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benjoewoo

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  1. benjoewoo

    Reva Tactics and Samples

    No worries. With the announcement of M3E, however, my log is short lived on how useful it will be. I would just play with what you have until the stat cards come out, because I suspect Reva won't be running as she is now--thematic hiring has a large emphasis, and my lists all run basically nothing from the box except the weird shield bearers build.
  2. benjoewoo

    Reva Tactics and Samples

    I'll assume you own only the following, so no crew box add-ons. Reva McMourning Seamus Nicodem Flesh Construct 3 Canine Remains Carrion Effigy 5 Mindless Zombies Carrion Emissary Rafkin I'm unsure how you would get some of these models without the crew boxes, particularly Reva, given that she only comes in a crew box AFAIK. I hope you have the upgrades, but this'll lead to one of my points to save money: proxy. A lot of people don't like proxies if you've been in the game a while, but if you're new I don't think they'll have an issue. Print the cards off--either through the card ordering program, drivethrurpg (I think that's the official vendor) or bringing your books. Malifaux has a rule set that is essentially written for models that are coins. The rules are written so you could play with just bases--if you buy a bunch of bases ($5-10) then you have unlimited models to proxy theoretically. But, assuming you want to play with real models, I'd suggested the following: Reva--7 SS pool (3 cache), the non-charge limited upgrade, 2 SS no-SS on damage upgrade with 4" no healing aura, 2 SS no-damage reduction upgrade--just play this until you're more familiar with Reva, and when you get more models start experimenting with others. (5ss upgrades, 4ss saved) Flesh Construct (6ss) 3 Canine Remains (15ss) Carrion Emissary with My Little Helper (11ss) Rafkin with a 2 SS Upgrade (9ss) Rafkin is not useful really, but at least he's a decent scheme runner hunter. Expect him to die every game, probably around Turns 2-3. Turn 1 is your power play set up turn, or it can be your power play if your opponent doesn't play correctly. You want to get at least 1-2 opposing models off the board, preferably efficient scheme runners or a major target. the 1ss limited upgrade drops a corpse candle with from the shadows 1.5--math allows that if you use its activation early, it can walk, kill itself, and drop a corpse marker within 3" of a model despite the range restriction on summoning--the only issue is whether you'll have the marker in position to hit the thing. Practice learning how to get the first, aggressive strike, by timing activations so that your opponent plays off schedule or forces early attacks to mitigate AP efficiency come Turn 2. Once you're competent with that, practice anticipatory position so that the candle blocks off movement--Reva's threatened reach is often more effective than the actual thing. Reva's activation usually blows all your good cards, so I'd be careful of doing it too early and losing a lot of your threat for the Turn. Your remaining models are for activation control and getting schemes. Rafkin should look for a kill. You want to take out a big target kill, e.g. supporting henchmen or high investment enforcer, but 1-2 scheme runners isn't bad. Emissary should try to activate before Reva to set up blockades and mitigate AP efficiency and set up future turrets and activations. I often use MLH Turn 1 depending on board layout because with two sets of shards, you can literally lock your opponent into a pass or lock them out of an area for you to get in position. Turn 2 will often be the turn you win the game if things go to plan, or at least bring the game to a push so that it comes down to the cards--crew composition matters here and it's where playing average numbers is most important. Reva needs to kill a high priority target during this turn. Emissary will almost guaranteed use MLH this turn if it hasn't Turn 1--position lockout is one of the best ways to mitigate AP efficiency. Everyone else does whatever. Turn 3 you should be cleaning up if things went well or flipping cards to try and make things work. Carrion Emissary is likely dead by now, but if not go for a hurrah charge on a key piece or cause as much damage as you can, blocking off the escape or blocking off another model(s). Everyone else does w/e. Reva's activation will almost always be discard a card to summon a candle and attacking. In an ideal world you already have a corpse in position and you spend 3 AP attacking with the 0 for the finish as needed. Generally you'll use 3 AP to attack and the 0 to reposition to your summons--you can summon up to 8" away but can only teleport to one within 5", resulting in almost 8" of movement. Your SS is basically 1 per turn to cycle two cards pre-turn. 1 SS for the 0 to finish as needed. I pretty much only use stones otherwise for datuse-ba summons if I think it'll get me a significant amount of advantage or if I need to save Reva towards the end of her life. Funnily you can be very conservative on SS prevention, just using them to save her at the end as needed. You can't really afford to lose her at any point because you won't have the force threat, but you don't generally need to stone for suits, just to save her as needed. But, 5 turns of card cycling is basically 2 stones to spare.
  3. benjoewoo

