Fetid Strumpet Posted May 16, 2011 Report Share Posted May 16, 2011 You'd sacrifice the Ikiryo using Kirai's absorb spirits ability. Which means you'd need to bring the Ikiryo back into range of the ability using swirl spirits. Or at least that's how I've been doing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peoples Champ Posted May 16, 2011 Report Share Posted May 16, 2011 You'd sacrifice the Ikiryo using Kirai's absorb spirits ability. Which means you'd need to bring the Ikiryo back into range of the ability using swirl spirits. Or at least that's how I've been doing it. I appreciate you can do that but is there any other way? To use 1AP to drag the Ikiryo back seems a waste of an AP when you should be using them as much as possible to summon new spirits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted May 16, 2011 Report Share Posted May 16, 2011 Not as far as I know. But really it depends on what you are trying to accomplish in the game you are playing. I've never really had a great track record in keeping the Ikiryo alive long enough to reabsorb all that often. My games often turn into a game of healing as fast as I can to summon her again. The tactic I'm trying now is to jump minions I think I can kill in one activation to get the healing flip the Ikiryo herself provides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klingenkalle Posted November 16, 2011 Report Share Posted November 16, 2011 Ikiryo is the manifestation of Kirai's angry spirit. She is a summoned unit, which is summoned on the measly flip of a 4 and can be summoned to a distance of 12" if you so choose. Why can Ikiryo be summoned up to 12" away? I can't find this rule on the cards or in the books. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeadFingers Posted November 17, 2011 Report Share Posted November 17, 2011 Why can Ikiryo be summoned up to 12" away? I can't find this rule on the cards or in the books. Kirai's don't blink trigger lets her suffer 1 wd to summon a model up to 12" away when she flips a :crows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted November 17, 2011 Report Share Posted November 17, 2011 And in order to summon her you have to have the suits which will automatically activate the trigger if you so choose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naiatoc Posted November 17, 2011 Report Share Posted November 17, 2011 You'd sacrifice the Ikiryo using Kirai's absorb spirits ability. Which means you'd need to bring the Ikiryo back into range of the ability using swirl spirits. Or at least that's how I've been doing it. That's a really good idea. I haven't tried it yet, but it sounds useful. (I have the same trouble with keeping her alive long enough to reabsorb.) To use 1AP to drag the Ikiryo back seems a waste of an AP when you should be using them as much as possible to summon new spirits. Personally I don't think that is a waste of AP. I almost never summon more than one thing a turn anyway, especially if I'm planning on re-summoning Ikiryo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adran Posted November 17, 2011 Report Share Posted November 17, 2011 (edited) I appreciate you can do that but is there any other way? To use 1AP to drag the Ikiryo back seems a waste of an AP when you should be using them as much as possible to summon new spirits. You can also sacrifice her to summon other spirits if she is in range. You have to do "something" which says it sacrifices a model, there isn't a sacrifice self action on Ikiryo. You could eat her with a gaki swarm if you wanted. Edited November 17, 2011 by Adran Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted November 17, 2011 Report Share Posted November 17, 2011 And remember you don't always have to send the Ikiryo out to max range. Absorb Spirit and Evolve Spirit just require that the Spirit you sacrifice be within 6" of you so If you are sticking close to try and get a Seishin off the Ikiryo's victim you might want to keep Kirai close in any case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcado Posted November 19, 2011 Report Share Posted November 19, 2011 Dear All, just convinced myself that my first master should be Kirai She is versitate and has many tricks. My question is: is it valid to use Molly as a hentchwoman with her? Summon additional belles, and copying Kirai's spells seems... fun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcado Posted November 19, 2011 Report Share Posted November 19, 2011 Also, it worth drop Francis for Grave spirit if iy use JD/hanged? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted November 19, 2011 Report Share Posted November 19, 2011 I'm of the opinion that if you are bringing a totem with Kirai the lost love is really the only way to go, as he is a get out of death free card for Kirai, including if you commit suicide for extra cards and summoning power. For 2 SS I just don't think for what he gives you can be topped. Remember that a Kirai crew gets all it's support from Kirai. If she dies, it is almost always game over for her crew unless you've already totally shut the opposing crew down by the time she dies. That is also why I'm not certain of Molly. Kirai already porvides a ton of support, and with her spending 10-12 SS each ride on on support models for herself as well I'm not certain how much extra support you need to bring to the crew with Molly. Don't get me wrong, I'm going to be trying her, but on paper I'm not certain how well it's going to work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decado Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 Thank you. You are absolutely right. Molly may be useful in larger games (like 40+ SS) . I tend to play 25, 30, and 35 pts lists in local tourney. I have some questions. What is your opinion about canine remains in a Kirai list? They are cheap and help gakis in pair (-2 def to enemy is nice). In case of death you have a seishin back and a corpse counter to heal gakis. Is Hanged + Madness a combo that worth the points? There are many models in a Kirai crew that can use some - WP flips What are the heavy hitters of a kirai list? What is the best way to handle combat monsters like Lilith? Is samurai Punk Zombie worth to take? It can be turned into spirit and grants some serious hitting power for its cost. Also as oriental theme what about Misaki, Ronin or Ten thunders? Can they be useful in a Kira crew? Misaki has fairly long threat range and if turned into a spirit and +2 CB from a seishin she can be a real hit and run combat monster. Thank you in advance for your help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naiatoc Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 While it is true that the lost love can turn pieces into spirits, it is a difficult spell to cast and one that I