Maniacal_cackle

Also, if it interests people... Here is my homemade grave golem! The earth itself rises up, inevitable and unstoppable!

Totally agree. Even if the opponent is going hard with taking down the grave golem, it'll need no more than 2-3 corpses per game. And of course, more realistically, as long as there is a single corpse marker on the table in a relevant position, the opponent won't bother killing it. In fact, sometimes I wish the opponent WOULD kill it (or I consider doing it myself) for the free teleport... But the number of deaths for a grave golem in my average game is 0.

@Shakyor sounds brilliant!

I've been meaning to try this! Have you done it much? Is it that useful? It seems crazy good if you can set up a Reva attack.

This would be a hilarious upgrade they could include without much mechanical drawback (if the back of the card is full). Apex predator: Model gains the frantic flailing attack.

Running Molly, gravedigger + grave golem was a combo I used a lot. Eventually I realised I don't really need corpse generation though and now just take the grave golem. Even if they alpha strike grave golem turn 1 after it activates, that gives until the end of turn 2 to kill something else and put another corpse on the table (as long as you're playing an opponent that drops corpses). And even if the golem dies, if you kill off the beater that killed it you're probably even on stones. A much more massive limitation in my experience is the lack of mobility. So he pairs well with Reva for the Shieldbearers for mobility + free focus.

I'm not sure a 6 stone support model needs that much defensive tech. They're almost always near something more dangerous. For example, once I killed an enemy nurse with my Archie. But the opponent won initiative the next turn and killed my Archie for being in a poor position. Positioning of your crew is the best defense.

Yup, it can target an enemy! The only restriction on it is "Target two models." If it couldn't target an enemy, it would say "target two friendly models." And yes, I believe it should apply to all conditions. It just mentions values so that it can cover all situations of condition.

If there is no legal place to unbury, from memory you unbury in the deployment zone. So there is almost always going to be a legal place (unless you're on corner deployment with perfect gravity well coverage).

One additional thing to note is that Gravity Well doesn't stop unburying, just placing, so it doesn't apply anyway I think? You can still unbury in your deployment zone even if she blocks the entire area where you'd unbury, so she doesn't stop unburying anyway. All of the listed effects could stop the unbury entirely.

I agree with Adran, things get real messy when you don't stick to the principle of "the source is the card with the text (if applicable), relevant terrain or condition, or the model taking the action (if the text is in the rulebook)." So I play it as getting one pyre marker. It is super ambiguous, though, so your playgroup may choose to do it another way.

Grave golem is great with claim jump, but I don't usually make him the claim jumper. Philip and the nanny to claim jump + grave golem to zone control the centre is pretty strong. Overall, grave golem is a zone control piece. It is too slow to be an effective beater when it chases people, but if they have to come to the grave golem it gets pretty scary.

I agree totally for niche models, although I think it doesn't apply as well for crews. You can hardly pull a woe crew in after declaring Nekima leader for example (though may be able to OOK an Iggy, etc).

He is great when you want to dominate the centre (claim jump, etc). His hurl corpse is theoretically useful for Reva, but haven't tried it yet.

One major issue is that if you buff a model because it is weak against some things and strong against other things... Then you end up in a situation where that model is good against lots of things and auto-win against some things. So that's something to be avoided. Personally I'd much rather buffs focus on models that are almost universally bad, rarely or never taken (or with a low win rate when they are taken).

I think it just reflects that there is more than one aspect to this hobby. Some people are in it 90% for the models, and models like this are likely super liked by some people. Mechanically, you can just use a proxy base for it whenever you need to make it work on the table. I also find it annoying, but can see why they do it.

Have messaged you

This happened yesterday so I didn't take extensive notes, but basically... Had it set to display dead models. Summoned an ashigaru with Toshiro. Killed off the ashigaru. Summoned another ashigaru, and rather than clicking another ashigaru, I simply reset the health of the dead one to full. Any attempts to change the ashigaru after that point simply reset it back to full health/no conditions. Sorry I don't have more info, hope that is enough to be helpful! I did mark the game completed and left it in my log, so can potentially look up more info.

