Mortimer Isnt Worth 9ss

[D-A-C]

Hey guys.

Exactly what the title says.

How on earth is Mortimer 9ss?

He has practically zero defence with thanks to no H2W, because for most of the major melee or shooting nasties defence 5 is no barrier for their 6's and 7's. Sure he has 11 Wounds and Regen 1, but a Flesh construct has 13 Wounds, Regen 1 (thanks to Poison) AND H2W and all for 3ss cheaper.

Ok, well maybe his offence makes up for it ... nope.

Shovel isnt bad with 2" range, melee 7, but its trigger isn't that much help to Mortimer in CC with something nasty, unlike Madame Sybelles Whip which has useful triggers (and even though you need to by a Bleeder Lash Upgrade it still brings her 1ss cheaper than Mortimer).

He can throw Poison ... great that'll stop the Viks, Taelor, Lady J etc charging and killing stuff next turn ... or maybe not.

Well, I suppose he also has ... no actually nothing else, a moderately useful Shovel that suffers due to his limited number of AP and a poison ranged attack that is not very useful.

Well, at least Nicodem can speed him up with Rigor Mortis ... oh wait, he can't because Mortimer is living, so that's no help. I guess I'll have to pay 2ss extra to have Mortimer walk twice and use Fresh Meat. That sure is 11ss well spent.

Honestly, compared to the two other Henchmen Sybelle and Sebastian, how is anyone using Mortimer?

I know you can use Corpse Bloat on him, but that plus his extra Ca Action Upgrade puts you at 13ss which is never worth it. So its either one or the other.

I suggested it in another thread (that has no responses yet) but it would be better to put Corpse Bloat on Nicodem because he rarely dies in game, has zero CC ability and so could use Corpse Bloat if absolutely stuck, then you could have Mortimer first turn poison Nicodem so he gets regen 1 for three turns thanks to one of his Upgrades.

But that's beside the point.

There is simply no way I can see that Mortimer justifies his 9ss cost let alone 11ss with an Upgrade or worse 12/13ss.

So, am I missing something, or is Mortimer just poor for his cost?

Overall he seems like the makings of an 8ss model that needs a few tweaks, but at present I dont think he is worth it at all.

Edit

Also, unless they edited this in final edition (I'm using Beta) he also has the lowest starting Cache of the 3 Resser Henchmen AND he costs more than them, whilst doing less.

So he isnt even good running as a Henchman, especially consideing he has no summons, so one of his abilities is useless on his own.

Edited September 30, 2013 by D-A-C

[rancor709]

Wow couldn't disagree with you more.

Point 1 fresh meat provides movement to your crew you van target your own models meaning free auto walks.

Fling rot combine Mortimer with dogs fling rot get 1 action charges profit.

Make a corpse for 2 actions and 9+ card.

Mortimer trigger to drop corpses in combat with his high vbnumbers.

On top of all of this chatyu 6in aura of no interacts is huge. Its quite funny to me that you don't rate him I have a hard time not including him over the other 2 henchman as my default

[Mike3838]

Also, unless they edited this in final edition (I'm using Beta) he also has the lowest starting Cache of the 3 Resser Henchmen AND he costs more than them, whilst doing less.

So he isnt even good running as a Henchman, especially consideing he has no summons, so one of his abilities is useless on his own.

If he's your Leader, and using his cache, it doesn't matter how many SS he costs, because you get him for free.

Henchman caches were balanced by ensuring that more expensive Henchmen had smaller caches (because they're more powerful, allegedy). That's merely a core game design mechanic, not an issue with Morty.

As Rancor says though, you seem to have overlooked some of his key functions, so I'd suggest giving him another look. Chatty is very powerful.

[Helm]

Have you tried examining the combos that Mortimer can set up? I guess the simplest would be Mortimer with Nicodem; the guy's fuelled by Corpse Counters, and Mortimer only needs a Crow while attacking to drop one. That's enough to back up Mortimer with a Punk Zombie, who'll appear directly next to an enemy ready to Flurry.

Mortimer's also a Henchman, so can carry the likes of Decaying Aura. Combine *that* with the Punk Zombie, and suddenly the Flurry is a little scarier.

Another one I heard from Sonova was running Mortimer alongside Tara. Tara is an Undead, so Fresh Meat will boost her a little more towards the enemy. Mortimer with McMourning can dump Poison on friends and enemies alike, and he's one of the few models that you can simply grant an extra AP to for 2 points.

Mortimer's not going to rock up the board like some and kill everything on his own, but he's a very good support piece with plenty of possible combos.

[Clement]

Morty is really much more support focused then the other henchmen, so he has a tougher time earning back his points back on his own.

I've had a lot of luck with him personally, some of my thoughts.

1) pair him with graveyard spirit. The armor 2 he dishes out makes Morty very durable as he camps out being chatty.

