Some thoughts on Mah Tucket

[Dumb Luck]

Someone on Twitter was asking for some basic crew builds with Mah. I've been really enjoying playing with her recently (yo internet, bottom tier - she ain't) and thought I'd share some of my experiences with building crews with her.

Starting with her starter, I don't think there is anything in there that would be considered an auto take. A lot of the Gremlin community have long documented lack of interest in the Bushwhackers, My defence of them is a topic for another time. Rest assured, you don't need three. Much of the same can be said for the Little Lass. She isn't bad but I don't understand what she does. I know she hits things and passes free upgrades onto Mah when she dies, but I don't understand why you'd want this model to be your choice for cheap beats. And a model turning up just to get a groovy benefit upon death is rarely something I've been keen on (also read: any tactics from V1 for Som'er that build their entire basis around 'Survival of the Fittest').

Trixie is solid. Her Ml combos nicely with Mah's tricks, as does her Lure. Mainly though, you'll want her for 'Ill Omens'. She is less essential in this crew than she is in Brewmaster. Brewmaster dies on his feet if he doesn't get the activation. Mah can live and the buffs from 'Chores' aren't that great.

As any of my locals will attest, my 'core' crew (I don't believe there is much call for that in the game really) for Mah contains the same stuff I put in other lists. Beaters like Burt, Fran and Mancha can get a respectable Ml value with Mah and free pushes. If she has a 'standard' trooper minion, that'd have to be the Roosters (Ml7, again). Even basic Bayous can reach a respectable Ml with Mah around. 

Really though, she is a solo piece. Take whatever works well for the mission, then put Mah in. Considering how flexible a lot of our choices are, this is something that most of our Masters can do. Build the crew, slot the Master in after.

On a different note, if someone can tell me what the heck I'm meant to do with Ulix ...

[Dumb Luck]

On another note, I think the Lucky Emissary (due to his built in card draw) can do wonders for Mah. She eats through resources so quick, so help in that area is cool.

[Dogmantra]

I too like Mah a lot, having played her a little on vassal. Probably gonna end up as my go-to master instead of Som'er once her box is out fully. Love the spoon. Not too sure about how stuff will work in the future.

[Dumb Luck]

She is very card and activation heavy. She wants to go first and all of your cards. And most likely a stone for a free charge.

[daniello_s]

The first thing which comes to my mind when I think about Mah is 'GET OFF MY LAND!!!!!' :)

[Vidd]

Much of the same can be said for the Little Lass. She isn't bad but I don't understand what she does. I know she hits things and passes free upgrades onto Mah when she dies, but I don't understand why you'd want this model to be your choice for cheap beats. And a model turning up just to get a groovy benefit upon death is rarely something I've been keen on (also read: any tactics from V1 for Som'er that build their entire basis around 'Survival of the Fittest').

At 4SS, she seems like a decent little beatstick. What else would you slot in at that price point?

If your enemy doesn't kill her, she's a decent little beatstick. If they do, she turns into a free upgrade for Mah. It's rather expensive, but I could imagine situations where turning her into a Ml6 3 could come in handy if even for the engagement, too.

[Dumb Luck]

The first thing which comes to my mind when I think about Mah is 'GET OFF MY LAND!!!!!' :)

Not to brag, but I was the guy who coined that ability name in playlets. Not the rule, but it's name. Quite chuffed.

Much of the same can be said for the Little Lass. She isn't bad but I don't understand what she does. I know she hits things and passes free upgrades onto Mah when she dies, but I don't understand why you'd want this model to be your choice for cheap beats. And a model turning up just to get a groovy benefit upon death is rarely something I've been keen on (also read: any tactics from V1 for Som'er that build their entire basis around 'Survival of the Fittest').

At 4SS, she seems like a decent little beatstick. What else would you slot in at that price point?

If your enemy doesn't kill her, she's a decent little beatstick. If they do, she turns into a free upgrade for Mah. It's rather expensive, but I could imagine situations where turning her into a Ml6 3 could come in handy if even for the engagement, too.

This is why I think I need to give her another look in. 4ss models aren't something that are plentiful in Gremlins (Piglets: Good with Ulix, nice as freebies elsewhere/ Lucky Effigy: Marcus tier), so there aren't many comparison points. Maybe I just think I can get better value at 5ss with a Bug? Seeing Insig and Peon on a 4ss mini freaks me out a little too.

