Fixing Leviticus

[Cats Laughing]

Last I heard, Justin had his eye on Coppelius. Hur hur hur

 

Erm, shouldn't that read "Last I heard, Coppelius had Justin's eye(s)."

[hypoking]

I think that's dangerous, as it could become a bit of a self-fulfilling prophecy. "Oh, you're playing the Master Justin said was broken?"

 

I catch enough flack for answering rules questions in a non-official capacity. And rightly so. It's hard to take things I say about Malifaux game mechanics as opinion, even though they are.

 

So I'm shamelessly ripping off a dead Frenchman, but here goes.

 

The image of gaming to be found in ordinary culture is tyrannically fixed on the dev, his person, his life, his tastes, his passions, while criticism still consists for the most part in saying that Justin's work is the failure of Justin the man, Ward his madness, Cruddace his vice. The explanation of a work is always sought in the man or woman who produced it, as if it were always in the end, through the more or less transparent allegory of fiction, the voice of a single person, the designer confiding in us.

[Icemyn]

One of Leveticus' best triggers need tomes, so there are some battle for that suit with him too. I get what you are saying, but I am not certain that is applying to Leve. Mech Rider is very sufficient of getting those tomes by itself, Howard competes with Leve on high Rams, SS-Miner doesn't really need suits for what it does for Leve. I couldn't come up with a specific model that really becomes better with Leve than in Arcanist. Any specific model you were thinking of?

 

I think saying any model competes with leve for a suit is a bit of a stretch. He is a SS user with a positive flip to any action he wants. 

[CapnBloodbeard]

Hmm, I'm quite new - played Levi after only about 5 games (well, most of those only finished 2-3 turns), against a more experienced player.  Didn't feel like he was OP - I just hammered all the Waifs off the bat, but maybe my opponent wasn't that experienced, who knows.  Drew that game, but took Levi out of action early enough. 

[katadder]

just used levi myself last night (2nd game using him) against our experienced resser player. i didnt take any of the pariah upgrades so was pure outcast crew.

being turf war he took master of summoning Nicodemus but i pretty much out summoned him and out activated him all game for a 10-1 win.

levi is certainly powerful, especially against people who dont know how to deal with him that well but putting limits on his pariah upgrades wouldnt really change him that much.

 

think the main thing with Levi certainly for our area is he doesnt see much use as everyone goes on about how powerful he is so we feel a bit bad bringing him out, so as they dont play him dont know how to deal with him. 

 

my crew for the game:

 

Levi (from ash) + 2 hollow waifs

2 x abominations

johan

rusty alyce (desolate soul, from the aether)

taelor

vanessa

[deValmont]

  The thing is, once you've got Rusty Alyce, her and Leve's upgrades (~4SS), Lazarus/Ashes & Dust, 1-2 Aboms, you've only got 20 or so soulstones left to spend anyway, an as you really want to have at least one more waif anchor you're probably only looking at three out of faction models tops, so I don't think it would be that much of a hindrance.

 

  I've played against Leve a couple of times and although his personal mechanic is devious and restricts the schemes you can take against him I don't think that just his presence guarantees a loss or NPE. Every new Master I play against I have a 'He does WHAT? That's ridiculous!' moment, but that's just what it is, it's a moment and you learn to adapt. Rasputina's Ice Mirror seems absolutely bloody ridiculous the first few times but it's counterable.

[jonahmaul]

The thing is, once you've got Rusty Alyce, her and Leve's upgrades (~4SS), Lazarus/Ashes & Dust, 1-2 Aboms, you've only got 20 or so soulstones left to spend anyway, an as you really want to have at least one more waif anchor you're probably only looking at three out of faction models tops, so I don't think it would be that much of a hindrance.

I've yet to play my Levi yet but this matches my own thinking.  As with Katadder's list I think most of the things I would want to take with him are from Outcast anyway so Pariah of Ashes/Bone (of that's what they're called!) don't seem overly powerful.  Part of the reason I wanted Levi is so I could use my Ressers with him but as I collect Outcasts as well it's unlikely to be the primary consideration.  He seems like a top tier Master by what I've read about him but that doesn't seem to be a result of his ability to hire other constructs/undead

[admiralvorkraft]

I'm not a great player by any stretch of the imagination, but Levi has never really troubled me. I don't mind assassin-style masters and other than the man himself (and to a lesser extent A&D) his crew isn't mobile or particularly hard to kill. I've never played against an "optimized Pariah list" but frankly I can't see how it's that much worse than his standard build.

 

Then again, I've played against him with Lucius and a Doppelganger and Austringers make the old man a lot less scary. Plus not having any linchpin models takes the sting out of Levi's eventual, lethal, activation.

I'm sure Icemyn would roll me if we took to the field, but I don't think it would be Levi's fault.