The faction I'm waiting for...

[Dr. Porkenstein]

On 12/7/2016 at 8:57 AM, Aaron said:

A Cult of the Burning Man fiddler, who both plays an insane fiddle (Devil Went Down to Georgia style) and fiddles with everything it can find.

Actually a Cult of the Burning Man fiddler would be pretty cool. A commander perhaps.

[Nathan Caroland]

Hrmmmm, that sounds ... fun. @Aaron we need a Nero ... erm, Cult of the Burning Man Adjunct Fiddler down the road.

 

[Xavian and Deathgrip]

6 hours ago, Mason said:

I will ensure that one of the characters in the TTB worldwide event is Canadian, just for you.

Dang... I don't have the rulebooks.

Although honestly I am tempted to purchase them, the system seems very, very fun. Especially in how you get to customize your magic system. My group would probably enjoy it. I would probably be fine playing boring but practical sane man (I am the role player, I care more about character personality than anything else, the OC I name myself after originated as a DnD character, and the name comes from me misremembering a 'cool' name I got from a spore randomiser. Name turned out later to actually be Xandalf, which is considerably less cool). As well my group was the kind that always came up with banal (but oddly effective) solutions to problems. We still laugh about the time our sorcerer killed a dungeon boss in a single turn with a chicken leg or when our mage created a makeshift barricade with a flaming table that he was also using to crush some kobolds. Or the fact that Staurt's characters always die on their first dungeon (or at least almost, his most recent survived their first dungeon despite botching literally everything he did, even if the five before him didn't) if he calls them Reed. And this isn't DM hates him kills, but "paladin can sneak more reliably than the rogue" incidents.

Unfortunately we all split apart due to university. Group hasn't been able to get together again. *chuckle* not even a year and here I am being melodramatic to random strangers on an internet forum after an unnecessarily long and completely pointless tangent.

*Laughs out loud*

I had a long paragraph praising the community (that discusion on the morality of the thunders is a perfect example, must forums would have launched into a flame war for war less), the moderators (it doesn't feel like the moderators and the community are seperate, it feels like there is actual genuine trust between the two) and the quality of the models (Goryshce is hands down the coolest models I have ever seen. It's a mix of orochi (yes I know it is supposed to be a hydra) and western dragons, which is awesome. It's also a mutant which is even more cool, and it regenerates and makes itself nigh unkillable as well as very adaptable) as a sort of quasi apology for the off topic talk up above, but I accidentally deleted it as my computers mousepad is very bad, it's built for touchscreen use which I am not a fan of.

Also, I was wrong, I had thought that two new factions would be long shot stretch goals, but I see I am mistaken. I believe that there will be new factions, but in a few years after the game has established itself. Potential earth factions: Guild, 3 kingdoms, Russia, Ottoman empire, United States, Native American confederation,  A group of places that succeeded from empires, and that is all I got. I doubt most of these will make the game. I stick with my earlier guess, a final total of 8 factions, although that will take a LONG time. I would guess about 4-5 years or so to reach. For Malifaux factions I stick with my 'coincidental horseman' theory. The other ones will 1) seek to conquer, and 2) seek to kill all humans and/or steal the soul of every living thing on the planet.

Well this is certainly a mess that I just wrote. Just kinda wrote things as I thought them. ADHD probably explains all of this.

[Xavian and Deathgrip]

Here's another thing that I noticed, not sure if it's a coincidence or not though. The two Malifaux factions so far have power over two of the four traditional elements, water and fire. Does this mean anything? I have no idea.

[JDAntoine]

2 minutes ago, Xavian and Deathgrip said:

Here's another thing that I noticed, not sure if it's a coincidence or not though. The two Malifaux factions so far have power over two of the four traditional elements, water and fire. Does this mean anything? I have no idea.

Wouldn't look too deep into that other than that they are always cool elements to incorporate into magic and thus characters. Malifaux has several Masters with Fire related powers, Mechanical related powers, Summoning powers... all of it . I believe all of this will also form in the Other Side, from small to large. 

What my next hope is are models who cross over! I'd love it if The King's Empire would call Ramos in for specific advice and like wise if others would make a The Other Side appearance. It opens another window for alternative model use...

At that same time, I am even considering getting a bunch of Guild related models and using them as the King's Empire (for now). Many models have some form of overlap and I think you could use trio's of Guild Guard as Infiltrators and Executioners as the South Wales boxers!

[Xavian and Deathgrip]

28 minutes ago, JDAntoine said:

Wouldn't look too deep into that other than that they are always cool elements to incorporate into magic and thus characters. Malifaux has several Masters with Fire related powers, Mechanical related powers, Summoning powers... all of it . I believe all of this will also form in the Other Side, from small to large. 

