Jonas Albrecht Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 It's starting to get a little... onesided in wins in our group, so I am seeking out a poor crew Preferably in the form of a master who underperforms. I'm looking at Gremlins. Pitch me some other ideas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morella Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 Since you play Guild, have you tried running Lucius as a leader? And of course there is always Molly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Albrecht Posted December 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 Since you play Guild, have you tried running Lucius as a leader? And of course there is always Molly. Lucius, while not my idea of fun, is at worst slightly above average. No, I need something with issues, like Ramos, or Marcus, or Rasputina. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevorin Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 Gremlins are ridiculous, no where near a handicap. After the amount of games Ive had Ive come to realize that there are no OP or UP'd masters; this game is extremely rock, paper scissors. If you want a challenge, play the scissors to your opponents rock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morella Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 I agree with what Sevorin said. Maybe you can try running a suboptimal crew build instead? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sssk Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 Why not give rasputina a spin, or else give some "bad" minions a go? Play an all book 1 crew? Or if you're really hammering people, why not use rasputina with only "bad" book 1 minions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornelious1424 Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 Molly as a master would be a pretty uphill climb. Your choices get really limited (more so than other henchmen I think) due to the type of models she can hire. If you go Marcus, try playing him with just beasts or for more of a handicap, with models from his box set. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naz9 Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 Mayhap is time for you to expand your gaming group and seek out new challenges. People do get used to their local meta gamers and sometimes a 'alpha' player tends to dominate a group of people he\she plays often. Maybe you are really good but I expect there are others out there who will give you all you can handle regardless of crew being played. If you need tougher games, you may have to travel or recruit more players. Just my .02. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Albrecht Posted December 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 Gremlins are ridiculous, no where near a handicap. After the amount of games Ive had Ive come to realize that there are no OP or UP'd masters; this game is extremely rock, paper scissors. If you want a challenge, play the scissors to your opponents rock. I don't agree with this at all. There are some masters that under-perform, and some that never shine no matter who you play them against. And besides, no game should ever rely on RPS design, unless that game is Rock-Paper-Scissors. It's garbage design philosophy. As for playing intentionally bad Guild crews, I'm wanting to use this opportunity to play crews I'm not familiar with. ---------- Post added at 11:50 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:50 AM ---------- Mayhap is time for you to expand your gaming group and seek out new challenges. Been working on that for a long time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naz9 Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 It's subjective. A 'bad' model depends on who you play, what they play, the results, your skill level, their skill, and prolly a dozen other factors...it seems if you are winning the majority of your games by wide margins, it has little to do with handicaping yourself. Because at bigger events and tourments your not going to be handicapping yourself obviously. It seems you have figured out the ways to deal with your current play group ( I could be wrong) and need some new blood. Have you considered teaching and training your play group? Share that info that makes you successful? I know it's hard to find new players, but taking a subjectively 'poor' model and playing against your group seems to say, " I'm so good I'm taking garbage against you to make it a fair or better game for me." I'm of the opinion that you play a wargame with your opponent, not against him. You seem very knowledgable 'bout Malifaux and I'm sure could be a helpful mentor to make better players all over. What tourneys do you attend btw? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Albrecht Posted December 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 I like teaching random people to play, but I don't want that to become my Malifaux experience. Indeed, the reason I'm looking to handicap myself is so that there's a more level playing field between me and my friends. You know, the people I want to play against. I want to be able to go full bore against them without it being an absolute slaughter every time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
