Jump (All) Action Clarification

[alegionaire]

Good afternoon,

Could you please clarify how the Jump (All) action is used? For example, does a model that uses the jump action ignore difficult terrain for measuring? In addition, is the model subject to falling damage, if the model doesn't reach safe ground w/ its jump action?

Three examples of a model with a 5" movement is on a roof which has a 1" tall and 1" wide parapet. The wall on the other side is a 3" tall wall including the height of the 1" parapet:

WALKING:The model could use a standard walk action to climb up the parapet (difficult terrain) =2" of movement. The model would then place the model so the back edge of the model is resting on the parapet. It would then move forward so the rear edge of the base is on the outside of the wall (~2" of movement), then fall the remainder of the distance (3")...taking uncheatable falling damage. Lastly, if the model survives it could move the remainder of its movement distance away + second action from the wall. Correct?

JUMPING:

A) The model could use this action to jump over the wall. In this example, the jumps up to the top of the parapet (1" = 2" of movement). It then jumps 1" across the parapet (1" = 2" of movement). it then jumps 1/2" down the wall (1" of movement). It then falls the remainder of the distance (Less than 3"). So it takes no damage.

or

The model uses a jump action to jump over the wall. It jumps up above the parapet (1.125" = 2.25" of movement). It then continues it jump over the parapet (1.125" = 2.25" of movement). It then continues the remainder of its jump down the wall (.250" = .5" of movement). The model then falls the remainder of the distance (2.75") for no falling damage.

Just trying to get some clarity. This question came up after a recent game to determine if jumping was a viable option.

Thanks,

Chris

[Hateful Darkblack]

(I need to go home and check my book, but isn't Jump a (2) action?)

[ukrocky]

There's a jump action?!? o.O

[Fastenhate]

(2) Jump - The model can either move 1/2 of its Wk distance horizontally and move over gaps, or the model can move up to 1/2 of its Wk distance from a higher elevation to a lower one, or vice versa, without suffering damage.

[dgraz]

or the model can move up to 1/2 of its Wk distance from a higher elevation to a lower one, or vice versa, without suffering damage.

which doesn't really make much sense...since most models are a 4 or 5 Wk and you don't suffer damage from a less than 3" drop.......you could just walk off.

[Hateful Darkblack]

It's great for jumping off a cliff more than 3" higher. Or for jumping up a high cliff, for that matter.

[dgraz]

It's great for jumping off a cliff more than 3" higher. Or for jumping up a high cliff, for that matter.

There's no stipulation that jumping reduces the actual distance, so if you have a 2" jump and you drop 4", you would still take damage as far as I know.

And, a (2) action to jump half your move makes no sense, since you could climb half your move for (1).

[Boshea]

There's a jump action?!? o.O

I had the same reaction.

[Hateful Darkblack]

There's no stipulation that jumping reduces the actual distance, so if you have a 2" jump and you drop 4", you would still take damage as far as I know.

And, a (2) action to jump half your move makes no sense, since you could climb half your move for (1).

http://www.malifaux.com/Errata.php

Distances are measured top-down, not including vertical distances. If you jump 2" and you drop 100", you would take no damage.

There's an exception for moving by Climbable terrain, but Jump specifically ignores this.

That is why (2) Jump is sometimes better than (1) Walk for climbing.

[dgraz]

http://www.malifaux.com/Errata.php

Distances are measured top-down, not including vertical distances. If you jump 2" and you drop 100", you would take no damage.

There's an exception for moving by Climbable terrain, but Jump specifically ignores this.

Ahhhhh.......no. I think that's about as far from how it's supposed to be as you could possibly make it. I understand what you're trying to read into that clarification........but please, a small amount of common sense, please.

The Jump rule specifically mentions jumping over GAPS..........and jumping up or down. And can you seriously think that the game designers said....well, to clarify the measuring thing we'll allow models to jump any distance they want? Seriously?

I'll be the first person to say that the Jump rule doesn't make a lot of sense, but from what you're trying to make it it makes even less sense.

[Hateful Darkblack]

The Jump rule specifically mentions jumping over GAPS..........and jumping up or down. And can you seriously think that the game designers said....well, to clarify the measuring thing we'll allow models to jump any distance they want? Seriously?