What my next hope is are models who cross over! I'd love it if The King's Empire would call Ramos in for specific advice and like wise if others would make a The Other Side appearance. It opens another window for alternative model use...

At that same time, I am even considering getting a bunch of Guild related models and using them as the King's Empire (for now). Many models have some form of overlap and I think you could use trio's of Guild Guard as Infiltrators and Executioners as the South Wales boxers!

Yeah, I agree, I think it is just a coincidence.

[retnab]

1 hour ago, JDAntoine said:

What my next hope is are models who cross over! I'd love it if The King's Empire would call Ramos in for specific advice and like wise if others would make a The Other Side appearance. It opens another window for alternative model use...

I hadn't even thought of that but I love the idea - when trying to work around the Guild, who better to contact than the Arcanists?

[JDAntoine]

2 hours ago, retnab said:

I hadn't even thought of that but I love the idea - when trying to work around the Guild, who better to contact than the Arcanists?

Exactly and I think Sandeep is the product of King's Empire freeing India from the grip of the Guild aswell.

I dont expect massive mixes but I do hope for some. The effects seen on Earthside are also rippled into Malifaux and I hope this will also return into Earthside. 

Obviously both story lines develop differently but it would reinforce both "worlds" if we saw some logical crossovers. I expected Hackeem Tewolde to be the next Guild Master but he just might become a Guild/Abyssian model aswell for The Other Side.

Eventually @Lindsey might even open another Breach to The Otter Side a parralel world where rodents rule the Earth (Biker Mice from Mars) 

[Lindsey]

10 minutes ago, JDAntoine said:

Exactly and I think Sandeep is the product of King's Empire freeing India from the grip of the Guild aswell.

I dont expect massive mixes but I do hope for some. The effects seen on Earthside are also rippled into Malifaux and I hope this will also return into Earthside. 

Obviously both story lines develop differently but it would reinforce both "worlds" if we saw some logical crossovers. I expected Hackeem Tewolde to be the next Guild Master but he just might become a Guild/Abyssian model aswell for The Other Side.

Eventually @Lindsey might even open another Breach to The Otter Side a parralel world where rodents rule the Earth (Biker Mice from Mars) 

[JDAntoine]

23 minutes ago, Lindsey said:

Even The Otter Side is under attack of the Gibbering Hordes!

 

[Nexus132]

I think its quite probable that we see crossovers in fluff and story between the two games, and I can't imagine that the Guild side of things isn't shaken up at least a little by the King Empire's new 'independence'. Malifaux's importance is based on Earth needing soulstone after all, so a war were Malifaux creatures are invading Earthside is probably going to be a pretty large event for all human Malifaux Factions.

[Nisz]

As everyone knows, the yellow area in the middle that encompasses Germany, Denmark, Switzerland, Austria, Italy, the Balkans, Greece, The Czech Republic, Slovakia, Poland, Belarus, Ukraine, Lithuania, Estonia, Latvia is the Polish Commonwealth. Kudos to Wyrd for acknowledging our rightful place in history

[Dstinct]

If we do get the Guild, I don't know if it would be what is pictured in that shot. In the Allegiances video they use that shot to depict the Guild before the portal reopens. They go on to describe how they began to lose strength and power trying to maintain control on both sides. I assume this is what allowed The King's Empire and Abyssinia to rise to power without resistance. If they do make an appearance, they would be a broken army. That works in Faux because a group of soldiers from a broken army sticking together out of survival makes sense in a skirmish game, but I don't know how much power they would still have on earth compared to KE and Ab who seem to be the dominant factions/Empires in this game, nor the best way to represent that in an army game.

[JDAntoine]

17 minutes ago, Dstinct said:

If we do get the Guild, I don't know if it would be what is pictured in that shot. In the Allegiances video they use that shot to depict the Guild before the portal reopens. They go on to describe how they began to lose strength and power trying to maintain control on both sides. I assume this is what allowed The King's Empire and Abyssinia to rise to power without resistance. If they do make an appearance, they would be a broken army. That works in Faux because a group of soldiers from a broken army sticking together out of survival makes sense in a skirmish game, but I don't know how much power they would still have on earth compared to KE and Ab who seem to be the dominant factions/Empires in this game, nor the best way to represent that in an army game.