    Reva Tactics and Samples

    I've stopped playing for a long while, but I do know some of the models, having seen the previews. I'm not sure if it's still the trend here, but most of the time (from my perspective) people recommend playing first and then choosing models to purchase. Since models are mostly evergreen, there's not a huge incentive to purchase everything and then figure it out, but rather figure out what you need based on play style and level of competitive play you want and purchasing to taste. For example, I don't play McM, so I don't need flesh constructs. It is possible getting them won't be "wasteful" if you play McM or you find you like running them for one reason or the other, but when I was playing, I didn't find them fitting how I played at the level I wanted to play. I ask the play style and competitive level you want to play at first because that sets the beginning, and most important, limitations--(1) money, and (2) tolerance for adjustment. If you want to play a themed crew for Reva, where you play vincent and the shield bearers, filling the rest of the crew to taste, buy and play whatever gets you the most fulfillment in games, win or lose. There is NOTHING wrong with that because this is a leisure activity. This arguably also stresses money and tolerance for adjustment to a minimum. If you want to play strictly competitively at high levels, I would probably not play ressers--listen to people who consistently win/place well in hard fought tournaments, e.g. max value podcast, and copy what they do. That'll get you the most bang for your buck and get you the competitive edge. I actually more or less swapped to Arcanists because of my issues with ressers after having tried the "top tier" masters by popular vocal opinion. This stresses money the least and tolerance for adjustment to the max, as you'll often be playing "best of" rather than models you like. If you want to play competitively as much as you can with ressers, see below. Keep in mind I'm probably fairly outdated, having not played in a while, especially in the context of GG2018. Also, Malifaux is a unique game at least for how rulings are done, because the rules set has some quirks that are, unfortunately, very key to how well certain masters can perform. I'll go over them in detail below, because they affect Reva to varying degrees, but they are: (1) Ht rules; and (2) RAW (rules as worded) vs. RAI (rules as intended). Playing what ressers do best will moderately stress funds and be a large, though less than strictly competitive play, stress on tolerance for adjustment. Reva's main strengths are being a cannon equipped for the crew you'll likely face and having one activation, possibly two, tricks that can blindside your opponent's tempo/plan. This does not make her a generalist as I understand the term in Malifaux--she is more favorable in match ups where she can quickly (1-2 activations, or 1-2 turns) eliminate the largest threats on her own, allowing her relatively minimal crew to maximize their AP. As I noted in the log previously, your crews will tend to be elite ones. This tends to mean you do well on area control type strategies & schemes ("S&S") where your opponent must engage you, as opposed to S&S where activation counts really matter. Keep that in mind when evaluating models--will they directly help you in ensuring you can control the intended situation better than the/an alternative(s)? Keep in mind Reva essentially costs 4-8 SS to play by herself--I would generally consider her favored against Arcanists, but to get to 7SS pool I need 4 (3 cache) plus 5 SS in upgrades between a limited and the 2 SS no-reduction and 2 SS no-SS upgrades. Joss cries if he's against you, but you're giving up a higher end (for resser) model to load up Reva. I don't recommend swapping sybelle with belles because that list is mostly for fun. It can get your opponent hard if they don't know how to play around it or if their crew is just incapable of dealing with it, but often times the opponent will simply wait for you to disperse your belles and pick you apart from there. It's fun to have 7 Wk belles sprint from deployment to do stuff, but I'm unsure how often that kind of thing matters in that build. The same kind of goes for Philip & the Nanny, though a little less so because Philip can at least be an anti-scheme runner and can nicely set up Reva's card pool as necessary. However, Philip almost always requires an escort, usually