I'm pretty sure that yes, it can be used to jump from any height without taking falling damage. But not very far horizontally, and it's a (2) Action.

But I'll happily stand corrected if there's a Rules Marshall ruling to the contrary.

[Kadeton]

I see no reason to assume that jumping vertically downwards does anything other than reduce the distance fallen by the amount jumped. If a model with Wk 5 jumped off a Ht 5 ledge, it would take no damage, but if it jumped off a Ht 6 ledge it would take damage as if it had fallen 3.5".

There's also never any reason to do this if the terrain is Climbable - climbing is always the better option if it is possible.

[dgraz]

I see no reason to assume that jumping vertically downwards does anything other than reduce the distance fallen by the amount jumped. If a model with Wk 5 jumped off a Ht 5 ledge, it would take no damage, but if it jumped off a Ht 6 ledge it would take damage as if it had fallen 3.5".

I could buy that logic.

There's also never any reason to do this if the terrain is Climbable - climbing is always the better option if it is possible.

Unless you're in the Tedpro school of thought........where you could take that same Wk 5 model and jump horizontally off of a piece of Ht 10 terrain and be placed safely on the ground.......or jump horizontally at a piece of Ht 10 Terrain and be placed on top of it.

[alegionaire]

thanks for the correction. Yes jump is a (2) action. I appreciate the responses. However, let me summarize my questions:

A) does jumping vertically or horizontally get reduced for difficult terrain? I assume not as it is already reduced.

if you jump down a sheer cliff (unclimbable) does it reduce the damage from falling damage? A model with a 5" movement, jumps down from a 3" wall, does suffer the standard damage from falling down 3" or is it modified to 0.5" of falling (5"movement /2 = 2.5" jumped + 0.5" falling).

C) can you jump both vertically and horizontally? It seems as though the RAW prohibits this.

Thanks in advance.

[xKoBiEx]

I don't know of any model that has a 20" walk so no, you can not jump 10" even if you were in base. Vertical distances ARE measured for movement effects as per the Errata and the writing of the action, itself.

The difference between climbing and jumping are that jumping works on terrain which is not climbable (for whatever reason.) Jumping down seems to be from any height but you have to be in base contact with the edge before your activation for most models, which opens up opportunity for someone else to push you off before you activate. Fast or Nimble models could set up to the jump with their free move, though.

[amor sanguinis]

This is why I love malifaux..... with a walk of 5, you jump off a hight 5 wall. Wk 5 ÷ 2 = 2.5.

So he/she makes it half way down. Falls the other 2.5 and takes damage as if it fell 3.5...

No offence to Wyrd (Seriously I love you) but "Bad Things Happen" don't excuse bad rules.

Ps. Plz correct me if I'm wrong.

PSS. Does model ht have anything to do with it?

[Jonas Albrecht]

You actually take triple damage.

[Kadeton]

This is why I love malifaux..... with a walk of 5, you jump off a hight 5 wall. Wk 5 ÷ 2 = 2.5.

So he/she makes it half way down. Falls the other 2.5 and takes damage as if it fell 3.5...

No offence to Wyrd (Seriously I love you) but "Bad Things Happen" don't excuse bad rules.

Ps. Plz correct me if I'm wrong.

PSS. Does model ht have anything to do with it?

I don't get what you're saying here. Your Wk 5 model jumps off a Ht 5 ledge, they jump 2.5" down and fall 2.5", taking no damage.

[xKoBiEx]

I don't get what you're saying here. Your Wk 5 model jumps off a Ht 5 ledge, they jump 2.5" down and fall 2.5", taking no damage.

That's what my math came out with, too.

[Hateful Darkblack]

You actually take triple damage.

I'm pretty sure you take triple damage, but as Poison Tokens instead.

[amor sanguinis]

I don't get what you're saying here. Your Wk 5 model jumps off a Ht 5 ledge, they jump 2.5" down and fall 2.5", taking no damage.

That's what I thought. But the post above said different. Or perhaps I should stop drinking koolaide before reading/writing on forums.