Tannenbaum - Rewrite the Story

[Paddywhack]

What's the consensus on how this works so far in regards to Revealed schemes? It says if the prior scheme was revealed you reveal the new scheme. Does this mean you cannot score the Reveal portion of the new scheme (as it has already been Revealed)? So you must complete the End condition of the new scheme only?

Or, can you still score the Reveal portion of the new scheme even though it has been 'revealed'?

Either way is strong, but let's be honest, for most schemes the Reveal portion is a bit easier. 

[Adran]

If you replace a revealed scheme you can only get the end game point from the New scheme. 

[solkan]

24 minutes ago, Paddywhack said:

Or, can you still score the Reveal portion of the new scheme even though it has been 'revealed'?

You can’t reveal a revealed scheme, so you’re unable to “reveal (and whatever else the scheme says) to score”.  This is the same fact which prevents someone scoring the “reveal” point several times (once each turn).

 

[Paddywhack]

3 hours ago, Adran said:

If you replace a revealed scheme you can only get the end game point from the New scheme. 

OK, that was my first impression, but I've been wrong many times. Still a very strong ability. 

[santaclaws01]

Yeah, it's why the TALK trigger says to name an unrevealed scheme rather than to reveal it.

[Kelto]

I would like to engage in a discussion, about this question.

In my opinion it should be possible the score 2 points from your new scheme, even if you had scored one point before.

Schemes like Vendetta have a wording that you need to reveal a Scheme to get the first point.

(At the end of the chosen friendly model’s Acti-
vation, if it hasn’t been Replaced, it damaged the cho-
sen enemy model, and that enemy model has half its
maximum Health or less (but is still in play), you may
reveal this Scheme to gain 1 VP)

 

But others like Catch and Release have a different wording: Reveal: At the end of the Turn, if the chosen model is
within 1" and LoS of an enemy Master or Henchman
and not engaged by any other enemy model, gain 1 VP.

 

In the Rulebook we only have the following sentence: Each Scheme can be scored twice per game: once for its “Reveal” requirement and once for its “End” requirement.

 

I don´t see why it should not be possible to get both points. I would like to see the others side.

 

 

 

 

[Adran]

My general view is that you should only be able to score 8 points, so any claim that you can score 9 is probably not the right way to read the rules. 

 

[Morgan Vening]

1 hour ago, Adran said:

My general view is that you should only be able to score 8 points, so any claim that you can score 9 is probably not the right way to read the rules. 

Wasn't this an issue in an earlier edition? Levi or Hamelin?

But yeah, the idea is bad, as some things are fine to mess with, but scoring isn't.

[Adran]

1 hour ago, Morgan Vening said:

Wasn't this an issue in an earlier edition? Levi or Hamelin?

But yeah, the idea is bad, as some things are fine to mess with, but scoring isn't.

First edition didn't have all schemes worth the same points, they varied from 0 to 3, with most worth 2. It also has Jack daw who was worth a vp if hired. 

[solkan]

5 hours ago, Kelto said:

I don´t see why it should not be possible to get both points. I would like to see the others side.

It's simple:  You cannot score the "Reveal" condition for a scheme that has already been revealed.  And the last sentence if "... if the replaced Scheme has been revealed, reveal the new Scheme."

So, you can get both points for the new scheme, if you haven't revealed the previous one.

Note:  

5 hours ago, Kelto said:

But others like Catch and Release have a different wording: Reveal: At the end of the Turn, if the chosen model is
within 1" and LoS of an enemy Master or Henchman
and not engaged by any other enemy model, gain 1 VP.

Compare the wording with Let Them Bleed's Reveal condition:

Quote

Reveal: At the end of the Turn, if there are two enemy models in play that have (or are tied for) the highest Cost and both models are at half or less than their maxi- mum Health, gain 1 VP. Leaders and models with Sum- mon Upgrades are ignored for revealing this Scheme.

Notice how Let Them Bleed's first sentence says nothing at all about revealing the scheme, but the second sentence contains a statement that makes no sense at all if you try to argue that you can score without revealing.  Reveal conditions which include the word "reveal" in them in various places are essentially doing so for clarity or emphasis.

 

[Kelto]

Got it, thanks.

My problem was that i thought you can Reveal something more than one time, as it is not directly forbidden and the rules only say that you can score one point for the reveal and one point for the end part.