2) his upgrade. In general summoning is easier for Seamus and Nicodem, and Mortimer is the best there is at making corpse markers. His upgrade let's him churn out markers And keep moving.

3) fling rot. This + canine remains = awesome

[ttsgosadow]

Ran mort with seamus a couple of times, and loved it! Gives a way different playstyle then with Sybelle. Also feel he's a tank

[D-A-C]

Point 1 fresh meat provides movement to your crew you van target your own models meaning free auto walks.

Yeah, but in order to get much use out of it you have to spend 2ss and bring his cost up to 11ss thanks to the upgrade My Favourite Shovel so you can double Walk then use it otherwise you've only moved 4" if you single Walk and use it. Plus it uses a 9 so it isnt exactly automatic.

Fling rot combine Mortimer with dogs fling rot get 1 action charges profit.

That's not a terrible idea admittedly, but why should a 9ss model be forced to take 8ss worth of models to be good (usually you need x2 Canine Remains realisticly to avoid having one shot to pieces)?

Make a corpse for 2 actions and 9+ card.

So your 9ss model does nothing for a Turn? That's almost 1/5 of the crew, its not so bad if your running Bodyguard as you can keep him somewhat back churning out Corpse Counters, but a 4ss Canine Remain has the same action for the same cost minus the built in crow. I understand the built in crow is a BIG difference maker but still, wasting your entire activation with a 9ss model to dig up a corpse isnt great IMO, thats why so many people attach Corpse Bloat to him so he can still move, interact, drop scheme markers etc.

Mortimer trigger to drop corpses in combat with his high vbnumbers.

That's a somewhat useful trigger, but it doesnt help Mortimer in the immediacy of the combat like Madame Sybelle's Trigger's do for example. So he might very well produce an additional Corpse Counter ... himself, and he can't be resummoned (how cool would it be if there was a Living and Undead version of Mortimer and Nicodem could raise an Undead Mortimer back to life!)

On top of all of this chaty 6in aura of no interacts is huge.

Again, its useful, but 9ss useful?

If he's your Leader, and using his cache, it doesn't matter how many SS he costs, because you get him for free.

Well it does in the sense that Sybelle and Sebastian start with 1 and 2 extra SS in their cache's respectively so that is an extra Upgrade or 2 paid for right away.

Have you tried examining the combos that Mortimer can set up? I guess the simplest would be Mortimer with Nicodem; the guy's fuelled by Corpse Counters, and Mortimer only needs a Crow while attacking to drop one. That's enough to back up Mortimer with a Punk Zombie, who'll appear directly next to an enemy ready to Flurry.

True, but I'm finding that without H2W he actual gets alot of straight flips against him if your not careful and his Regen 1 doesnt cut it, especially considering he can't benefit from Decay or Rigor Mortis from Nicodem to help him out with either Healing of Fast.

If he dies in CC that isnt really a good use of a 9ss model IMO just to get a Punk Zombie to Flurry something. And as I said your really risking him throwing him out there for a full activation while you wait for Nicodem to s

Mortimer's also a Henchman, so can carry the likes of Decaying Aura. Combine *that* with the Punk Zombie, and suddenly the Flurry is a little scarier.

Edited September 30, 2013 by D-A-C

[DeleteAccount]

Abilities that screw with Scheme Marker placement and that remove them still haven't actually sunk in on just how tremendously powerful they are, so I suspect he will be seen with better eyes when people start noticing that he can screw a while 13" circle of the table by himself and demanding attention.

Anyway, as stated, he is a support piece and the best vessel for Corpse Bloat we have, I tried it on Sybelle and it was not a good idea and I have no interest in blowing Nicodem's 0 action and taking 3 wds to put a corpse next to him, I want my corpses in the front lines.

Mortimer will die, the thing is how much of an annoyance he will be till he kicks it. I do avoid mostly using the shovel, since his Casting Expert becomes almost useless the moment he gets engaged. Also, his damage is meh, but he is packing Ml 7, other models may have higher severe, but at the end of the day, most of your attacks will deal Wk and Morti connects a lot better than others.

[Mister Shine]

Im sure other people will fill in other voids, but throwing Mort in an undead crew lets you have everyone take a double walk towards a model of your choice (within 14"). Im a big fan of sending a necropunk up (which conveniently moves up exactly 14" with leap). With the shovel upgrade its a triple walk. Getting a (Sy)Belle pack up 15" in the first turn puts them right where I'll want Seamus to Back Alley.

Oh lord do I love Mort in a Seamus crew

[Fetid Strumpet]

As you pointed out, nothing he does considered by itself is worth 9 SS, however collectively he is certainly worth his cost.

Everything in this game is about Synergy, and he offers a large degree of synergy with multiple elements of the Resser builds and strengths.

