metal gamin

[bertmac]

So looking at adding some metal gamin to my armoury they look fun although quite slow and not particularly hitty. How do people generally use them? Magnetism looks like a good way of damaging enemy constructs at range whilst speeding up the gamin but do people suggest using it with friendly constructs? Protection of metal is a strong point but with their general slow movement how easy is it to get onto your more combat orientated troops?

[Fenton Crack]

They are definitely pretty slow, but then again many Arcanist have the same lowly Wk 4.  They are very durable and work great for Protect territory and are not too bad for middle line defense when taking LITS or or center-line strats and schemes.  They may take a while to get there, but with Armor +2, Hard to Kill, and a cardless Defensive Stance from Stand Ground, they are hard to pry loose once they get there.

 

I like them with Mei Feng as Railwalker nodes (turn 1 you can RW off them if they activate first, and in the following turns RW back into center field if your Jackhammer kick combos have taken you too deep for your current strats and schemes.  The fact they hand out Burning is a bonus for her.

 

I like them even more with Ramos.  Ramos' sad Df 4 gets buffed to a Df 6 with Protection of Metal, and if Ramos is doing the spider factory and not magging across the board, the Metal gamin have no trouble keeping up with him.  As Ramos summons multiple spiders low on wounds, the Metal Gamin can get some free movement by magging off a weak one summoned as an outlier, and create a scrap counter to set up Ramos' summoning yet again next turn, all for zero AP.

[Malicte]

As far as our local meta is concerned at least, they're the go to 4 point hire in Arcanists unless you have something specific in mind.  Obviously Raspy likes Ice Gamin more, but other than that, Metal Gamin are very very solid units, can Magnetism snipe enemies if they have any constructs (and a lot of factions do), and because of their stat line and Hard to Kill, can Magnetism each other without a significant decrease in durability.  They're probabyl going to drop in 2-3 hits anyways, Magnetism just makes it very likely that it's 2.  This makes them deceptively fast.  Protection of Metal is just a bonus, in my book.

[mythicFOX]

They're very useful generally. Protection is something of a side show, although they can protect themselves which makes their attack much better, even at Ml 4.

 

Their true power is they're AP inefficient for your opponent to get rid of. Most models in the game will need to put three or four attacks into a Metal Gamin in to take it off the table.  Putting 3AP into killing a 4ss model is a poor investment.  This forces an opponent to either waste resources or ignore the Gamin.

[dgraz]

They're very useful generally. Protection is something of a side show, although they can protect themselves which makes their attack much better, even at Ml 4.

I thought it had to be a different Metal Gamin......so you take 2 that 'Protect' each other, but then the buff never goes away.....I could be mistaken. And I don't know if I'd call it a "sideshow"....there aren't many 4ss minions with Armor, HTK and Df 6.

 

But I totally agree with your second point about their true power.

 

As far as their slowness goes, if the enemy has any Constructs they can get quite a bit faster.....Magnetism is very difficult to resist and that gives them extra movement.

[hippodruid]

Protection of Metal only states that the model has to be within 3" of a Metal Gamin, not another Metal Gamin (which would be weird if the model with the condition was not a Metal Gamin).

 

It always feels a little cheesy to me, even when I'm the one taking the action.

[Archmage]

I honestly think that metal gamin, not fire gamin, are Kaeris's go-to objective runners slash 4ss cheap bodies. As MythicFox and Malicte noted, they are deceptively fast and inefficient to remove. If you have any healing whatsoever they are even better--Johan can heal them (they are M&SU!) and so can Kaeris and Ramos with the right upgrades or Bleeding Edge Tech.

[The Godlyness]

Don't forget the mech rider can shit them out. So makes Arcanist much more fun. 2 ap to kill this gamin that is now going to do objectives. Waste your ap cause next turn there Wil be more. All the gamin.

[bertmac]

Ok I'm convinced proxied a couple of ice gamin as metal gamin and they worked out very nicely

[MasterDisaster]

I've been using one with Hoffman.... all I can say is HELL YEAH!!! Power Looping in Ca 8 from Magnetism is boss! Then gaining +2 Ca from his Empower Aura puts him at Ca 10!! That's huge! His spells are usually cast on a 2+ or 4+, some will be cast on a Black Joker. For a 5ss investment (Metal Gamin + Upgrade) the 10% of your resources allocated to this definitely makes his crew work a LOT better! It's become an auto-include for me. 

[Steampunk Jim]

I'm still super new to 2E, but from my limited experience, the Metal Gamin feel like just about the best 4 stones you can spend.

[MasterDisaster]

I'm still super new to 2E, but from my limited experience, the Metal Gamin feel like just about the best 4 stones you can spend.

 

The more I've been playing with them the more I agree with this statement. Wastrels are pretty epic for their cost but Metal Gamin are probably one of the best 4ss models around. 

[Kadeton]

This edition favours 4ss as the "sweet spot" for power vs cost right across the board, in my opinion. Most 4ss minions give incredible value, and Metal Gamin are right up there among the best of a good bunch.

 

It was a funny thing that kept coming up in the beta, where people would say "Such-and-such a model is way too powerful for 4ss!" seemingly without realising that 4ss minions are basically all incredible now.

[Adran]

Just to counter point, I have tried Metal gamin plenty of times, and almost never pick them now. I have better luck with Molemen or Spiders most of the time.

In my experience I can't rely on someone else having a construct to magnetise, so they are slow. I almost never keep a big beatstick in the narrow area that would allow it to keep Protection of metal.

 

Useful for Turf war, but I can't really get their value in anything else.

I think it must be my style, its probbably more hit and run than a lot of people, so I get less use from them.

