Melee at multiple heights

[asrian]

I had this situation happen today in a game and honestly not sure how it's resolved.

We had a Ht 3 piece of terrain. On top was The Captain with his 3 , and below was a Waldgeist in cover with his 4 melee. 

The question that came up was, how, if at all, does elevation impede these two models from swinging at each other. Both had LoS to each other (so Vantage wasn't an issue), and both were in melee range of each other, but could they actually swing at each other?

[Dirial]

its really bizarre that if fighting from higher he gets to punch horizontally but if hes slightly smaller then he effectively counts as swinging from his feet. I know I could certainly reach someone on a 6 foot high high wall with my hands but not with my feet.

 

It's also really bizarre to measure all distances from top down perspective, only charge in straight lines, and to hop over towers, but no to be able to jump onto them.

 

It's an abstraction, not realism. Realism arguments don't count.

[Sezar]

its really bizarre that if fighting from higher he gets to punch horizontally but if hes slightly smaller then he effectively counts as swinging from his feet. I know I could certainly reach someone on a 6 foot high high wall with my hands but not with my feet.

+1

[jonahmaul]

its really bizarre that if fighting from higher he gets to punch horizontally but if hes slightly smaller then he effectively counts as swinging from his feet. I know I could certainly reach someone on a 6 foot high high wall with my hands but not with my feet.

I agree, but as Diral points out, there's so much that doesn't make thematic sense in the game.

[Adran]

its really bizarre that if fighting from higher he gets to punch horizontally but if hes slightly smaller then he effectively counts as swinging from his feet. I know I could certainly reach someone on a 6 foot high high wall with my hands but not with my feet.

 

I can punch much futher at waist height than I could at head height. Whilst I can get my hands to hit soemone on a 6 Ft wall, I'd struggle to do it with any real force.

Its pretty hard to swiing a sword above your head at a target. Its pretty easy to drop things on someones head whilst they try this.

And most weapons don't bend at a convient point to go up and across

 

I personally prefered the old rules on this (Which is what Capt Bloodbeard say) and accidently slip to them quite often, the actual rules are Ht is an all or nothing thing

[Dirial]

Diral

 

[zFiend]

So can a ht2 model hit a model that is standing on a ht2 terrain with ml rg 2"?

[Dirial]

So can a ht2 model hit a model that is standing on a ht2 terrain with ml rg 2"?

 

Only if they're base-to-base from a top-down perspective.

[katadder]

It's also really bizarre to measure all distances from top down perspective, only charge in straight lines, and to hop over towers, but no to be able to jump onto them.

 

It's an abstraction, not realism. Realism arguments don't count.

 

oh I know, I wasnt arguing against it because I know thats how it works but it is odd that you cant stab somebody in the foot because hes too far away from your foot.

[CapnBloodbeard]

Ht stat only comes in to play at the start, eg:

Is lower models Ht greater than object Ht?

Yes - ignore object Ht and just measure   range top down

No - ignore model Ht, use Ht of object + top down distance between models.

 

I find this an easy way to think of it, and it took me a while to work it out. Because all measuring is done top down, there is no adding  range to Ht, or anything like that.

What about equal to?

 

Eg a Ht 2 model standing next to Ht 2 terrain, and with a 1" Melee range, can't hit that model?  I can accept if that's what the rules are, but that also seems absurd.

 

I guess what it sounds like is that melee range is measured from the base, even if it's going vertical.  Doesn't make sense, but if that's the rules

[Dirial]

I guess what it sounds like is that melee range is measured from the base, even if it's going vertical.  Doesn't make sense, but if that's the rules

 

Everything is measured from the base.

[Ausplosions]

Everything in the game is measured from the base.

[zFiend]

Everything is measured from the base.

 

TWSS. 

 

What about equal to?

 

Eg a Ht 2 model standing next to Ht 2 terrain, and with a 1" Melee range, can't hit that model?  I can accept if that's what the rules are, but that also seems absurd.

 

I guess what it sounds like is that melee range is measured from the base, even if it's going vertical.  Doesn't make sense, but if that's the rules

 

Yeah I am kinda confused about these now as well. 

[Dirial]

Ht difference is ignored if the lower model is larger than the difference.

[Ausplosions]

Ht difference is ignored if the lower model is larger than the difference.

This. So no, a ht2 model next to ht2 terrain can't hit anything on top unless it has a 3.

[CapnBloodbeard]

I guess this highlights how important it is to, where possible, be JUST back from the edge of terrain.....as my Freikorps Trapper discovered when, after positioning his base marginally over the edge to get LOS on something, Pokey Vic ran up and giggled delightfully while stabbing him in the nether regions from underneath.  Had he been a few MM over he would have been safe.  Good to get a better understanding of the rules around this.

[J_D]

What about equal to?

 

Eg a Ht 2 model standing next to Ht 2 terrain, and with a 1" Melee range, can't hit that model?  I can accept if that's what the rules are, but that also seems absurd.

 

I guess what it sounds like is that melee range is measured from the base, even if it's going vertical.  Doesn't make sense, but if that's the rules

 

Already answered, but no.

 

With elevation it's all or nothing. Either you are taller than the object, or your Ht doesn't matter.