Hoffman cyborg is amazing!

[lame0]

56 minutes ago, Legislat said:

You can't actually do this. Targetting systems improve only MI and SH actions.

Ohh noooooooooooooo. Ughh I really wish I had the cards so I could look at them all instead of the book where I'm flipping back and forth + PDFs.

Tbh I don't think I would of done 3-4 of the same kind all that often  cus of all the damage that causes but it's a shame it's not an option because then his engage turn 2 could have been brutal (I guess I could stone/find rams through wastrel cycle but it is worse. Still good to give frank and the emissary the buff on the same turn. Also it makes an option that I thought was worse before a better option. 2x wardens for McTavish since now you don't ever want targeting system on Hoffman but instead you can get the two wardens power loop sit them next to brutal and then they have a great shot at paralyzing enemy's with targeting system + positive flips. At sh 6.(worst case 2/3/4 off the targeting system) Also in combat they can range from 3/4/5 - 5/6/7 using targeting system which is great for 6ss. (This is where they really shine)

I might still like McTavish more but I dunno it's closer than I originally believed.

[Gnomezilla]

*just sort of stares at the brutal effigy for awhile*

...oh. 

[Mr Janje]

Did we come to an agreement over Wastrel passing off Cyborg?

[trikk]

33 minutes ago, Mr Janje said:

Did we come to an agreement over Wastrel passing off Cyborg?

Majority seems to agree that discard == remove.

[lame0]

1 hour ago, trikk said:

Majority seems to agree that discard == remove.

Yeah I looked at the rule book and in relation to upgrades it seems a bit unclear. The thing is when I looked at it in terms of a grander scale (conditions, markers, etc) it seems to lean much closer to being a discard=remove. I do hate that it's not super clear and requires some assumption but w.e nothing is perfect.

Like I said though wastrels are still great and can instead give any model the nimble or armor +1 modification without losing cyborg (which is actually really great on them for cycling bad cards and getting their triggers.)

[Myyrä]

10 hours ago, lame0 said:

Like I said though wastrels are still great and can instead give any model the nimble or armor +1 modification without losing cyborg (which is actually really great on them for cycling bad cards and getting their triggers.)

Like Trikk said earlier, you still need to discard the scrap marker if you want to attach one of those, so that might not be the best use for them. Repeatedly attaching Targeting Systems and passing it forward to other robot might be useful though.

[lame0]

2 hours ago, Myyrä said:

Like Trikk said earlier, you still need to discard the scrap marker if you want to attach one of those, so that might not be the best use for them. Repeatedly attaching Targeting Systems and passing it forward to other robot might be useful though.

Well yeah but both Hoffman and brutal make scraps for 0 actions which makes it way easier to pay. (And the armor and nimble modifications only fall off when you die so its not like it's happening that often). Passing lots of targeting system around is great. Also they heal well for a 4ss model in guild (works out to one AP most of the time (due to the trigger you get to choose) with a free cycle). Passing Francisco and the brutal emissary the system every turn is great( and on wardens/ peacekeepers it should be good)

[Myyrä]

1 minute ago, lame0 said:

Well yeah but both Hoffman and brutal make scraps for 0 actions which makes it way easier to pay. (And the armor and nimble modifications only fall off when you die so its not like it's happening that often). Passing lots of targeting system around is great. Also they heal well for a 4ss model in guild (works out to one AP most of the time (due to the trigger you get to choose) with a free cycle). Passing Francisco and the brutal emissary the system every turn is great( and on wardens/ peacekeepers it should be good)

Actually, that gave me an idea I hadn't considered before. Wastrel could be used as a replacement for Field Mechanic in crews where you want to mix construct and non-construct models. It would help getting more useful upgrades for Hoffman. I might actually try that.

[lame0]

1 hour ago, Myyrä said:

Actually, that gave me an idea I hadn't considered before. Wastrel could be used as a replacement for Field Mechanic in crews where you want to mix construct and non-construct models. It would help getting more useful upgrades for Hoffman. I might actually try that.

Yeah I found the wastrel looking for a way to avoid having to take the arcanist assets because I think the 0 is usually worse than his (0) place 6 or make a scrap marker. And I'm not in love with the msu constructs outside of the field mechanic. (Howard and Joss are cool but not much better than aionus/ McTavish/ Burt / peacekeeper/ brutal emissary. ) 

Overall I think the arcanist assets was the weakest upgrade from the usual takes so yeah. (I think giving out cyborg is quite a bit better at this point).

[Myyrä]

1 minute ago, lame0 said:

Yeah I found the wastrel looking for a way to avoid having to take the arcanist assets because I think the 0 is usually worse than his (0) place 6 or make a scrap marker. And I'm not in love with the msu constructs outside of the field mechanic. (Howard and Joss are cool but not much better than aionus/ McTavish/ Burt / peacekeeper/ brutal emissary. ) 

Overall I think the arcanist assets was the weakest upgrade from the usual takes so yeah. (I think giving out cyborg is quite a bit better at this point).

