Reasons lucius is tier one.

[4thstringer]

Having realized arguing politics on Facebook is a fruitless endeavor,  I have decided to engage in an easier task, trying to convince the world that Lucius is tier one. 

So this is a thread for saying ask the things you love about lucius.   Here are mine:

1. For a 5 of masks you can place 2 models and drop a scheme marker.

2. incredible range on the friendly obeys.   18" on commanding presence and 14 to mimics. and guard on issue command.

3. So many attempted prop up models in the last two books: Changelings, thralls,  mounted guard,  terra cotta warriors. 

4. Freedom to choose a different upgrade for the emissary because his conflux isn't helpful. 

5. Masks and sword canes are so in this fall. 

6.  curfew multiple turns, without the stone cost. 

7. If you play him a lot,  with every new book you get the excitement of saying "this will be the book where they create a useful lucius upgrade" until you or someone you know gets the book. 

[Joel]

I think you still have some work to do, but I wish you luck in your task.

[Jam Warrior]

1 hour ago, 4thstringer said:

6.  curfew multiple turns, without the stone cost. 

I don't get it.

[4thstringer]

11 minutes ago, Jam Warrior said:

I don't get it.

Terra cotta warrior and Lucius' s ability to hurt a friendly model for a stone refund turns it on.

[Jam Warrior]

So you're suggesting you'd be able to upgrade swap it back in once it was discarded to get around the Rare 1 limit?  I suppose so.

[Cadaverousbirth]

Until you paralyze half your crew

Turning Lucius into a Thrall battery should be a fun trick. I can imagine him dancing around them, getting up the field, stabbing some fellows in the back and the like.

[Absolution Black]

Best thread ever.

Wait... you're serious? 

[leebat]

1 hour ago, Absolution Black said:

Best thread ever.

Wait... you're serious? 

it seems it, i would like to say good luck and keep me posted on how you do as i'm now starting him myself 

 

[BaronGreenback]

This is one reason I love him.

Guild riflemen with dashel behind.  Focus for zero, ready aim. First shot = firing line, ram. Rifle 2nd ram. Fire for + on flip.

so that's 2+ on flip, +on damage with double crib built for 3,4,6. 2nd shot is only +duel, 1ram. For 2,3,5. Then we companion for number two. Repeat. Still alive? Number 3. Still alive?. Ok Lucius can you command presence or better still issue command take aim? What's that you can do it three times...? Still alive? Secret assets with vengeance shot for 0. 

Trying to rush the gunline? What your past the four traps and pathfinder already? ... oh your melee monster finally made it. Scribe hands out red tape. Enjoy.

this is why we love him.

[MalifauxMartin]

3 minutes ago, BaronGreenback said:

This is one reason I love him.

Guild riflemen with dashel behind.  Focus for zero, ready aim. First shot = firing line, ram. Rifle 2nd ram. Fire for + on flip.

so that's 2+ on flip, +on damage with double crib built for 3,4,6. 2nd shot is only +duel, 1ram. For 2,3,5. Then we companion for number two. Repeat. Still alive? Number 3. Still alive?. Ok Lucius can you command presence or better still issue command take aim? What's that you can do it three times...? Still alive? Secret assets with vengeance shot for 0. 

Trying to rush the gunline? What your past the four traps and pathfinder already? ... oh your melee monster finally made it. Scribe hands out red tape. Enjoy.

this is why we love him.

All of which is great. Unless you actually have to go somewhere and do some schemes...

[BaronGreenback]

Yeah but scheming is always easier once you have dealt with a few threats... I've tried scheming with Lucius and not dealing with the threats... all my minions tend to die.  So maybe you need to lay down a bit of early game pain with the rifle dashel. Then switch to more scheming. It's malifaux so pretty much every post can be countered with a situationally dependant what if....  there is no one size fits all, but that's a positive in my book. Back to OP, what's good with Lucius, riflemem, dashel and traps combo get my vote.

[Durza]

If you're focusing with the riflemen do you really need a 9 point henchman sitting there all game just handing out redundant + flips? Seems too expensive for too little gain. 

Lucius is one of my favorite masters to play, so that's why he's tier 1 to me.

[BaronGreenback]

2 hours ago, Durza said:

If you're focusing with the riflemen do you really need a 9 point henchman sitting there all game just handing out redundant + flips? Seems too expensive for too little gain. 

Lucius is one of my favorite masters to play, so that's why he's tier 1 to me.

The free focus for zero gives the option of two attacks, and the extra plus is all that's left after the first plus gets lost on cover, camouflage or hard to wound. Also if you have 3 rifles, or two rifles and a pathfinder, he's a force multiplier for all three... having said that I know what you mean.  Maybe summoning upgrade gives him something to do whilst he is hanging back. 