usually don't want to spend the resources on. If you are going to try it, make sure you get something that can really benefit from it, such as the Dead Rider. I want to eventually try out the Rogue Necromancy in a similar capacity. When selecting my crew I've found it best to take spirits that cannot be summoned. So the Hanged/ Insidious Madness combo you mentioned is a great choice to start the game with. (I haven't actually tried it yet, but it looks solid to me.) Other than spirits, the piece I sometimes use is the Dead Rider. What are the heavy hitters of a kirai list? Shikome. But I learned early on not to start the game with them, summon them. You have to select a prey at the start of the game, and they have to attack their prey. They can't attack anyone else until their prey is dead. So selecting a piece after deployment without knowing what you opponent is going to do can be difficult. Also, if your opponent is savvy he can keep the prey out of harm, and it can be very frustrating trying to get your shikome to it's target! What is the best way to handle combat monsters like Lilith? I've been wondering this myself. I want to have Kirai's avatar handy. Her avatar profile gives her the attacks of Ikyrio but will allow me to use soulstones with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snord Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 ... including if you commit suicide for extra cards and summoning power. Not sure if you are referring here to absorb spirit targeting herself, but it seems it is not legal to do that. I used this tactic before, but Sketch posted the other day that you can't do that: http://wyrd-games.net/forum/showpost.php?p=336792&postcount=11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 Odd, because Ratty who is a rules Marshall was the one who brought this trick to my attention. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toonook Posted November 22, 2011 Report Share Posted November 22, 2011 Has anyone used Bete Noir with Kirai? Kirai will be my next master to play with once my base inserts finally get shipped to Australia (looking at you here US postal service!) Seems like Bete would have plenty of opportunity to manifest with all the models getting killed and sacrificed across the board. Great thread though guys, plenty of useful stuff in here to get me going! Also looking for as much advice on playing against Sonnia Criid as possible, since my gaming group declares masters before we even choose strategies to be fair to the people who only have 1 crew. I can see her Witchling Stalkers and Sonnia herself giving me all kinds of problems both in casting my spells and ignoring my spirit half damage taken thingy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naiatoc Posted November 22, 2011 Report Share Posted November 22, 2011 I have not used Bete Noir so I can't speak on that point. I find spirits have so much synergy with her that I rarely use anything else. The only other piece I've used so far has been the Dead Rider. However, I have played one game against Sonia. She was not really all that tough in my opinion. I knew my opponent was trying to manifest as soon as possible. So I went gunning for her! I managed to kill her at the cost of my own Dead Rider and a Shikome, but still won the game. The magical weapons and spells didn't hurt nearly as much as I thought they would. Actually, I have a bigger problem dealing with Lady Justice. She is a melee beast, and if she's backed by soulstones I don't have anything that can take her on. I sent a Shikome against her, only to have Lady Justice kill it on MY ACTIVATION!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted November 22, 2011 Report Share Posted November 22, 2011 Bete Noir doesn't work very well with Kirai I find. The first problem, and the biggest, is that most crews are non living. Most crews have a living model (usually the Master) but in order for Bete to come in a living or undead model needs to die. Kirai's spirits are not undead, currently there are only 2 undead spirit types The Hanged, and the Drowned. So unless you bring a good chunk of both you are counting on your opponent to bring the models you need to pop bete out. At 9 SS for her cost it's not worth it because when playing Kirai you will not come up a significant amount of models that can pop her out. The next problem is that if you were hoping to make her a spirit using the Lost love, it requires a very high card and the range is very short, so not only will you have to still pop bete out, but it will have to be near the lost love, and you'll need the high card. If you wanted to bring her for your hitter just replace her with a Shikome and bring a stone for the road. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toonook Posted November 23, 2011 Report Share Posted November 23, 2011 Ah of course, knew there had to be a reason why Bete wasn't getting a mention. For some reason assumed that her units had the undead trait. Note to self: read cards better! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chev Chelios Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 Do you guys think that it is better to buy the Shikome or take the wounds early and summon them? Using Lost Love to recover at least half back. This would mean taking the full compliment of Seishin as well.I don't know if I like playing the rest of the game without Lost Love. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 There are varying opinions on this. I tend to favor the camp that says don't hire one at the start and summon it later. There are plenty of very valid reasons to bring one from the start, but the reason I like summoning it later is that I tend to favor Swarm lists. Swarm lists allow me the maximum flexibility to project Kirai's summoning power at the perfect point I need to. With a swarm of cheap Spirits Kirai can be anywhere on the board, and also toss her summons just about anywhere as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chev Chelios Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 What about summoning two right at first turn though? I guess it would be an extremely aggressive way to play. Possibly killing her first turn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 You could,... It really depends on what the game requires. Which is why I like to summon them instead of starting with them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tadaka Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 (edited) I did not find them to be worth the points to hire. They cost enough ss that it hirts your overall model count making it harder to out activate the other side. Edited December 3, 2011 by tadaka Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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