decker_cky Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 All book 1 arcanist beasts marcus crew! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Albrecht Posted December 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 All book 1 arcanist beasts marcus crew! And a December Acolyte. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forar Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 How about letting your opponent choose one of your schemes, or build part of your crew (X soul stones worth)? Maybe let them pick your strategy, or declare your master when they declare their faction? Something to give them an edge in crew creation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Albrecht Posted December 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 How about letting your opponent choose one of your schemes, or build part of your crew (X soul stones worth)? Maybe let them pick your strategy, or declare your master when they declare their faction? Something to give them an edge in crew creation. My friends don't really have the experience to build bad crews. Hell, the last two times I offered to let my friends choose which master to face, they opted for Perdita. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forar Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 My friends don't really have the experience to build bad crews. Hell, the last two times I offered to let my friends choose which master to face, they opted for Perdita. Play 5 ss short? They run 35, you run 30 (or whatever level you guys play at). Take the red joker out of your deck. Take an avatar and very pointedly avoid using it, up to and including using soul stones to do so. Let them set up the table and pick the deployment type and where you go, while making you deploy first. Surely there must be something that'd give them a leg up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddywhack Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 I do agree with the statement that if you want a challenge, then help your friends learn to play smarter. You could always try the switching forces thing - you make your list and your opponent makes his. You can either play one game and switch from the outset, hopefulyl showing your friend some new tricks that you know that they may not have thought of or play two games with each player using both crews to again see what each force strengths and weaknesses are. This way you get to 'teach' without having to 'teach' if you get my meaning. You can just have fun and play while hopefully shining light on your opponents' forces strengths and your forces weaknesses. I also agree with you that there are most definitely some masters that underperform and others that are supremely solid against all. I disagree that the RPS style is how ot go. If you pick rock and I pick scissors then why go through all the rigamarole of setting up and playing? That is a horrible design and a bad analogy. I do believe that Malifaux is fairly well balanced overall, but to say that there are no underperforming Masters or overperforming ones is not really true (and just because an underperforming master happens to win against an overpowering one does not invalidate the arguement - exceptions do not make the rule). JMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Albrecht Posted December 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 I do agree with the statement that if you want a challenge, then help your friends learn to play smarter. You could always try the switching forces thing - you make your list and your opponent makes his. The only issue there is that it doesn't eliminate the origin problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Csonti Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 Gremlins as a way of handicap? Most probably you never faced them vs an adept opponent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sliver Chocobo Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 Lucius, while not my idea of fun, is at worst slightly above average. No, I need something with issues, like Ramos, or Marcus, or Rasputina. I've played a bit of Ramos, he is no handycap Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Albrecht Posted December 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 I've played a bit of Ramos, he is no handycap He well and truly has one in the form of being slow as $$$$$$$$. Small cache, too. ---------- Post added at 01:45 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:44 PM ---------- Gremlins as a way of handicap? Most probably you never faced them vs an adept opponent. I really haven't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rameses Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 Play Colette? I kid. But seriously I think Molly will be your best option for a "handicap" though I certainly don't believe she's the worst Henchman, she does have a STEEP learning curve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Albrecht Posted December 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 Who is the worst Hench, if not Molly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rameses Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 Who is the worst Hench, if not Molly? Honestly my opinion of worst or better are based on the "easy button". Therefore I'd say Von Schill is by far the worst Henchman. Sure Von Schill performs fantastically but there is no level of depth to playing other than "point and click." Pretty lame IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgraz Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 The original Arcanists are some of the hardest. Marcus playing with all beasts is tough, even with the newer beasts....only Night Terrors really shine....everything else is a glass cannon that breaks if someone looks at it. But once you learn how to use him (even with all beasts) he can be pretty competitive. Ramos and Rasputina both struggle in any strats that require them to move anywhere. Ramos is much better with some of the things now available to him - especially his Avatar. Rasputina still struggles to do anything other than blowing people up. The only way to get some better movement is to limit your crew by taking one of the most expensive models in the game...Snowstorm. I wouldn't go Gremlins, once you play them a little and learn them you'll be crushing people. Som'er without Ophelia is a little harder and takes a little longer to figure out the crushing. I would agree that Molly is the weakest Henchman and really the only choice there. The others are at least on par with the original Arcanists...and Von Schill, Collodi and Ophelia are way better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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