a dead doxy, to maximize his card cycle. That's 14 SS without any upgrades on Philip, though when I ran him I usually did this because he was 14 SS for up to 6 cards cycled a turn. Moderately useful. I suggest running Datsue-ba because she is a fairly competent fighter for later activation, and is a spirit who can benefit from Reva's alternative upgrades. Activation control can be important, and having a bunch of seishin to buy you time is nice. Her ability to summon off kills is also fairly nice, provided you can hit the triggers--I try not to SS or save cards for these as Reva is the main drain on cards. I don't know what Asura Rotten does in great detail, but having learned some of her card via podcast, I'm not super impressed as far as synergy with Reva. You basically need your "elite" crew to run S&S for you, and she seems capable of it, though I'm unsure how she performs in the current environment. The markers are cool, MZ summons are nice for extra activations and corpse markers, but I don't know if she offers a whole lot for getting S&S done for you. Your choices with Reva AFAIK should largely be heavy hitters or more durable S&S runners. Bete Noire can be cool, but requires the opposing crew to trigger her ability to be regularly useful--you can have her pop out of your stuff, like the 13 SS version I forget--outcast enforcer that has to charge when able. Bete Noire is not the missile that guy is, so you may not get the mileage, especially if you clutch a 10 to ensure the ability goes off. She's also mostly unfavorable against certain crews, namely the ones that turn off defensive abilities/triggers. Yin can be polarizing. When I first started, I got yin on Fetid Strumpet and others' recommendations. After playing her for some time, I realized she has severe limitations outside a Wp oriented crew. Against Guild you can't play her--she'll get eaten alive by the firing lines with all their positive flips. Somewhat the same for TT, Gremlins, Arcanists, etc. I think you get the idea of why I may not like her too much because every faction has crew options that get repetitive, relatively low cost positive flips. Terrifying can be nice, but in my experience usually doesn't pan out. That being said, if you can pull off her 0, possibly getting a second shot with MLH, you can really hurt your opponent for the Reva activation. Arguably cheaper to ensure it goes off with the Ca 6 and only needing to do it once, but two models over two separate activations is fairly expensive when Yin costs 8 SS and Reva somewhere between 4-8 SS. I generally don't run her unless the board terrain is unusual in having dense buildings and things for her to fly over. What I didn't do was explain how Ht and RAW vs. RAI factor into those models. Reva manipulates LoS and Ht rules to make life hard or just dumb for your opponent. Because she is Ht 3, she literally sees in a right angle over anything that isn't Ht3 or higher. Because most people don't like building boards with lots of terrain that's Ht 2 and above, this means on many boards, Reva will literally see everything from behind the best cover. This is important because your corpse markers are Ht 0 and 30mm, meaning you will be able to effectively see around corners to your opponent--Reva sees over a wall to a corpse marker that has normal LoS to the Ht 2 and below model on the other side of a wall, and you blast them with your normal attack. This may warp your local area into incorporating higher Ht terrain--there was a lot of discussion on this when Reva first released. If your area simply includes lots of Ht 3 and greater impassable terrain for when you play Reva, you're basically winning when you employ datsue-ba, who literally ghosts anywhere she damn well pleases, or Yin, who can fly over them, albeit with some difficult at Wk 4--Datuse-ba at Wk 6 often gets through most terrain, hence my preference for her. NPEs are more likely to result if the local group starts blocking off large sections of the board to disable Reva LoS. If your area starts including lots of Ht 3 and greater passable terrain, the real fun begins, depending on how you guys play. I virtually never use the triggers on Reva's card when I take the 2 SS no-reduction upgrade, and when I don't, I rarely look at the triggers because they're usually not relevant. But, the only way to avoid LoS with Reva and (often) remain relevant to the game is to be on top of the passable Ht 3 or greater terrain. However, because