asrian Posted December 18, 2015 Report Share Posted December 18, 2015 I just picked up Kirai and plan to build/paint her, Izamu, and Datsu Ba next, but I was wondering if I would ever really need more than two Onryo? Anyone with Kirai experience that can give me some insight here? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted December 18, 2015 Report Share Posted December 18, 2015 In general, you don't need any. They can be good summons, but I find them good summons with Molly, as you don't give up anything to summon them as opposed to giving up wounds with Kirai. If you plan on just getting them via Datsue-Ba 2 will do you fine, but in almost all instances unless your opponent is being obliging and clumping up I'd almost always just take the Gaki instead even if you do trigger the ability to summon an Onryo.Don't get me wrong I do like them as summons, but in specific applications. Ultimately 2 will do you more than enough. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phototropic Posted December 19, 2015 Report Share Posted December 19, 2015 2 should be fine, i don't find myself summoning them that often (as i find drowned better and they cost about the same card wise) but unlike fetid i will always take them if able from Datsue ba's trigger, I've found folks are scared enough of Ikaryo that its nice to have another way of handing out adversary. I will hire one at the most and its pretty rare for dats to summon enough that I will need a 3rd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nunorod Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 On 12/18/2015 at 7:36 PM, Fetid Strumpet said: In general, you don't need any. They can be good summons, but I find them good summons with Molly, as you don't give up anything to summon them as opposed to giving up wounds with Kirai. If you plan on just getting them via Datsue-Ba 2 will do you fine, but in almost all instances unless your opponent is being obliging and clumping up I'd almost always just take the Gaki instead even if you do trigger the ability to summon an Onryo. Don't get me wrong I do like them as summons, but in specific applications. Ultimately 2 will do you more than enough. So what do you use as minions with Kirai, apart from a Belle and maybe Flesh Construct? Because I believe only they as minions can give adversary? Or the Shikome but those I always summon. When I take stuff like Belles, Nurse, Flesh construct, Izamu, Datsue Ba or Sybelle, I found that I lack a bit of the great buff that is Adversary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 I played Kirai a few times, but she seemed to far over the line in power that I didn't enjoy my opponent not having a chance so I retired her. The lists I tended to use didn't actually use belles all that often. I was mostly using Datsue-ba, and Kirai to hand out adversary, when I bothered actually trying to apply it. Mostly I was swarming Gaki and Night Terrors, backed up by heavy hitters and support and then summoning the Hanged and Shikome. Don't get me wrong I do like the Onryo, but I tend to like them better in a Molly Spirit crew. At least in my experience Adversary in a Kirai crew tends to be a win more condition, as opposed to being a helpful buff like it is in a Molly Spirit crew. Others may have different experiences. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flat Tooth Posted December 23, 2015 Report Share Posted December 23, 2015 On 12/21/2015 at 5:35 PM, Fetid Strumpet said: I played Kirai a few times, but she seemed to far over the line in power that I didn't enjoy my opponent not having a chance so I retired her. The lists I tended to use didn't actually use belles all that often. I was mostly using Datsue-ba, and Kirai to hand out adversary, when I bothered actually trying to apply it. Mostly I was swarming Gaki and Night Terrors, backed up by heavy hitters and support and then summoning the Hanged and Shikome. Don't get me wrong I do like the Onryo, but I tend to like them better in a Molly Spirit crew. At least in my experience Adversary in a Kirai crew tends to be a win more condition, as opposed to being a helpful buff like it is in a Molly Spirit crew. Others may have different experiences. Oh no! This kind of worries me. I never like feeling like I'm powering through solely because my models are busted or whatever. Is she really that powerful? We don't really have a rezzer in our area so I got her for a fun painting project (also I love summoning). Hopefully I'm bad enough to counteract this haha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MR TORGUE Posted December 23, 2015 Report Share Posted December 23, 2015 28 minutes ago, Flat Tooth said: Oh no! This kind of worries me. I never like feeling like I'm powering through solely because my models are busted or whatever. Is she really that powerful? We don't really have a rezzer in our area so I got her for a fun painting project (also I love summoning). Hopefully I'm bad enough to counteract this haha Nah, but she does provide a steep learning curve for opponents - once they learn how to dance around her amazing abilites things tend to level out. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted December 23, 2015 Report Share Posted December 23, 2015 She's on the level of if not as powerful as Levi, mainly because she does everything, and everything very well. She has the damage of a dedicated beater if you take the unforgiving upgrade. She has the support capabilities of a dedicated support master with her ability to hand out adversary, and give spirits bonuses to attack and damage flips, and move hard hitting or multi ap sprints around with swirl spirits. She has some off the best summoning abilities in the game. With conditions that let her summon on a kill, or summon off easy to create models or off wound batteries like flesh constructs, to say nothing of the beat stick the Ikiryo is and the special way she summons her. She is almost impossible to kill because of her ability to operate in the back field and still project power, and her amazing defensive trigger. Additionally adding to that you can't lock her down because of her ability to teleport around. She isn't broken per say, but she is, in my opinion, one of the more powerful masters in the game, so much so that do feel she should be toned down. She does have a little bit of a learning curve, but she can definitely be a not fun experience for an opponent to face. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dassenkop Posted December 24, 2015 Report Share Posted December 24, 2015 14 hours ago, tollstar_deluxe said: Nah, but she does provide a steep learning curve for opponents - once they learn how to dance around her amazing abilites things tend to level out. I started to play Kirai recently and still learning the tricks she has but this thread made me wonder if people can give some insight in to what you can do to dance around Kirai's abilities? Pullmyfinger is provinding some insight but I'm sure there are more out there. Thx. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted December 24, 2015 Report Share Posted December 24, 2015 Might want to create a dedicated thread for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asrian Posted December 24, 2015 Author Report Share Posted December 24, 2015 I'd be interested in that as well, Dassenkop. I picked Kirai up because she was the only Resser master I didn't own, and to learn her so I could learn how to dismantle her. She and Leve are the only two masters in the game where I felt I was completely overpowered for the longest time and that they were both a bit too good. Now, after both playing with and against Leve, while I still feel he is a bit too good, I at least don't feel like the game is over before it begins when playing him due to better understanding of how he works . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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