I play her pretty oddly, and often only end up with 2-4 pyre markers 🤣 I didn't even kill a model in my last game (as technically the only enemy model that died killed itself). If you went for a more kill-oriented build, I could see ending up with 5-10 on the table. The most common source of pyre markers is killing your own corpse candles for two pyres + one corpse marker.

Exciting! I'm still getting the hang of Reva myself, but I'll share my first impressions. I'll also do it by boxes, since that's generally how you get models. Core box: Must have, of course! Mourners: eh, never heard anyone say they use them. Draugr: some people quite like them, I haven't bothered buying them. I borrow them sometimes, but not too impressed. That said, they do make good little nukes, and they work well with positive flips to damage, which they get from the focus from shieldbearers. They also leave behind a corpse marker on death, so them dying isn't always a bad thing - it gives Reva more reach for killing. Wanyudo: Super awkward to purchase, but some people swear by it. Personally I'm going to sculpt one myself, but haven't gotten around to it yet. The returned (Restless spirits + Lampads) - probably a box you can skip, although I like having the cheap corpse marker generator. Lampads I enjoy playing with, but really probably aren't useful for 'optimal' crews. If you like fun, thematic pieces could be worthwhile, but feel free to skip this box. Gravediggers: another option for corpse generation, but feels a bit expensive buying that whole box for one gravedigger. I went halfsies with a friend on a 2E box which worked well. Dead Rider: Great versatile, but a bit too card hungry for the crew (unless you're going for a avoid the fight and score points approach to a match). Eternal Servitude: My go-to budget recommendation. Just solid models all around, and the corpse synergy works well with the crew. The models can be a bit card hungry, though, so just a heads up about that. Anna Lovelace: some people are a big fan of her in the crew, and I can see why. However, requires buying a whole core box, so possibly skip. Carrion emissary: Some people like it, some don't. I've not tried it, but suspect it is too card hungry. Corpse-throwers (Archie or Grave Golem): I've not actually tested this yet, but it seems super promising that you can hurl corpse candles as a cost (works even if it misses). Should be very useful for getting Reva setup for attacking. With Archie's nerf, grave golem is probably the way to go - and it is super easy to sculpt your own for dirt (pun intended) cheap. Hint: Use dirt to coat them after you sculpt them for a real genuine feel to the model. There may be other models, but that's what I can think of off the top of my head. Personally I'd suggest buying the core box and testing it out, then adding other models as you go. If you have no collection at all, buying The Returned + Core box is what I did, partially as I wanted to learn the crew. But you're fine to skip The Returned.

This is somewhat true, but in my experience the biggest obstacle is Pandora not having good things to hit with her 10" attack. Giving her another ranged attack could solve the problem. Something like "Target gains injured 1, then suffers 1 irreducible damage for every condition it has." I think probably the crew needs multiple small buffs spread across all the minions (although I hear Aversion are actually pretty good, I've not fielded them yet). Stunned + staggered means a model is going to likely be pretty useless for its next activation if it is a melee model. And this also means you get two misery activations, so you can ensure it is in an awkward spot, moving it up to 4 inches (may take two action just to get it back to its original position). For something that just happens from giving it a condition (often a bonus action), that's pretty powerful. They also only cost 4/5/6 stones. Most 4/5/6 stone models that are taken are taken for utility - Little Gasser, Restless Spirit, Crooligans, Dead Dandy, Necropunk, Night Terrors, Ashigaru (summoned), Alps (summoned), Nurse, Gravediggers, etc. IMO, 4/5/6 cost models should generally be utility oriented (can't exactly turn them into min 3 beaters). From an action efficiency perspective, it is also just 1 action. Or if you use candy to do it, you get to the point where a model that activates gains stunned, discards a card, and takes 4 damage without any actions spent beyond positioning. Similar for a model attacking Pandora and her using defensive trigger for stun. Not to mention this just makes her bubble more dangerous (which is already insanely dangerous), whereas your main complaint seems to be based on her not being good against certain crews (where the bubble is less likely to apply). Although personally I think keep her as a bubble crew.