range is measured top down and Ht 3 is above Ht 2, you now care about 2 of your triggers generally speaking, because a mask means you smack them for 3 pre-reduction/SS, and then the push throws them off the ledge for another 3 damage pre-reduction/SS in a separate tick. Fall damage in Malifaux is strictly equal to Ht value rounded up for any remainder, so long as Ht exceeds Ht 2. Depending on your RAW vs. RAI, a model instant falls if a push/pull moves a model in any portion over the ledge of a building, or you have to move it off completely. If you have to move it completely off, it's virtually impossible to make models fall, because your opponent will put models at the edge of the 2" to maximize range requirements and allow for LoS. Theoretically, the second push should push the model off, but RAW vs. RAI because of top down measurement. With that, Datsue-ba manipulates Ht better than the other choices because of Wk 6, above average, and being a spirit, which allows Reva's alternative 1 SS upgrade to push, turn her into a corpse marker, and let datsue-ba use a 0, which could be a walk for another spirit or a seishin summon. Bete, Yin, and Asura can't do this, so this is where you learn a bit of crew building--do these alternatives give me options that are better than datsue-ba? RAW and RAI is actually the primary reason I don't run sybelle. There are a lot of game making plays you can do with Sybelle but for RAW vs. RAI. Comply from Sybelle should in theory allow you to force fail your opponent's model on Sybelle's on Terrifying 12, effectively killing the model for that turn and some of the next. I posted a rules question if you decide to look it up, but the conversation didn't go so well. RAW favors my interpretation when I last checked, RAI prevents you according to any TO for a tournament and the vocal parts of the community. If the ruling ever changes, I would slot Sybelle in a heartbeat because she presents an incredible threat alongside datsue-ba. As it is, she is an "either or" type with datsue-ba, so I often pick datuse-ba over sybelle. Also, Reva enjoys Ht manipulation because 18" is really far, allowing her to often reach corpse markers with ease once the game reaches Turn 2. If she is 3" from the edge of a Ht 3 or higher terrain, she can see and reach just as easily through her corpse markers generally speaking--with sufficient Ht 3 or greater terrain this is not true, but that much Ht 3 or greater terrain likely makes the game NPE and/or unplayable for most crews. The extra inch generally means she's that much further for range calculation purposes and may be in a position of impunity--e.g. hiding on a circular water silo in the center with 3" from any edge, she can't be melee attacked by anyone who doesn't climb up, braving at least 1-2 turns of attacks. Importantly, Carrion Emissary has this kind of manipulation, and he's often in my crew along with datsue-ba, with both having MLH and datsue-ba with the seishin summoning upgrade. When Emissary summons the markers he has to summon them in LoS. Usually not an issue, but sometimes you need to wall off a shooter on a building or have safe cover and room to get onto a roof. RAW vs. RAI, Emissary can't see markers Ht 3 or greater if they were just markers, but ability makes them Ht 5, so theoretically you could place them 5" from the edge provided you're close enough already. I'm sure someone will see this and post issues with my post--discussion is good if it's resolved officially. Without clear rulings--though I admittedly haven't followed up on my original rules issues since I've stopped, playing ressers is much more of a gamble because you need the rules to operate consistently in a certain fashion to make some plays. I would start with datsue-ba, play with emissary, get the upgrade pack to put MLH on each of them, and play with what you have, because you've got various henchmen and some varying levels of other models. Once you figure out your playstyle, purchase from there. If your group lets comply do self-terrifying, I'd slot sybelle and datsue-ba in together instantly. I think the log covers my thoughts to supplement pretty adequately because it was up to date when I was still regularly playing. I might change that I think spirit henchmen/enforcers are better with living/undead minions, though I never really got to test that too much. I know this is a lot for the post--hope it sheds new light on a starting point.
  4. benjoewoo