[Vidd]

That's actually not always a bad thing. Some schemes/strategies reward the enemy for killing minions (for which she wouldn't count) and for some others, it won't matter that she's a peon (e.g. denying points for Protect Territory) so it's not always a liability. But yes, for some she simply can't contribute because of her Peon and Insignificant status.

Still the statline, her durability (Df 5, Wd 5) and almost unique price point seem interesting to me. If you get a Ram on Chores and get her tactical action off, you could really cause some interesting damage, too.

 

[Dumb Luck]

That's actually not always a bad thing. Some schemes/strategies reward the enemy for killing minions (for which she wouldn't count) and for some others, it won't matter that she's a peon (e.g. denying points for Protect Territory) so it's not always a liability. But yes, for some she simply can't contribute because of her Peon and Insignificant status.

Still the statline, her durability (Df 5, Wd 5) and almost unique price point seem interesting to me. If you get a Ram on Chores and get her tactical action off, you could really cause some interesting damage, too.

 

The Apron would be the upgrade of choice to go on her. Could make her annoying?

[Flat Tooth]

This all makes me very happy. As a super new player when I see something that doesn't seem powerful I typically chalk it up to me not understanding the interactions well enough yet. I'm very excited to beat on enemies with a giant spoon and a model that reminds me heavily of Madam Mim.

[Math Mathonwy]

Someone on Twitter was asking for some basic crew builds with Mah. I've been really enjoying playing with her recently (yo internet, bottom tier - she ain't) and thought I'd share some of my experiences with building crews with her.

I don't think that she is bottom tier when taking all the Masters into account, but I think she is at the bottom when it comes to Gremlin Masters.

Situations where she is better than Ophelia are pretty rare.

Starting with her starter, I don't think there is anything in there that would be considered an auto take. A lot of the Gremlin community have long documented lack of interest in the Bushwhackers, My defence of them is a topic for another time. Rest assured, you don't need three. Much of the same can be said for the Little Lass. She isn't bad but I don't understand what she does. I know she hits things and passes free upgrades onto Mah when she dies, but I don't understand why you'd want this model to be your choice for cheap beats. And a model turning up just to get a groovy benefit upon death is rarely something I've been keen on (also read: any tactics from V1 for Som'er that build their entire basis around 'Survival of the Fittest').

She can use the Upgrade while she has (except for Out for Blood since she can't reach the suits). Also note that Mah has an ability which Sacs a friendly model so unless you feel like you should never use that ability, she is something of a prime target. You can give Lil Lass Know the Terrain and then when Mah has gotten stuck in sac Lass in order to give Mah that Upgrade and positive twists to Ml. Lass is the cheapest Do It Right! target in the Faction if you consider that you get to keep the Upgrade.

Trixie is solid. Her Ml combos nicely with Mah's tricks, as does her Lure. Mainly though, you'll want her for 'Ill Omens'. She is less essential in this crew than she is in Brewmaster. Brewmaster dies on his feet if he doesn't get the activation. Mah can live and the buffs from 'Chores' aren't that great.

As any of my locals will attest, my 'core' crew (I don't believe there is much call for that in the game really) for Mah contains the same stuff I put in other lists. Beaters like Burt, Fran and Mancha can get a respectable Ml value with Mah and free pushes. If she has a 'standard' trooper minion, that'd have to be the Roosters (Ml7, again). Even basic Bayous can reach a respectable Ml with Mah around. 

Heh, first you say that her buffs from Ill Omens aren't all that (and I tend to agree) but then you use one of them as a standard thing. But I tend to agree that they aren't all that. How often do you really end up getting that +1 Ml? Because Gremlins tend to like high Rams, it seems like cheating it in isn't the best of ideas.

Really though, she is a solo piece. Take whatever works well for the mission, then put Mah in. Considering how flexible a lot of our choices are, this is something that most of our Masters can do. Build the crew, slot the Master in after.

Like alluded to above, I'm having a difficult time coming up with a scenario where she is a better choice than any of the other Gremlin Masters.

And again, that's not to say that she can't be competitive or fun (she is super fun!) but just that if going for optimal she doesn't seem to fit the bill.

[Omenbringer]

A lot of the Gremlin community have long documented lack of interest in the Bushwhackers, My defence of them is a topic for another time. Rest assured, you don't need three.