 

Tahts part of the beauty of the game, what seems to be rubbish for someone is amazing at another time.

[Steampunk Jim]

Again, my experience is limited, but even with very limited use of magnetize and only using protection of metal on other metal gamin, they've been incredible. Such a tough little model to remove, and they really do hit decently hard with the burning +2.

[Malicte]

Just to counter point, I have tried Metal gamin plenty of times, and almost never pick them now. I have better luck with Molemen or Spiders most of the time.

In my experience I can't rely on someone else having a construct to magnetise, so they are slow. I almost never keep a big beatstick in the narrow area that would allow it to keep Protection of metal.

 

Useful for Turf war, but I can't really get their value in anything else.

I think it must be my style, its probbably more hit and run than a lot of people, so I get less use from them.

 

Tahts part of the beauty of the game, what seems to be rubbish for someone is amazing at another time.

 

I definitely see how you could get more out of a Moleman, but how are you getting more use out of a spider?  I tend to be disappointed in spiders.

[Fenton Crack]

I definitely see how you could get more out of a Moleman, but how are you getting more use out of a spider?  I tend to be disappointed in spiders.

 

I think spiders are very solid.  Their Df 6 and comparatively fast walk make them effective objective grabbers in my games for their price.

 

The fact they can combine into a full wound Swarm is great as well, but not much use out of a Ramos led crew IMHO, as I cannot see taking three spiders I have to pay for with another master, and if I did, they wold likely be out doing their own thing and not close enough to Swarm.

[Malicte]

I agree that spiders are solid enough, I just wonder when (excepting when I want to blow them up or lower some defense) why I'd necessarily want one over a metal gamin in a generic 4 stone slot.  Maybe with that higher df if I knew I'd be facing some attackers that ignore armor and/or h2k?

 

I agree on the swarm though, I'm not sure you'd ever swarm one from three separate spiders outside a Ramos crew.  Too expensive and situational.  In a Ramos crew you're probably doing it immediately post-summon so it's less of an issue.

[dgraz]

 Maybe with that higher df if I knew I'd be facing some attackers that ignore armor and/or h2k?

 

Even that's a non-issue since the Gamin can 'Protect' themselves....giving them Df 6.

[Steampunk Jim]

And not having to discard to go defensive. They were SO hard to kill in the game I played last night. They just chilled at the edge of the turf war marker and did their thing.

[Adran]

It must be the way I play them.

I can find a space for a Df 6 Wk 5 model that lowers the Df of enemy models. I don't find a space in my crews for the wk 4 model with hard to kill and the ability to makes a model Df 6.

I personally find the spiders pro active and something the enemy actually needs to deal with to stop me earning VPs. I've not had the Metal Gamin cause the same problems. They don't die, and  can sit in an area not dying. But unless I'm playing Turf war, thats not helping me win.

I almost never get a master to survive a game, but am currently on a good win ratio in M2E (Last 2 tournements lost to the overall winner in the final). Survival isn't what I go for it seems.

 

I'm going to stick with my general advice to all models. Proxy them for a few games to see how they go. I don't believe there is a bad model to own, if you use it properly, but not all models will suit all playstyles.

[dgraz]

 

 wk 4 model with hard to kill and the ability to makes a model Df 6.

Again, they can make themselves Df 6.....with HtK and Armor +2.........I can literally one-shot spiders with 'Dita (as only one example).......I can't do that to a Gamin. They force people to waste AP to remove them.

 

I do agree that not all models suit all styles.......there are plenty of models I can't wrap my mind around and don't use, but other people do and like them.

[MasterDisaster]

Again, they can make themselves Df 6.....with HtK and Armor +2.........I can literally one-shot spiders with 'Dita (as only one example).......I can't do that to a Gamin. They force people to waste AP to remove them.

 

Amen Bruthah! This is the exact reason I take Metal Gamin with Hoffman. Not only is it a valuable source of Ca 8 for the Power Loop but it is also a source of Df 6 should my Guardian be taken out. On top of this it's a constant source of Armour +2 (or even +3 if you mod him) for Hoffman's Protection Trigger. It can also keep up with him fairly easily by using Magnetism at the scant cost of 2 health which Hoffman can very easily recover. It will take at least two or maybe even three shots to down the Gamin meaning Hoffman may have a chance to heal it back up which further bolsters his own defenses. They a stellar models. I have yet to use them with Kaeris (my only Arcanist Master) but my experience with them playing with Hoffman and against them with Mei Feng they can be a real pain for the people having to deal with them. 

 

All this and all you pay is 1ss for Arcanist Assets which gives Hoffman the ability to hire Metal Gamin as well as a really good (0) action and then 4ss for the Gamin itself. That's 10% of your total SS allowance for incredible bonuses with very few if any downsides. I doubt I'll play Hoffman without a Metal Gamin ever again, they are just too good for him and his crew. 

[Godgolden]

Gamin wont give def 6, its printed def, so def 5, same as his totem.

 

I have tried to fit one in, with Hoffman and a guardian it is cool but so many points in.. well.. slow models that don'kt do much.

[EntrepeNinja]

Gamin wont give def 6, its printed def, so def 5, same as his totem.

 

I have tried to fit one in, with Hoffman and a guardian it is cool but so many points in.. well.. slow models that don'kt do much.

Beat me to it. Yeah, it specifies "Printed". Which means a Steam Arachnid could bring DF6 super cheap.

 

The CA8 is good, but it's not super necessary, and really you only need/want it for a couple key turns- when you're trying to do a bunch of upgrades (lower books allow recasts), or if you've got a big turn you need to cast a lot of machine puppets (Better selection of triggers). There is something to being able to cast shake down with a black joker...