That's a theory I can't really completely stand behind. The prime reason being that the Guild art used there (army as seen on page 1) is exclusive to The Other Side so far. 
The way I see it is that the reign of the Guild became less important/usefull (which is exactly said in the video aswell). What you have to keep in mind here is that The Guild was formed because of the previous world war, a world war that seems to be reignited again. However there is absolutely nothing that reflects that The Guild is broken, all that is seen is that it wasn't equiped for the horrors that came around this time.
Comming from the Wave 4 lore, we know that both The Guild and Abyssinia work together (Hackeem Teewolde), we also allready saw our dual Commander allready which shows us King's Empire and Abyssinia can work together aswell. So all I see with the Abyssians is that they always where more less independant, as the video also says, they always had Soul Stones even before the Malifaux breach and during the closure. My expectation is that the grip of The Guild more or less streched from the UK to Russia and now we see that the UK is freed, Europe seems to be under the influence of The Burning Man (yellow) but we also see a massive part of the world map still being red.

What I expect and hope The Guild will be is a human version of something akin to the Gibbering Hordes, meaning they use massive numbers over technological advantages. When we look at the world map and when we assume red (Russia) is occupied by The Guild it would even make sence to apply this as one of the characteristics in the possible army.
The "grip of the Guild tyrant" also strikes resemblences with a communist ideology, that the nation will care for you if you care for the nation, meaning everything can work as long as it's exactly within it's restriction this is also seen in The Guild's approach to uses of magic, both known Earthside lore and Malifaux lore. 

Obviously we'll have to wait and see if The Guild shows up but I deem it extremely unlikely that it's fully broken, by large because having such a large stretch of lands to control logically and logistically also means that your army isn't spreaded densely troughout the nations. As mentioned, several nations can 'free themselves' if enough chaos is applied and the "governement" numbers are always lesser than that of the masses. If you really have the masses wanting to overtrow a specific government they will do so, easily even.

[JDAntoine]

3 minutes ago, aquenaton said:

I just think that, even as it seems possible, nothing confirms the guild is the red part of Russia. If we think about the timeline, it would not be so surprising that the red is an emergent communist part of Russia (fighting for controlling the country) and the white is the part belonging to the loyalists to the Tzar. I know we are like 10 years before the revolution, but this is the world of malifaux and it would not be so strange.

Absolutely, but what would the point be to specifically show art and an into with a specific mentioned faction IF the eventual game totally excludes them from being a playing option.
Malifaux doesn't start out with the massive deep history with it, yet the history is most certainly reflected in the game and with several Masters even with a Tyrant keyword.
My hope as such remains the same, if your going to bother to make specific artwork depicting The Guild, I deem it extremely likely they'd show up aswell. Otherwise they could have easily used all Malifaux Guild art. 

[Dstinct]

Looks like the Guild will be in it, but as Syndicates. They'll be mercs, so no full army, but some cool hired guns instead. I suppose if we get enough of them, you could build a full army a la Outcasts, but that probably wont be for a while. Curious to see what the Guild and Court of Two models look like.

[JDAntoine]

59 minutes ago, Dstinct said:

Looks like the Guild will be in it, but as Syndicates. They'll be mercs, so no full army, but some cool hired guns instead. I suppose if we get enough of them, you could build a full army a la Outcasts, but that probably wont be for a while. Curious to see what the Guild and Court of Two models look like.

We'll have to wait and see  I wouldn't be suprised if indeed some models where part of the Syndicate and also part of a faction.

Several games have several 'solos' who are both Merc and part of a faction, even non-Outcast Malifaux characters. 

[Xavian and Deathgrip]

I get the feeling syndicate models will be either champions or commanders that open up the amount of models available to your pool. This will help them introduce a lot of factions without worrying about faction bloat.

[JDAntoine]

I think we can really go both ways. I don't really know where the faction bloat worries come from though. I feel 8 is usually the perfect number for factions and adding a 9th that covers Mercs/Syndicate models is working out very well for different systems.

Honestly I know a lot of systems and faction bloat never really was a concern in any of them... Good design isn't limited by faction bloat, instead you can create your own diverse paths even more because there are so many mediums to work with in a game like Malifaux and The Other Side.

Examples of this are not only models such as Titans, Fire Teams 30mm, 40mm or 50mm but also cards, objectives, tactics changers, trigger builders, you name it. The only limitation in design is the stretch of imagination of a design team. 

What I see now is:
- King's Empire, ranged and tactical advantaged, very much like Malifaux' Guild
- Cult of the Everburning Man, glass cannon and speed advantaged, very much like Malifaux' Neverborn
- Abyssina, low numbers and high stat advantaged, very much like Malifaux' Arcanists
- Gibbering Hordes, high returning numbers and essentially more Wd as 'usual', very much like Malifaux' Ressurectionists.

