Ramos Fans

[Ozz]

Or more steam punk arachnids, i have a question about them.

It appears summoning them is simple enough, if at times to make a lot a little resource intensive.

But if you summon three Arachnids in b2b, they all start with 2 WD, then one swarms them together, as far as we can tell, the swarm will be created with full WD, is this correct?

[Adran]

The rules in M2e summon a fresh swarm into play.

It does not have the wounds or conditions from the spiders that were sacrificed to create the swarm.

It is fully healthy.

[Fenton Crack]

The swarm does get summoned with full wounds (9), but I think an argument can be made that three spiders with two wounds each may still have more utility than the swarm with nine, especially for dropping markers and out activating. I'm sure however situations can be imagined where you would prefer the swarm (for destroying scheme markers maybe?)

[Dracomax]

The swarm is really decent at melee. It's Ml is decent (a 5 will hit the majority of models on an even flip), and it gets a to damage when at half wounds or more, with the choice of extra attacks or board control every time it actually hits.

In addition, it can remove 2-3 scheme markers if placed right, can give good healing to itself, and can mean the difference between losing 2-3 severely (1-2 wounds left)wounded spiders and having 1 full swarm.

They are going to be a huge asset for Ramos. The trick is going to be finding the right time to bring them out.

[mythicFOX]

The swarm is really decent at melee. It's Ml is decent (a 5 will hit the majority of models on an even flip), and it gets a to damage when at half wounds or more, with the choice of extra attacks or board control every time it actually hits.

In addition, it can remove 2-3 scheme markers if placed right, can give good healing to itself, and can mean the difference between losing 2-3 severely (1-2 wounds left)wounded spiders and having 1 full swarm.

They are going to be a huge asset for Ramos. The trick is going to be finding the right time to bring them out.

When to swarm is key. They also have a good board control option now with Cary Away.

[Fenton Crack]

I am excited for Carry Away, but have not seen any bat reps yet with its use. It may be one of those abilities that one does not use often, but is very effective when you do. Has anyone been using it that has a bat rep or even a turn of a game they had where it was used to good effect that they could share?

[Dracomax]

I think part of the issue right now is that everyone is so in love with the individual spider that the swarm is getting overlooked. also, it fits a niche that Ramos big hitters kind of fit as well. SO people haven't really hit the point where they are using the Swarm consistantly.

That being said, give it time. My guess is it is going to be used a lot more as people settle into New Ramos, and figure out the right time to use stuff. all it will take is a few batreps in which they are decisive(and Carry away could make or break that) or a good showing in a high profile tournament, and everyone will be talking about them.

I think they are underrated myself, as they make a decent swiss army knife model--they can adjust to fit 3 different and important uses, and you don't even have to hire one. But until people start to figure out the timing, you aren't going to see them being really decisive, or using their abilities too often, because they aren't getting summoned into the right place at the right time to do so.

I will say I have destroyed an opponent's game with the marker removal ability.

[Fenton Crack]

I certainly see the obvious utility of summoning them from from three near dead spiders that have but a single wound, and maybe for a marker eater in some schemes, but I think it's the lack of a "de-swarm" that causes trepidation. Granted, if they could heal up by being swarmed, then separate, that would be OP, and I'm not lobbying for that. There is perhaps a good tension I the fact that you must commit to the swarm and the fact you are losing two activations, and it likely balances the mechanic. It's just a scary prospect, all the more so since I'm far from having the skill set or experience necessary to know when to pull the trigger.

[Nephalumps]

My buddy who plays Ramos has gotten some good mileage out of the swarms. There seems to be a point where you kind of hit a "spider critical mass", so at that point it can be really helpful to swarm them together into a more combat capable minion. Plus as others have said their pulse ability can be super clutch.

[decker_cky]

I'm considering testing a list starting with two swarms as some medium hitters with high utility. They're pretty affordable at 8SS, and particularly if you have Joss, you should have some spare scrap counters to heal them when it's needed.

[EntrepeNinja]

I'm also really looking forward to Large Steam Punk Arachnids- I'm interested in their utility in a world where they won't just be brought because they drop two scrap when they die.

[Sybarite]

I'm also really looking forward to Large Steam Punk Arachnids- I'm interested in their utility in a world where they won't just be brought because they drop two scrap when they die.

Pretty sure people used them for other things too. They were good beatsticks for 5ss. A lot of Mei players used them at least.

