graeme27uk Posted May 28, 2012 Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 Played vs Seamus Avatar with Zoraida/Collodi. Narrow draw. Was going really well until Avatar Seamus popped... in amongst a big mob of marionettes/wicked dolls... i kept failing the Terrifying check, running way and getting wicked striked to death... So how do you get rid of the big boy? Stitched seemed pretty good, almost killed him with one stitched..... gambling your life! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cunning Posted May 28, 2012 Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 By and large the best counter is ranged attacks. Staying out of the terrifying zone so it doesn't affect you. Not always possible but if you can it's what you should aim for. Von Schill is good for this, even if he gets into the T-zone he should still manage to hold his nerve then he can jump away from harm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graeme27uk Posted May 28, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 What if you don't have ranged attacks.... Collodi's dolls are good but no ranged hitters apart from Stitched which are limited in mobility. In fact.... Zoraida doesn't have many ranged options.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sholto Posted May 28, 2012 Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 You could take Hamelin, and he can take a Watcher, and then the Watcher could remove Seamus' Terrifying. Anathema cannot exist without Terrifying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cunning Posted May 28, 2012 Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 Couldn't Zoraida Hex off Anathema? Your other option is to try and kill Seamus early on. Collodi should be able to do this relatively easy as he's got low df. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CannonFodder Posted May 28, 2012 Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 I find its hard the other way around. I played the same match up and was dead turn 2. It was shared deliver a message and I don't think anything can beat Z+C in that regard. I was playing a game VonSchill vs aSeamus and when aSeamus appeared I started to have problems, UNTIL Taelor with her Wp7 took him out. Then his entire crew fell apart. She has enough WP to no run and enough hitting power to seriously ruin his day. ---------- Post added at 12:29 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:27 PM ---------- Couldn't Zoraida Hex off Anathema? Your other option is to try and kill Seamus early on. Collodi should be able to do this relatively easy as he's got low df. That would work. There is a rulebook ability to stop people from copying avatar abilities, but nothing on removing. And the watcher can remove terror from Seamus for a turn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PierceSternum Posted May 28, 2012 Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 I cannot speak from the Neverborn perspective of killing aSeamus, but I can speak from the aSeamus "what scares me bad" perspective. Ranged spells with WP defense. (I usually wind up with WP 1)ANYTHING on the table with paralyze. (Its game over, no disengaging strikes means the things that pass their terror checks are hitting me and the ones that fail GET AWAY!)Not keeping models in melee range to give me armor+2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted May 28, 2012 Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 Zoraida and her Obey spell can have a field day with a WP 1 aSeamus. Additionally you know what is really effective in dealing with aSeamus? 1 solid Beatstick. aSeamus is not all that hard to hit, or kill. Sure he has armor 2, but so do many, many other models in Malifaux, and if you don't have a hitter that can deal with armor 2 you weren't going to win many games anyway. You really only need one solid model to get in on aSeamus. Remember the biggest weakness of Terror, or even Anathema, aSeamus cannot force you to fail. He has absolutely no way to spend SS or cheat cards to kick the number out of the achievable range, the way other masters can cheat up dmging spells or seriously nasty attacks. Assuming a manifest, the absolute best TN aSeamus can force you to test at on the first round of his manifesting is an effective 17, a number even a WP 4 model can pass by cheating in a 13. This assumes that Seamus kicks up his Terror by using Succumb to Darkness, and then using the Gorgon's miasma to reduce all WP by 2. aSeamus manifesting will not come out of the blue so it is not all that difficult to ensure you have the one card you need to get a full round of strikes against him, and with a Df of 3 he gets hit really easily. 1 effective beatstick, if planned for and used properly can shut aSeamus down much of the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graeme27uk Posted May 28, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 So can Zoraida.... 1) Target aSeamus with Hex? Does he not still count as a master? 2) Target aSeamus with Obey? (as above) Do avatars no longer count as a Master then? If so then that would open up all sorts of nasty possibilities that are making me chuckle... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnternalVoid Posted May 28, 2012 Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 I am pretty sure that Avatars count as masters still off the top of my head *don't have the book on hand* so I doubt that Zoraida can Hex or Obey one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxvonlaibach Posted May 28, 2012 Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 I'm pretty sure Zoraida cannot target Seamus with any of these spells, although it would we worth investigating whether she can obey somebody else (mature? Collodi?) to charge into him. Or would they still need to take Wp tests? One trick that could be effective is the whole stitched + doppelganger thing. Basically, you copy gamble your life and Zo's Wp stat, and you've got yourself a bunch of Wp 10 gambles (up to three w/obey, since mimic lasts until end closing phase). Further, D-gang is potentially faster than a stitched, since she can copy Wk off someone on the first couple of turns, when she's not busy gambling peoples' lives away. As a bonus, your enemy gets negative flips for initiative, which makes this somewhat easier to pull off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joel Posted May 28, 2012 Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 What if you don't have ranged attacks.... Collodi's dolls are good but no ranged hitters apart from Stitched which are limited in mobility. In fact.... Zoraida doesn't have many ranged options.... zoraida (8 stones) tuco 2 gunsmiths convict gunslinger 2 stitched together will that do for ranged attacks? I ran this tonight for the first time. plenty shooty enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandwich Posted May 28, 2012 Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 You can't Obey masters, and Hex explicitly states "Non-Master" in its Spell description. The Stitched / Doppelganger idea is pretty good and will probably kill the Avatar of Dread in a single swoop of Stitched, Stitched, Doppelganger. Although if the Seamus player gets wind of that there are counters to it. Your best bet is going to be taking Von Schill over Collodi if you need to kill Seamus because that +4 Wp from Hardass affects ALL friendly models and is a HARD counter to A.Seamus' gimmick, which is Morale Duels. Also a Rg 12, Cb 6 Dg 3/4/5 gun with Critical Strike is nothing if not the bane of Seamus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PierceSternum Posted May 28, 2012 Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 FINALLY! Someone found a use for Von Schill. I thought he would forever collect dust on our shelves. But seriously, yeah, ouch... Seamus no likey... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xeth1313 Posted May 29, 2012 Report Share Posted May 29, 2012 If you are running Zoriada/Collodi then you can take the Brutal, Arcane, or Carrion Effigies, all of which have a ranged attack at only a few soulstones a piece, and they're Dolls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maljra Posted June 13, 2012 Report Share Posted June 13, 2012 With Zorida you can bewitch him and prevent him from cheating or if you take aZorida you can throw tangled threads and suppressed destiny to burn up his control hand and take away any suits on flipped cards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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