanas?... Too Wyrd (katching!) even for me. Maybe they came from the future...Nicodem...such a great concept and model... PUNKS????!!!But I believe they are great minions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirial Posted September 10, 2015 Report Share Posted September 10, 2015 Oy! What do you have against punks? Especially since we have a rock band now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengt Posted September 10, 2015 Report Share Posted September 10, 2015 Get some proxies or make some from the multipart kits that look less like anachronistic punks. Dead guys dual wielding swords can't be confused for anything else, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirial Posted September 10, 2015 Report Share Posted September 10, 2015 I also saw someone just cutting off their mohawks. Looks okay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengt Posted September 10, 2015 Report Share Posted September 10, 2015 I also saw someone just cutting off their mohawks. Looks okay.Sounds a bit too easy... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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