 

Not sure why the Bushwhackers are leaving such a bad taste, they fill a very unique role in the Gremlin faction. Namely they are self sufficient, and don't require much if any support other than healing really. Unlike most of our models which really like to cluster around their support pieces, Bushwhackers can go it alone. I do agree that you likely wont want three of them in any gremlin list, but 2 can do some work.  About the only thing that I can put my finger on as to why the luke warm response, is the hiring cost. They are not the bargain that our other choices are with their given crews.

And a model turning up just to get a groovy benefit upon death is rarely something I've been keen on (also read: any tactics from V1 for Som'er that build their entire basis around 'Survival of the Fittest').

I agree with you wholeheartedly, targeting a wounded Bayou Gremlin to fuel Get Your Bro, killing it in the process to draw the 2 Control Cards, yet still providing a replacement Bayou Gremlin is just a stupid and unnecessary abuse. You saw the same damn thing with the Malifaux Rats back then, only being hired only to provide larva targets for Skeeters (and a heal as well). These were stupid abuses that weren't needed and tipped the scales significantly on Som'er's balance.

Som'er has more than enough other tools that make him competitive, stupid abuses just diminish that.

[Dumb Luck]

Someone on Twitter was asking for some basic crew builds with Mah. I've been really enjoying playing with her recently (yo internet, bottom tier - she ain't) and thought I'd share some of my experiences with building crews with her.

I don't think that she is bottom tier when taking all the Masters into account, but I think she is at the bottom when it comes to Gremlin Masters.

Situations where she is better than Ophelia are pretty rare.

Starting with her starter, I don't think there is anything in there that would be considered an auto take. A lot of the Gremlin community have long documented lack of interest in the Bushwhackers, My defence of them is a topic for another time. Rest assured, you don't need three. Much of the same can be said for the Little Lass. She isn't bad but I don't understand what she does. I know she hits things and passes free upgrades onto Mah when she dies, but I don't understand why you'd want this model to be your choice for cheap beats. And a model turning up just to get a groovy benefit upon death is rarely something I've been keen on (also read: any tactics from V1 for Som'er that build their entire basis around 'Survival of the Fittest').

She can use the Upgrade while she has (except for Out for Blood since she can't reach the suits). Also note that Mah has an ability which Sacs a friendly model so unless you feel like you should never use that ability, she is something of a prime target. You can give Lil Lass Know the Terrain and then when Mah has gotten stuck in sac Lass in order to give Mah that Upgrade and positive twists to Ml. Lass is the cheapest Do It Right! target in the Faction if you consider that you get to keep the Upgrade.

Trixie is solid. Her Ml combos nicely with Mah's tricks, as does her Lure. Mainly though, you'll want her for 'Ill Omens'. She is less essential in this crew than she is in Brewmaster. Brewmaster dies on his feet if he doesn't get the activation. Mah can live and the buffs from 'Chores' aren't that great.

As any of my locals will attest, my 'core' crew (I don't believe there is much call for that in the game really) for Mah contains the same stuff I put in other lists. Beaters like Burt, Fran and Mancha can get a respectable Ml value with Mah and free pushes. If she has a 'standard' trooper minion, that'd have to be the Roosters (Ml7, again). Even basic Bayous can reach a respectable Ml with Mah around. 

Heh, first you say that her buffs from Ill Omens aren't all that (and I tend to agree) but then you use one of them as a standard thing. But I tend to agree that they aren't all that. How often do you really end up getting that +1 Ml? Because Gremlins tend to like high Rams, it seems like cheating it in isn't the best of ideas.

Really though, she is a solo piece. Take whatever works well for the mission, then put Mah in. Considering how flexible a lot of our choices are, this is something that most of our Masters can do. Build the crew, slot the Master in after.

Like alluded to above, I'm having a difficult time coming up with a scenario where she is a better choice than any of the other Gremlin Masters.

And again, that's not to say that she can't be competitive or fun (she is super fun!) but just that if going for optimal she doesn't seem to fit the bill.

Getting into a tiering discussion would be a waste of time (if anything, I think the game has a top curve of some Masters and then everyone else, rather than a series of levels) but all the time, people are ragging on her. But people say the same about Toni and Mei. Over the Summer, I have gained a healthy respect for both. Ah ha! The whole Ophelia/Mah comparison. Ophelia may do more raw damage in a hit but Mah has a place on level with Ophelia. Her buffs are certainly more flexible than Ophelia. There are several ways to counter shooting in the game (cover, Tara/Mei abilities), so Mah can have the edge in match ups there. And Ophelia only ever tops out her offensive stat at a six. This can be not good enough against some higher Df models, which Mah can reliably hit more often.