    Reva wrecking face?

    @Ludvig A lot of the terrain I play on locally consists of medium square buildings with flat or slightly slanted roofs that easily allow models to stand on them. Many of them are Ht 3, so if Reva is > 3" from the ledge, she is invisible from that ledge. This results in the odd interaction where she gets her 21"+ range with the option to move out of LoS. Costs an AP and her 0, but she gets 2 attacks with relative impunity. It only takes 1 such building to achieve the set up. Reva is not as abusive as Raspy or seem as untouchable/unkillable as Seamus for capitalizing on terrain, but the combination of all three makes it easier to simply not play with being able to go onto the roofs in the first place. As a result, Reva often has large areas she can't see, so her range is rarely oppressive. That, and her lack of quality activation control make it fairly easy to mitigate her Turn 1, possibly Turn 2, activations. At least locally, sniper spam isn't particularly common. People often bring a trapper/katanaka, with the odd Nino or Hanz, but they don't often have oppressive situations because of the high scatter count and building distributions we use.
  5. benjoewoo

    Reva wrecking face?

    Reva: Champion of the Bronies, Master of casual level meta change. I've noticed since Book 4 some of my opponents have started defining flat elevated terrains, roofs usually, as impassable. Slightly less often but somewhat more odd is defining many building interiors as impassable. I suspect the reason is LoS shenanigans, probably internally thought of as abuse. I usually primarily Seamus, Kirai, Raspy, Sandeep, or Reva, most of whom require tight rules usage for LoS, especially vantage point. Reva is on the more extreme end of needing precise usage of LoS rules, and depending on your view, could require more common rules consultation than even Seamus, given how LoS is determined. I don't think Reva's rules are as bad as Raspy, just more obvious because if someone casually plays a bunch of fences and small ruins on a map, then abandon hope, all ye who enter. It might be earlier in this thread or in another similarly themed one, but terrain will really affect Reva. If you have only Ht 2 or less terrain, Reva can be Eye of Sauron + Death Star. If you have all Ht 3+ terrain, you'll play a game of hide and seek or Reva can start abusing vantage point rules. Varying terrain design will mitigate a large part of Reva's map control/force projection, depending which terminology you use. It's particularly significant here because Reva presents an anomaly in Malifaux--she's utilizes an efficient, easy to grasp long range mechanic in a faction where all the other options tend to be melee oriented. Her often compared to peers come from factions that generally utilize range, so it's not as surprising. At the casual level, this is likely a more devastating effect than at the competitive level, especially if the terrain isn't varied enough to prevent the Eye of Sauron + Death Star effect. I would note that despite the chatter in this thread and some others, Reva hasn't made a visibly large splash in the competitive scene.
  6. benjoewoo

    Seamus v Reva, When and Why?

    You pick Seamus over Reva when: Your collection doesn't include Reva You're demo-ing the game Your terrain is all literally Ht 3+, blocking, and impassable on top You're running belle spam In more seriousness, I'd pick Seamus over Reva based on match up choices. I prefer Seamus to capitalize against certain factions because of their vulnerability to Wp duels, so basically specific Neverborn and TT masters. Alternatively, in GG 2017's high activation favoring scheme/strat line up, I prefer Seamus where the pool requires having higher activation counts and/or I can't rely on Reva to gain activation advantage via killing stuff. Seamus also tends to run independently of his crew moreso than Reva and will usually be more reliable to pin 6 VP on. While the above are true, I have found few situations where the benefits were large enough to warrant the decision--Seamus is preferable in certain match ups--but he's not the anti-faction master of my choice, and generally doesn't make the cut over Reva on merits as opposed to flavor pick. Belle Spam 2018 when that new hench model from the new book releases. #MakeBellesGr8Again.
  7. benjoewoo

    Considering kirai

    I recommend listening to Schemes & Stones' master spotlight on Kirai. The person being interviewed on the podcast sets out his rather unorthodox Kirai list. It's a very powerful list, and funnily will utilize the sebastian from McM's box set, which you'll get if you get McM's box. The only other major piece from a box set would be Philip from Molly's box set--Molly can be a spirit summoner as well though, so gives you a different take on spirit summoning. Kirai is like using a precision rifle while Molly is more using a bazooka. While the podcast doesn't explain activation by activation play, it's not particularly hard to figure out after a few dry-runs, and it's a pretty consistent list. I'd recommend doing the unorthodox one if you want more "competitive" kirai right away. Alternatively, you could hire the Flesh Construct from McM's box and use it as a summoning battery, bringing the construct back to full with the nurse so you can rinse and repeat as desired.
  8. benjoewoo

    Do you know who I am

    I'm also cautiously optimistic. Barring a hired Hanged, the upgrade favors activating Seamus earlier so that the 0 "hits" more targets. I think per the rulebook, if a model has already passed Seamus' printed Terrifying 12, then the 0 would not work because it's from the same model. I don't think this will significantly hamper Seamus, as you would position and/or plan to him to activate relatively early as needed if you take this upgrade. This also seems a good potential denial upgrade for position based schemes such as Turf War, Extraction, Guard the Stash, etc. Seems to have good synergy with Sin Rep, but if the opponent cheats 1 guy or has someone who doesn't get pushed, this may hurt quite a bit because you're stuck with the printed melee action if you're still engaged. Seamus is really starting to be a spirit master if he's getting an upgrade that favors hiring Hanged and, by extension, Datsue-ba.
  9. benjoewoo