Personally I think that this (unlimited Misery + stacks) would be insanely powerful. The crew is already pretty darn powerful, it is just lacking in some areas. Like Reva and Revanent, Woe could easily go from "doesn't quite work" to top tier broken IMO. Perhaps instead the minions could have more utility to make the bubble more dangerous, but not directly more damaging. Consider Montresor in Tormented, who makes it so staggered doesn't fall off. Could have something like: Sorrows have an aura that makes it so stunned doesn't come off models (or gets reapplied for an extra misery trigger when it does fall off). A minion with an aura "When a model within 3 gains stunned, it also gains staggered." Or an aura that says that a model with stunned cannot use bonus actions at all, or a model with stunned cannot charge, or a model with stunned cannot disengage. Etc. Woe have SO MUCH DAMAGE already, I'd say that a buff for them should be utility based. Something to restrict enemy movement or actions in their bubble (as giving Woe more movement seems like a bad idea). It is also very thematic, just draining away the ability to do anything when you're near a Woe crew.

Here in New Zealand we've eliminated the virus, so I finally got to go back to the club and actually put Reva on the table instead of Vassal for the first time. Here's the scenario: Corner Deployment Symbols of Authority Take prisoner Research mission Breakthrough Catch and release Leave your mark The crew I took was: Reva Cortinas + candles Dead Rider Toshiro, The Daimyo + the Whisper Yin, The Penangalan + Grave Spirit's Touch Shieldbearer Restless Spirit I was up against the blender sisters (Viktorias from Outcasts). I took Take prisoner + Research Mission. Summary: The crew was insanely mobile, but I almost got tabled anyway. Still, I was able to score loads of points and just danced around him. I had essentially 0 cards for actually fighting duels, and Reva was never in range of getting + to flips. Basically Reva, Yin, and Dead Rider acted as super mobile scheme runners. Felt like a very strong crew for corner deployment (and symbols of authority with Toshiro to defend). But would never want to take this crew on anything but corner deployment - you end up in combat too fast and have no cards left for combat after summoning and target numbers. It wasn't uncommon for me to be forced to use a 10+ on something like Ride With Me, as all the target numbers were essential. Corpse candles make the first point of research mission pretty trivial, but the second point required having three models alive across the centreline- wasn't going to happen. But the symbols were super easy to get, as there was no way he could defend all of them at once and my models could happily move 12-14" and still claim a symbol (through severe terrain as well!) Big lessons Be extra conservative with allowing them to hit you. There's never enough cards in hand to waste any cheating defensively. The best defense is being unreachable. I should have put Reva in safer positions, as I ended up losing her end of turn 3 I think, whereas I'd prefer to lose her end of turn 4. Toshiro + Restless spirit are just such an insane value package for bogging the enemy down in your own base (although not convinced it wouldn't be stronger to just take Kirai OOK, I don't tend to play double masters). Yin hiding in a forest is surprisingly tanky, and with Grave Spirit's Touch she can stay in the game pretty well. She dropped down to 1-2 life repeatedly throughout the game. Overall, since you can't score first turn, I wish I had held my riders back a bit more. But the package of double riders means just insane reach for everything on the board, which was really powerful. There were no cards left to take advantage of that for killing (I killed one model all game), but the scheming power of this crew was crazy - especially as Rider, Reva, and Yin all have a way to get out of engagement and still cause an interact (Yin using it on someone else). Hope this is useful to some folks! P.S. Would it be better if I posted all of these in one thread, or do people like the one-thread-per-crew format?

On the topic of Misery, it always felt so strong to me. A 2" push is super good, especially in a faction with loads of 2" engage. The 'once per activation' limitation is pretty meaningless in my view, given how many auras you have. Far more relevant is that the auras don't stack, so there are pretty bad diminishing returns on woe models. The more misery you have, the weaker it gets. So a model that offers misery isn't really adding much to a crew that already has a few sources of it.

This sounds amazing.