On the Lass, I get how she plays. I'm just not impressed. I'm not sure if I'd find the points for her. Anyway, she's painted now!

Heh. Not at all. It's a nice buff, but I never said it was something to lean on. Just a pleasant buff. The Lucky Emissary can make the Ml buff more of a thing, so perhaps there is a route to making it a Mah mainstay. Typically, I'll get it once a game.

Having played every single one of them other than Ulix, I could provide you a highly delighted breakdown of when each one is viable. Generally though, I'm liking Mah for Headhunter with a killy, non interact heavy scheme pool.

[Math Mathonwy]

 

Getting into a tiering discussion would be a waste of time (if anything, I think the game has a top curve of some Masters and then everyone else, rather than a series of levels) but all the time, people are ragging on her. But people say the same about Toni and Mei. Over the Summer, I have gained a healthy respect for both.

I think that it would be exceedingly weird if the game was that completely balanced. I'm completely convinced that, e.g., McMourning is better than Lucius though he isn't tier one of Perdita, Sonnia, and McCabe. And you can and should have respect towards low-tier Masters since the tiers are shallow. But since I think that Gremlins don't have any Guild Luciuses, this conversation is a bit of tangent so I'm perfectly willing to drop it.

Ah ha! The whole Ophelia/Mah comparison. Ophelia may do more raw damage in a hit but Mah has a place on level with Ophelia. Her buffs are certainly more flexible than Ophelia. There are several ways to counter shooting in the game (cover, Tara/Mei abilities), so Mah can have the edge in match ups there. And Ophelia only ever tops out her offensive stat at a six. This can be not good enough against some higher Df models, which Mah can reliably hit more often.

Tara only shields herself and Ophelia can overcome Mei's Vapor rather easily so I'm not sure that those are good examples.

On the Lass, I get how she plays. I'm just not impressed. I'm not sure if I'd find the points for her. Anyway, she's painted now!

Heh. Not at all. It's a nice buff, but I never said it was something to lean on. Just a pleasant buff. The Lucky Emissary can make the Ml buff more of a thing, so perhaps there is a route to making it a Mah mainstay. Typically, I'll get it once a game.

I agree, once a game is probably a good estimate. But it seems that in all Mah conversations I see mostly "Ml 7 Roosters". I mean, "Ml 6 " Roosters would be less luck-dependent to get and basically better. A use for Lil Lass

Having played every single one of them other than Ulix, I could provide you a highly delighted breakdown of when each one is viable.

I would be very interested in such a breakdown!

Generally though, I'm liking Mah for Headhunter with a killy, non interact heavy scheme pool.

If it was interact-heavy Scheme pool, you could just take Fingers. He is pretty boss in Headhunter.

But Headhunter is a good point - melee and Pushes is a very good combo there.

[CannibalBob]

I don't mind if Mah is not as good at obliterating things as Ophelia as long as she and her crew offer a different playstyle and are not downright terrible.  I don't have any experience with using her on the table yet, but just reading her abilities and theory-crafting she does seem to have a pretty unique playstyle for Gremlins.  

The Gremlin masters are all generally either based around some form of ranged combat or crew support.  Even the Gremlins that can play closer to the front line and that can be respectable in melee when needed, such as Ulix (with the right upgrades), tend to not want to spend much time there.  Mah is quite different in this regard as she really wants to be charging into combat and beating people with that giant spoon.  I am not going to say that she is better than the other masters, but I think as an opponent you have to respect what she and her crew can do and as a gremlin player I appreciate that she brings a unique experience to the faction.

[Math Mathonwy]

Oh, I agree fully! I'm super excited about her. And she certainly isn't terrible.

[Tiny]

Someone on Twitter was asking for some basic crew builds with Mah. I've been really enjoying playing with her recently (yo internet, bottom tier - she ain't) and thought I'd share some of my experiences with building crews with her.

 

That was me thanks for this post!!

[Dumb Luck]

Someone on Twitter was asking for some basic crew builds with Mah. I've been really enjoying playing with her recently (yo internet, bottom tier - she ain't) and thought I'd share some of my experiences with building crews with her.

 

 

That was me thanks for this post!!

Glad to help.

Oh, I agree fully! I'm super excited about her. And she certainly isn't terrible.

She also has the bonus of annoying haters because Ml8 kitchenware. Will get that breakdown to you too.

[warham]

I just got my Mah together and am excited to try her out.