I would love to leave out Field Mechanic for Arcanist Assets. Joss is one of the best models to benefit from irreducible armor and Mobile Toolkit can turn Emissary's or Ryle's damage up to 11.

[Ludvig]

Joss is pretty boss! Pun definitely  intended, so sorry everyone.  If you aren't expecting reduction he drops in value I guess. Cyborg McTavish sounds like a cool conversion project.

[Ludvig]

Is there some super blasty model we are forgetting that might like to be fast and have positives to damage btw? Pathfinder?

Freikorps specialist and Samael perhaps? @4thstringer

[4thstringer]

2 minutes ago, Ludvig said:

Is there some super blasty model we are forgetting that might like to be fast and have positives to damage btw? Pathfinder?

Freikorps specialist and Samael perhaps? @4thstringer

I remember trying once taking the emissary with a dm, a fk specialist,  and papa in a hoffman crew to try to use those blasts.  I ended up just using never bluff a six gun instead (which at double plus to damage can wreck some stuff) because my opponent spread out too much to depend on blasts.  

Papa himself is an interestingly blast attack with hoff, because who wants to risk engaging him.

[trikk]

With Hoffman I would always get Joss over Tavish. Hes a lot less squishy, has a very good damage track that is not reliant in triggers.

 

While I think Tavish is a very good model, I think without buffs he's not worth 11 Stines. He's good with Nellie bc Fast, with TT because Recalled+ fast+ focus but I don't think I'd ever take him with Hoff. Mobile Toolkit is also stellar and I think Soulstone Miners and steam arachnids are also cool

[Myyrä]

9 minutes ago, Ludvig said:

Is there some super blasty model we are forgetting that might like to be fast and have positives to damage btw? Pathfinder?

Freikorps specialist and Samael perhaps? @4thstringer

I'm not sure what you have or have not forgotten, but I have put quite some time into consideration into this and believe there aren't any real hidden gems there. One model that I think hasn't gotten that much attention, but has some potential, is Witchling Thrall. His attacks are pretty good, especially with for damage, and he doesn't rely on triggers either.

[4thstringer]

2 minutes ago, trikk said:

With Hoffman I would always get Joss over Tavish. Hes a lot less squishy, has a very good damage track that is not reliant in triggers.

 

While I think Tavish is a very good model, I think without buffs he's not worth 11 Stines. He's good with Nellie bc Fast, with TT because Recalled+ fast+ focus but I don't think I'd ever take him with Hoff. Mobile Toolkit is also stellar and I think Soulstone Miners and steam arachnids are also cool

Mctav would sure like the mobile toolkit buff.

[Myyrä]

Just now, 4thstringer said:

Mctav would sure like the mobile toolkit buff.

I don't know why people keep saying that, when it really seems like he couldn't possibly get it (outside Mei Feng crews that is).

[4thstringer]

1 minute ago, Myyrä said:

I'm not sure what you have or have not forgotten, but I have put quite some time into consideration into this and believe there aren't any real hidden gems there. One model that I think hasn't gotten that much attention, but has some potential, is Witchling Thrall. His attacks are pretty good, especially with for damage, and he doesn't rely on triggers either.

I actually blasted onto something with the thrall in my last game.  

Abuela also has blasts, though I rarely if ever use them.

[4thstringer]

Just now, Myyrä said:

I don't know why people keep saying that, when it really seems like he couldn't possibly get it (outside Mei Feng crews that is).

Am I missing something? Hoffman crew with cyborg would do it, right?

[Ludvig]

Just now, 4thstringer said:

Am I missing something? Hoffman crew with cyborg would do it, right?

Cyborg needs the model to be guild. Tavish is a gremlin model.

[Myyrä]

1 minute ago, 4thstringer said:

Am I missing something? Hoffman crew with cyborg would do it, right?

Cyborg is for Guild models only, unless you assume that Wastrels don't discard upgrades when they discard upgrades.

[trikk]

If it worked on non-Guild models the first thing I would take would be a reactivate Hoffman from Gracie...

[4thstringer]

Dammit thats what I get for not having my cards in front of me.

[Myyrä]

3 minutes ago, trikk said:

If it worked on non-Guild models the first thing I would take would be a reactivate Hoffman from Gracie...

Yeah, McTavish wouldn't even make it to my top 3.

[4thstringer]

7 minutes ago, Myyrä said:

Yeah, McTavish wouldn't even make it to my top 3.

I guess I don't use OSA enough.   I'm just imagining if I could cybork McTav and put him on plusses,  im pretty sure I could do first turn shooting that would leave Dita jealous.