A Warrior's Death interaction

[Fetid Strumpet]

So this is probably cut and dried but I've been sick lately and my head hasn't been too clear. I'd appreciate some thoughts.

So Izamu has an ability called A Warrior's Death. When he is reduced to 0 wounds he may take a final Attack action against the model that reduced him to 0 wounds, and then the ability sacrifices himself.

So is the practical upshot of that that the enemy can never claim credit for killing Izamu, if he uses the ability, for things like reckoning or murder protege? Because his ability sacrifices himself before he is technically killed? Love some thoughts on this. Thanks.

[Clement]

Yep.  He sacrifices himself before the death can occur.

[StuffedKiwi]

Though he will, I think, count for Collect the Bounty: "When an enemy model is killed or sacrificed, the acting model's controller scores a number of Bounty Points...." Would you all agree that when some other model reduces Izamu to 0 wounds, and Izamu then sacrifices himself, that other model is still the acting model, and so Izamu's opponent gets the Bounty Points?

Plus, there's always the option to kill Izamu without reducing him to 0 wounds, if you really need that Head Marker.

[papa smurf]

It has to be a attack. He can be shot blasted casted unto death. And he would count just fine. But if he is killed by a then he doesn't count for anything (Cept collect)

[Clement]

Would you all agree that when some other model reduces Izamu to 0 wounds, and Izamu then sacrifices himself, that other model is still the acting model, and so Izamu's opponent gets the Bounty Points?

Plus, there's always the option to kill Izamu without reducing him to 0 wounds, if you really need that Head Marker.

 

That would still work, yes.

[Patzer]

Though he will, I think, count for Collect the Bounty: "When an enemy model is killed or sacrificed, the acting model's controller scores a number of Bounty Points...." Would you all agree that when some other model reduces Izamu to 0 wounds, and Izamu then sacrifices himself, that other model is still the acting model, and so Izamu's opponent gets the Bounty Points?

Plus, there's always the option to kill Izamu without reducing him to 0 wounds, if you really need that Head Marker.

Izamu would sacrifice himself, so the acting model would not get any credit for killing him.

 

The only way you can come around the ability's effect is to kill Izamu with non- :meleeattack, effect, etc.

[lusciousmccabe]

The only ones it matters for are Reckoning and Vendetta. Murder Protege and Collect the Bounty don't care who did the killing/sacrificing.

 

And for Vendetta you can still score two points.

[Clement]

Izamu would sacrifice himself, so the acting model would not get any credit for killing him.

 

The only way you can come around the ability's effect is to kill Izamu with non- :meleeattack, effect, etc.

The acting model doesn't *need* credit for killing him, just to be active while Izamu is being killed or sacrificed.

 

"When an enemy model is killed or sacrificed, the acting model's controller scores a number of Bounty Points...." 

 

If an enemy Izamu offs himself due to Warriors Death during my models activation, we've met all the requirements for Collect the Bounty to kick in and give me points.

[Adran]

The acting model doesn't *need* credit for killing him, just to be active while Izamu is being killed or sacrificed.

 

"When an enemy model is killed or sacrificed, the acting model's controller scores a number of Bounty Points...." 

 

If an enemy Izamu offs himself due to Warriors Death during my models activation, we've met all the requirements for Collect the Bounty to kick in and give me points.

During the Warriors death extra action, the Acting model is Izamu.

You don't get the bounty.  

[Clement]

During the Warriors death extra action, the Acting model is Izamu.

You don't get the bounty.  

 

Warrior's death specifically states "after completing the action, sacrifice this model".  Is after completing the action still part of the action?  Or are we back to the original activated model.

[Patzer]

My reading of the chain of event is: 1) Player A's model kills Izamu (Player A controls the acting model); 2) Izamu gets a free swing, and sacrifices himself (player B is the acting player); Player A's model may continue with its activation if it can do so (Player A controls the acting model). I might be wrong though!

 

In Headhunter the case is much clearer, Izamu sacrifices himself after being reduced to (0) wounds. So the acting model will not get any credit for the kill (unless Izamu is sacrificed, killed, or otherwise killed but not reduced to 0 wounds).

[Ausplosions]

The model that hit him is still acting until it's activation is over. Izamu just interrupts this activation, not supersedes it.

The acting model is still going to get bounty points, because Bounty Hunt doesn't care who killed or sacrificed the model, just who is acting.

At the point of Izamu making his last swing, both models are acting.

Izamu is making an action controlled by his controller, during an activation of an enemy model controlled by its own controller.

[Kadeton]

It took my distracted brain a while to work through what Ausplosions was saying, but I agree with him. It's not particularly intuitive, but the idea of having multiple models 'acting' simultaneously when dealing with nested actions makes sense in this case.