Having issues with The Hanged

[Da Git]

Hey guys,

As the title says, I've been having issues with The Hanged, namely Whispers from Beyond. How are you guys dealing with this attack?

It's got no gun icon, so it ignores cover, can shoot into & out of combat. The only way I can see to avoid it is to stay out of LoS or range. Then Kirai or Molly drops one in and even that's no def...

Help please!!

I know these were round 1 models, but if it's possible for an errata I'd eitherlower the Ca to 5 and either make Glimpse the Inevitable a :crows :crows trigger or have the TN: 13 :crows :crows. That way he can't just waltz in and destroy most masters with a 13 (there is no model who can rst if he cheats the red!)... Am I alone in feeling this attack is OP? How do you deal with it?

Edit: Actually I think it should be brought into line with the current Leveticus's Unnatural Wasting with a damage track of 2/0/2 with moderate and severe doing half wds additionally and Glimpse the Inevitable a double trigger. This would bring it in line with a regular attack and stop it screwing over an unwounded model at the cost of a single high card.

Edited November 24, 2013 by Da O&F Git

[Drix]

They're 9 stone models to hire, that's the same or more as most henchman. that means At 9 stones, summoning means burning a King. Most Masters have above average or higher WP, and even then if you know the Hanged will be a threat then you should hold onto that high card for defense until it's activated. How much LoS blocking terrain are you using? What crews are you using/ fighting against?

[zFiend]

I have used the Hanged quite a few times and had them used against me. There is nothing OP about them. They are strong, but you pay a high cost for them, they can be taken down, they can be avoided and they can be endured.

None of my games that involved the Hanged were they game breaking at all.

[Arli]

I agree with zFiend and Drix. I have played them and played against them. They are not broken. As you were saying about the red joker, that is a red joker that is not used against you for damage or something else.

[Mason]

The Hanged are pretty good models, but Whispers from Beyond and their Unrelenting Terror are really their only two good tricks. They force you to play around them a bit, but 9ss models should do that.

Bringing a model to remove conditions helps, or playing a bit more defensively with your models and hiding from line of sight until the Hanged is exposed to more of your crew help.

[Kadeton]

I'm not at all surprised that people have problems with the Hanged. It's all well and good to say "Whispers from Beyond and their Unrelenting Terror are really their only two good tricks," but those are some damn good tricks.

I find the Hanged are quite all-or-nothing in their effect. In a terror-based crew they are the lynchpin - if your opponent can take them out, your gimmick will likely fall apart and you'll lose; if they can't deal with the Hanged effectively, everything they can get their hands on (and they have a huge area of influence) will be dead or paralysed forever.

The things I've found the Hanged really don't like are models that are immune to Paralysed, models with Ca attacks or other non Ml/Sh damage, models who don't target directly, and models with Armor. Rasputina and her crew crush them effortlessly, but just about any crew should be able to muster some of the above.

The Masters they're particularly bad for are those who don't have any of the above advantages, who rely on healing, and who have poor Willpower. There really aren't that many of those - in most cases, the Hanged are better off weakening Henchmen and Enforcers rather than burning their AP trying to Whisper at Masters.

[Mason]

I'm not at all surprised that people have problems with the Hanged. It's all well and good to say "Whispers from Beyond and their Unrelenting Terror are really their only two good tricks," but those are some damn good tricks.

I can absolutely understand that.

My regular opponent is fond of using one with Seamus, so more often than not, my best model ends up being lured forward and hit with the Hanged on turn 1. The first few times it happened it was really devastating, but once you start expecting it, it's not as bad.

They're still very good models.

[Da Git]

Maybe I'm not using enough LoS blocking terrain, but it still feels a little off with Whispers ignoring so many attack mechanics... & whilst a 13 or Red is a high card (can be even lower if opponent has to cheat first or has a Wp of 5 or less {eg, }), to do up to 7 damage & prevent healing just by tying is a little harsh I think. Even if you can't heal anyways, the biggest thing I find is all it needs to do is tie with Ca6. It needs a damage track.

Not all factions include models that can remove Conditions... Rezzers for one... Imagine resser/ressers match where McMourning or Bete (both Wp5) copped it & the ones that do have it, often can't heal.

[Drool_bucket]

Not all factions include models that can remove Conditions... Rezzers for one... Imagine resser/ressers match where McMourning or Bete (both Wp5) copped it & the ones that do have it, often can't heal.

Well, they do... Johan and McTavish both remove conditions (one of the card, the other off and upgrade) so if you are crazy worried about Conditions, take one of them, they're both Mercs.

But, as others have said, for 9 SS, they better do something awesome.

[Cornelious1424]

They do pretty much the exact same thing they did last edition, no one cried broken then. Actually, Whispers was better in 1.5 because most models had no way of removing debuffs and you couldnt reduce the damage with armor. The change to soul stones is really what makes them a threat, I feel. Most Masters are around Wp6, which means if you throw down a 13 to cast Whispers against an enemy master, you have a pretty decent shot considering all you need to do is tie. Masters can no longer reach astronomical totals so they are just as vulnerable as every one else these days, thus making the Hanged well worth their points!! They are a solid 9ss model, but they do not need a change.

[Csonti]

Maybe it is not clear to anyone that the may not be healed condition does NOT prohibit damage prevention by using SS. So Whispers from Beyond is a tough cookie but one successful cast won't send a Master to the dressing room at the next hit he takes.

[Da Git]

Most Masters are around Wp6, which means if you throw down a 13 to cast Whispers against an enemy master, you have a pretty decent shot considering all you need to do is tie. Masters can no longer reach astronomical totals so they are just as vulnerable as every one else these days, thus making the Hanged well worth their points!! They are a solid 9ss model, but they do not need a change.

I think this one is the key... For 9ss, I agree that they should be good, I'm just continually having my master neutered!! Which I think is a bit harsh

Edited November 26, 2013 by Da O&F Git

[Fireuser]

I run these guys a lot, and I also tend to master hunt with them. The best defense is really something to get rid of the condition. Condition removal would benefit a crew regardless of who the opponent is. Though some factions have a harder time finding this.