    Prompt enemy crew

    Quick corollary to main question--if I utilize Perdita's Obey, targeting opposing Cassandra, succeed, and take the Understudy action to use the opposing Colette's Prompt, could I prompt my Francisco to take a 1 AP action? I guess the real question is--to Obey type effects inherently change what models are friendly/enemy to each other? In Sybelle's case the card explicitly states the complied model treats Sybelle as friendly, but Obey does not, for example. For reference, Obey: Target non-Leader model immediately performs a (1) Action chosen and controlled by this model’s controller. A model which performed an Attack due to Obey may not be targeted by Obey again during the same Activation. Understudy: Take a (1) Ca Action belonging to target friendly non-Leader model within 8”. This Action may target friendly Leader models if they have the Showgirl Characteristic. This Action may only be used once per Turn. Prompt: Push target other friendly model up to 3" in any direction, then the target may perform a (1) Action.
  10. benjoewoo

    Prompt enemy crew

    Assume Sybelle successfully hits Colette with the Bleeder Lash attack, triggering the Comply trigger. Assume Seamus is leading the crew containing Sybelle, and Colette is an opposing master. Assume Seamus has the Bag O' Tools upgrade. Assume all three models are within 1" of each other. Can Sybelle Comply Colette to prompt Seamus into utilizing the Ml attack printed on Bag O'Tools to hit Colette?
  11. Yeah, that sounds about right given design tendencies. I thought the reason they may have done it as X pushes specifically because it would be less advantageous than a move, and it's a guaranteed push on your own models since it's after succeeding. Combined with the ability to get "free" tomes for extra distance, it seemed like it was an intentional balance to give multi directional pushes against having the pushes guarantee going through.
  12. For the Oxfordian Mage's Elemental Bolt, there is a trigger on a tome to push the target up to 2" for each tome in the duel total. For reference, the text reads: "Windblast: After succeeding, push target up to 2" for each tome in the duel total." Based on the wording, is it one push that is up to 2*n, where N is the number of tomes? Or, is it X "up to 2 inches" pushes, where X is the number of tomes?
  13. Thanks for the answer--so the end result would be that Phiona places at the edge of the aura due to Gravity Well, pushes the Marshal away, and then takes the (1) Ml action? Want to make sure I have it right.
  14. Assume Anna Lovelace and Rotten Belle are in a crew facing against Phiona and a Death Marshal. Rotten Belle and Death Marshal are now engaged by virtue of Belle luring in the Marshal. Belle is fully within Anna's 8" auras, most importantly Gravity Well, with her closest base edge <1" of the closest edge of Anna's auras. The Death Marshal is partially in the aura, with half of its base out of the aura such that the Belle would not block the Marshal's push assuming the Marshal were to be pushed away from the Belle. Phiona, not engaged with any model, uses 1 AP for "Look Out!" targeting Belle. I don't have Phiona's card or access to my book, but I do remember Phiona's action has an "and" between her placement into base to base with the rotten belle and pushing friendly engaged model(s) up to 4" away. The next sentence then details Phiona may take a (1) Ml action. What would happen? Would nothing happen with regards to the place AND push due to the "and" in the action text? Alternatively, would Phiona be placed at the edge of the aura, per Anna's aura, then getting the push? Also alternatively, would Phiona's place fail entirely because it cannot fulfill the base to base requirement and just get the push? I don't think the (1) Ml action portion of the action would be affected, but it is also not likely relevant unless Phiona actually places, given she can't ignore LoS requirements for her Ml actions. Phiona has a reach of 2 or 3", so if she were to place at the edge of the aura, she would be able to attack Belle. I haven't found references in the rulebook saying "and" between two effects requires both to occur in order for either to occur, so am unclear on the interaction. Any and all help appreciated!
  15. benjoewoo

    Witchling Stalker and Searing Mark on death

    I think that's what I'm trying to clarify. Explosive Demise specifically references when the model is killed. Searing Mark does not. Does that distinction matter?
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