I have converted Lucius to be playing a violin, and the scribe has a wine bottle on his tray, in my crew he is the Sommelier not the scribe. This is why they are tier 1 for me. He plays the violin and drinks fine wine whilst he wins. His Sommelier uses Red Wine not Red Tape. You can't refuse the chateau 1897....

 

 

[Eclipse]

- Lucius is  both a prime dancer and a conductor: He directs the flow of the music and dances at the same time;
- Lucius uses his minions as extra limbs: Nothing like ordering a model in 14" to focus and shoot 12" further;
- He has an increasingly wider collection of models to bring with his Personal Retinue and the ability to double and triple the most useful tricks as he sees fit;
- Free mobility and scheme markers. I mean, who doesn't love freebies
- Usually it is not necessary to bring any upgrades with him other then Surprisingly Loyal - frees up soustones (or if so desired, allows for more freedom with upgrades);
- Lucius has a deal with the Devil, he doesn't really need to save up his Soulstones. Just keep one to throw in the Devil's Pawnshop before getting it back - this way your other SS users (Nekima/Ryle?) can happily spend the wealth provided by the Governor's Secretary;
- All of the above allow him to set up a spider web and control the flow of the battlefield. Pretty boss and one of the few "commander" type masters along with Kirai, Shenlong and Yan Lo (upgraded with Spirit Ascendant).

Seriously, Lucius is great. It's often the lazy players that are bad, not the Master himself.

[Ludvig]

3 hours ago, BaronGreenback said:

The free focus for zero gives the option of two attacks, and the extra plus is all that's left after the first plus gets lost on cover, camouflage or hard to wound. Also if you have 3 rifles, or two rifles and a pathfinder, he's a force multiplier for all three... having said that I know what you mean.  Maybe summoning upgrade gives him something to do whilst he is hanging back. 

He only gives you a plus on the hit duel so if the enemy is in hard cover or has htw your riflemen are back to negatives flips on the average duel difference. If they live and are unengaged they do have a decent track. More common in my experience is that the enemy either puts terrain between you so you don't have LoS at all or they have their own snipers on a more open board. They csn also use a necropunk or something else with from the shadows and a special movement rule to engage a couple of your rifles turn 1. 

If you have Dashel, three rifleman, a pathfinder, Lucius' sniper upgrade and four traps you just spent 40ss on models that are unlikely to score a lot of scheme points and who are easily neutered. An enemy engaging 2-3 of your traps will be very hard to hit for your riflemen so only your lone pathfinder and Lucius can now hurt it. Meanwhile that model is scoring hunting party by killing your traps and there isn't that much you can do against it. 

My most common resser opponent uses the Valedictorian. She has armor and can use soulstones so when Lucius or the scribe tries to put red tape on her she stones away the damage and no condition is applied. Same with Joss who is an auto-include for my arcanist opponents. 

3 hours ago, BaronGreenback said:

I have converted Lucius to be playing a violin, and the scribe has a wine bottle on his tray, in my crew he is the Sommelier not the scribe. This is why they are tier 1 for me. He plays the violin and drinks fine wine whilst he wins. His Sommelier uses Red Wine not Red Tape. You can't refuse the chateau 1897....

 

Still love his style and play him way to often. Really fun conversion!

[BaronGreenback]

Ludvig, what are your thoughts on any synergies with Lucius taking convict gunslingers, desperate mercs and Ryle? I'm looking at what else I can add to Lucius.

 

[Ludvig]

1 hour ago, BaronGreenback said:

Ludvig, what are your thoughts on any synergies with Lucius taking convict gunslingers, desperate mercs and Ryle? I'm looking at what else I can add to Lucius.

 

Haven't tried the desperate mercs in m2e so I can't speak from experience but they look lackluster on paper. Convict gunslingers are nice models but since they're not minions they have no real synergy with Lucius. I guess he could trade places with what lackeys are for to let them discard the new +1 damage upgrade and rapid fire which isn't too shabby. There are lots of other masters who could give them the same kind of mobility (Nellie or McCabe for instance). 

I like Ryle since he is very self-contained and decently scary for opponents. I often use him in my lists. My main concern with Lucius in general is that he doesn't have a good way to ignore armour and incorporeal. He can use minions for it but they're so squishy. Ryle has the very same problem, an enemy with armour +2 or more will not be very afraid of him.

[Mxbedlam]

I'm just wanting to see someone live the dream and use him as a NB master to use Mounted Guards and fling a Teddy into the opponent's face on turn 1, add a doppleganger and you'll probably be going first on turn 2 as well. Almost as much fun as a killjoy bomb.

[4thstringer]

I don't actually think he is tier 1 but I do have lots of love for him.  My biggest failure so far is not running trappers with him.

[Paksos]

I use Lucius a fair amount with NB. I tend to run him in a "Devil's Advocate" crew with lots of nephilim. 

His obey can send terror tots shooting around the table and ordering young nephilim to attack again after they've charged can be very effective (especially with that flay upgrade in your crew).