[Buddhanutz]

A wonderful change in Mk2 is the removal of special forces. This was a limiting factor when considering taking the giant arachnid. Arcanist had a rough go in general in mk1 related to special forces limitations. A lot of our good models were special forces so we were limited to 2. Anyway, I hope they let the giant arachnid set traps as described in his old fluff blurb : )

[decker_cky]

I'm hoping Large Steampunk Arachnids aren't Rare 2 anymore.

[bearn]

I've had two games now where I formed them up into a swarm just so I could eat multiple markers my opponent was trying to place near the end of the game. With scheme markers being so prevalent in the game your opponent has to take them into consideration.

The carry away trigger when it goes off is a great way to setup other models melee ranges for later activation. For the most part I have gotten great use doing that in combo with Joss and his pneumatic fist or getting a living model within 3" of him so I can get a SS for killing it.

They are very versatile but as previously posted swarming them together is a big commitment since the 3 individual spiders can do so much for you.

[DavicusPrime]

I like using individual Spiders and a Swarm together. I took 2 Plus a swarm in my last couple games and they really work together well.

I waited until my opponent activated a high Df model, then I ran my individual spiders into B2B for latch on and then charged the Swarm in to chew it up. If the target survives, then Ramos zaps it with his friendly ignoring ranged attack, or Joss charges in and carves a scrap counter out of it.

And of course, once the spiders start getting chewed up, the scrap just lets you replace your losses, if not get a net increase in models (which is why I need to pick up more arachnid models).

The scheme marker destruction abilities of the Swarm were wonderful at thwarting my opponent's plots and will become a major part of my VP Denial stategies.

-DavicusPrime

[Fenton Crack]

Did you make any use of the swarm's Carry Away trigger at all? I'm excited at its possibilities, but have yet to see a batrep that catalyst made use of it.

[mythicFOX]

In a game at the weekend I carried and opponent's model off their outflank objective in the final turn. Where you have activation control this sort of play is a lot of fun.

[DavicusPrime]

Unfortunately, I didn't get the carry away trigger to go off. My control hands for both games last week were pathetic. The only trigger I was successful at setting off multiple times was the Decapitate trigger on Howie. Just about everything else I did was luck of the draw. On the positive side, I got the black joker first turn in both games so I was able to keep it out of circulation.

My biggest problem was not figuring out how to get scrap markers on the board early on. I'm going to have to sort out using the electrical creation to make my first one. I'm still getting used to the idea that it isn't a spirit anymore. And I was so used to Ramos being able to generate them as a (2) Action in 1.5 that I didn't really think ahead on how I was going to get the raw materials to multiply my spiders. And when I finally did start seeing scrap markers accumulate, I didn't have the cards to ensure I could build more than two a turn.

I need to do a better job of resource management in the future if I'm going to have any hope of going the summoning route with Ramos.

-DavicusPrime

[Dracomax]

If you bring an EC, you move it up it's move, then use Ramos' (0) magnetize to get free movement on him and kill the EC for scrap, still out of range of the damage.

Otherwise, bring a Large arachnid or Joss to get 2 scrap(but they'll get hurt by the explosion)

---------- Post added at 09:15 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:13 AM ----------

ECs are wonderful anyway. If you summon 2 of them, you can put models in a situation where you get one scrap, and they take 5 unresistable damage.

[DavicusPrime]

ECs are wonderful anyway. If you summon 2 of them, you can put models in a situation where you get one scrap, and they take 5 unresistable damage.

There's another thing I have to get used to... that I can have more than one EC on the table at a time. I really could have used that trick to help me take down the Viks who I couldn't quite finish off before they healed up. Ripping 5 wounds off of them right off the bat (add another wound if I can get the first EC into B2B) would have made it much more likely that I'd drop one in a single round. *furiously scribbling notes for my next game*

-DavicusPrime

[Dracomax]

Well, the summon upgrade is necessary if you want to use them that way, and it does take up a slot and a (0) you are already fighting for, but it lets you add up to one EC per turn. This can be very powerful—and can be a really powerful counter to some models.

Theoretically, you could set off an EC to blow up 2 more, for a total of 7 damage in the center of the venn diagram. it's unlikeley, due to the amount of setup needed, and the opportunity to respond by your enemy, but they don't cost scrap to summon, so...