Now obviously the themes are different and the factions are designed much less in terms of their triggers matching their faction's identity or symbol but the styles are very comparable. Logically I'd say the Syndicate are the first of the Merc choices to appear, some of which will also find home in actual factions. If I had to make a wild guess of what's next I'd hope for the following: Guild appearnce, akin to Gremlins, favouring higher numbers and 1-2's to deal with things, Three Kingdoms, very infantry support, like Ten Thunders, Syndicate, our Outcast variant and Necromancers, a 'new style' which simply creates more zombies by killing opponents with reinforcement tokens. 

 

[Xavian and Deathgrip]

4 minutes ago, JDAntoine said:

I think we can really go both ways. I don't really know where the faction bloat worries come from though.

It comes from my current feelings about warhammer 40k, there are too many factions in that system to properly balance them all, and the varying attention that the faction receive's is also a factor.

[JDAntoine]

5 minutes ago, Xavian and Deathgrip said:

It comes from my current feelings about warhammer 40k, there are too many factions in that system to properly balance them all, and the varying attention that the faction receive's is also a factor.

I don't think the quantity of factions is the problem.

Games Workshop works with a system for years and that's akin to the same system we see on phones. Everything that's the newest is also slightly better. Their cycle seems to have repeated this process since the early 2000s.

The prime reason as to why I believe GW does this is because despite it's name it's much more sales driffen. Sales Workshop would be a more logical compagny name switch. I even worked half a year for GW, the compagny isn't about games, it's about sales. Remember the day you first set a foot into a GW. Did they tell you about the game or what they where selling  ?

[Xavian and Deathgrip]

7 minutes ago, JDAntoine said:

I don't think the quantity of factions is the problem.

Games Workshop works with a system for years and that's akin to the same system we see on phones. Everything that's the newest is also slightly better. Their cycle seems to have repeated this process since the early 2000s.

The prime reason as to why I believe GW does this is because despite it's name it's much more sales driffen. Sales Workshop would be a more logical compagny name switch. 

All companies are sales driven.

Even Wyrd. It just matters on the methods they use to reach their goal.

[JDAntoine]

3 minutes ago, Xavian and Deathgrip said:

All companies are sales driven.

Even Wyrd. It just matters on the methods they use to reach their goal.

Sure, but not to the point where you deliberatly make a newer faction better. To the point where it becomes a well known meme.

GW knows their most selling product (Marines) and has done everything to sell more of that product. Including tossing a whole fantasy game and include marines into that aswell

What I see is that many players start learning about miniature games by GW products (they have the most shops after all) and usually leave as soon as they become aware there are better (balanced) games on the market. 

[Xavian and Deathgrip]

GW does have one thing that many other companies lack though, a world where you are encouraged to invent. The creation of new Chapters, Hive fleets, warbands, Dynasties etc. or to customize ones mentioned in passing by the fluff is really, really fun, and is the same reason that RWBY became so popular in the span of 3 years. That and well written fluff. Even if I don't like how unstoppable the tyranids and necrons are often made out to be.

But warhammer feels like a game that realized long ago that balanced gameplay wasn't the reason people bought it.

But even on Wyrd's side, the stretch goal map actually has a line moving onto another continent. There is another stretch goal map they are planning out. I honestly like Wyrd, they have a great community and feel really personable, but I really don't like how they handled this kickstarter.

[JDAntoine]

Well how I see it is that the KS is both an advantage to us, as the customer and as the compagny. First you use the largest medium known online to make sure your project is seen, secondly it's a tool to see if there even is enough interest for such a game.

I believe that the intention goes both ways, if you want to have a massive project, you simply said need to be certain there is a big enough market for it. Especially army games are always costlier as skirmish games and the result of this is that this step is a massive step for Wyrd games.

Producing a single boardgame or even skirmish game is peanuts compaired to producing a whole army game. By large because your producing more models (quantity) so sell products for a higher price. High prices mean a significant smaller market and in return that small market is competing with just a handful of bigger names but the costs required to mass produce this game is very much higher as in Malifaux or other board/skirmish games for that matter.

So far, the way Wyrd has been communicating to us, their community, I believe the intention of the compagny is to make really cool unique and flavourful games and miniatures. When I look at GW I only see great miniatures, when I look at PP I only see a great game. Doing both means you need your crew to work on full cilinders and seen by Aaron's imput a lot of his private time is also invested into the compagny. Going next level really also means you need to do more as just produce really cool miniatures or just produce a cool game.