Let's consider that a Rotten Belle is a Really solid support piece, and she runs 5 SS. For 4 SS more you not only get alot of support, via Creating Corpses and Fling Rot, but he also has a MASSIVE bubble of no interact actions, which is hugely powerful, and he can actually fight when he gets into combat, and better than any of the other Resser Henchmen. Sure Sybelle might have better triggers IF you buy her upgrade, but at the end of the day she has 1 less ML on her lash than Mort has on his Shovel, and that is huge.

Mort might have 1 less DF and no Hard to Wound, but he has more Wounds base than Sybelle does. In my own personal experience I tend to find they die at about the same rate, and in Mort's case if the enemy wants to spend all the actions it takes to remove him, and then give me the Corpse Marker he drops when he dies, then that, in my estimation, is totally worth the cost of bringing him from the beginning.

Also his Cache size follows the general Henchman formulation of Cost + Cache = 13, so I don't think there is any issue there. I think Mort is worth his cost, although I personally don't use him all that often, mainly because I don't own Nicodem.

[Helm]

As you pointed out, nothing he does considered by itself is worth 9 SS, however collectively he is certainly worth his cost.

This, ultimately. Mortimer helps in almost any conceivable situation and will ably support any Master.

Mortimer's far away from the enemy and you're worried about him dying? Well done, Undead models of your choice get a triple-walk towards whatever models you fancy within 14". You can't measure that kind of value in stones; every one of Mortimer's AP can be increased twofold at least in this way.

Mortimer's close-in? Suddenly Corpse Counters. Nicodem's got free fuel for all his abilities, which is massive against someone like Pandora or Ramos who would be counting on denying you Corpse Counters. You'll have difficulty measuring the value of this in stones, but every CC within 8" of Nicodem equals two Wds and 1 Card for one 0 Action. Two cards then discarding two equals one stone, and one damage prevention flip equals one stone. I'm putting each CC used in this way at 2 stones, and Mortimer doesn't even have to use Actions to dig them up like a dog does; it's a Ml trigger.

Scheme Pool with lots of Interact actions needed? Mortimer's a great help. Chatty shuts down all Interacts within 6; I invite you to actually take a tape measure and look at how big a circle that is. You won't find an easy way to convert that ability to stones, because cutting off VP is literally what wins you the game.

You can shoot down each of his abilities individually, because none of them alone can be proven to be worth 9 stones and they're all useless in a specific tailored situation, but they really come together alongside Nicodem. Mortimer's got far more utility than Sybelle; she's better than him at moving Belles around, but if you're able to say "what if I don't want to use dogs", it's perfectly reasonable to substitute "what if I don't want to use Belles".

A lack of HtW isn't enough to hold this guy back.

[Sonova]

Ressers are the faction most reliant on cross model synergies to pull off the win since none of the Resser powerhouse models (ie. Izamu, Dead Rider, Rogue Necromancy) are actually in the game yet.

Mortimer gives ALOT of synergy for your undead models. That said if you are putting him in melee by choice you are probably doing it wrong.

[zFiend]

Im sure other people will fill in other voids, but throwing Mort in an undead crew lets you have everyone take a double walk towards a model of your choice (within 14"). Im a big fan of sending a necropunk up (which conveniently moves up exactly 14" with leap). With the shovel upgrade its a triple walk. Getting a (Sy)Belle pack up 15" in the first turn puts them right where I'll want Seamus to Back Alley.

Oh lord do I love Mort in a Seamus crew

Now I got really interested, I think I'm gonna have to look up Mortimer's card. Could open this a little bit? I love Seamus but I have mainly played him with Sybelle, do you take both or just Mort?

[Spifferson]

The last time I used Mortimer I flung alot of rot. 1-2 points of poison damage on targets of opportunity saw Mortimer finish off several hard to kill and high armor minions.

[Necrofaux]

I think Mortimer gets better with a larger crew. He is a support piece that is a essentially a force multiplier (just like Nicodem) and so these two models work better and better when the crew consists of many models. In a 55 point Nicodem list you can have 3 upgrades, a vulture, mortimer with his shovel, and about 8 canine remains....process that for a minute and imagine what 8 dogs taking two free walks can do on turn one. I played Nicodem with larger beatsticks from the get-go and it just isn't as effective as running a swarm list. You can literally swarm the field with so many scheme markers that your opponent will have to focus on killing your dogs, which just feeds you the corpse counters you need to start summoning things that can defend your scheme counters. You can then advance your crew and make Mortimer sit in the center protecting these scheme counters with his "No interact" aura. Mortimer is a pure force multiplier and VP supporting monster (in scheme marker based games, which are a majority of games).

[ghastli]

Mortimer is good with nurses too. You can give a flesh construct hallucinogens from a safe distance (for the nurse) and then use fresh meat to get him into melee range. Fling rot is also good for Mcmourning's expunge, 12" is a long way to throw poison.