Thoughts on these neveborn models?

[TimH]

As far as I can tell there is set opinion of many neverborn models. Liletu pair is strong, sorrrows are good for Pandora, Bad Juju is alright but not brilliant etc. but there seems to be a small group of models I never see being included or talked about and was wondering whether these models are just bad or that people just prefer spending their SS elsewhere. So good people of the wyrd forums I ask you, what do you think of the following models, are there lists they work in and why don't you see them used that often,

Poltergeist-The only totem I don't really see talked about. Lilith I see people argue for both Primordial and the cherub, daydreams and the vodoo doll can both be summoned but I never see people mention this guy. Any reason why?

Iggy-Unique models are always pretty cool but whilst I see people often placing WW in Zoraida o Collodi lists, Tuco in anything and arguing about Nekima being nice but overcosted I see nothing ever about Iggy.

Mysterious Effigy-Of the effigies the neverborns own one seems to be rarely mentioned. Carrion, Brutal and Arcane are all popular whilst Hodgepodge is generally regarded as poor but I don't really hear anything about this guy (he dies look cool though visually).

Spawn mother/Gupps- Does it fit anywhere? It lacks any major tags like nightmare, nephillim or woe. Are they good for anything or not?

Waldgeist- Okay on this one at least I think I know why it's never talked about. It's just so situational. But still, does anyone use it/have strong views on it?

Hooded rider-Same as the spawn mother I guess (lakes any major tags) but hey, thoughts people?

Killjoy- Okay so he is technically an outcast but I'm surprised I don't see more mentioned about him in neverborn lists. It feels like the neverborn have all sorts of potential ways of getting killjoy into the action (Dreamer shenanigans, malifaux raptors, terror tots, collodi dolls) is he really just to expensive to be viable?

[D_acolyte]

As far as I can tell there is set opinion of many neverborn models. Liletu pair is strong, sorrrows are good for Pandora, Bad Juju is alright but not brilliant etc. but there seems to be a small group of models I never see being included or talked about and was wondering whether these models are just bad or that people just prefer spending their SS elsewhere. So good people of the wyrd forums I ask you, what do you think of the following models, are there lists they work in and why don't you see them used that often,

Poltergeist-The only totem I don't really see talked about. Lilith I see people argue for both Primordial and the cherub, daydreams and the vodoo doll can both be summoned but I never see people mention this guy. Any reason why?

Iggy-Unique models are always pretty cool but whilst I see people often placing WW in Zoraida o Collodi lists, Tuco in anything and arguing about Nekima being nice but overcosted I see nothing ever about Iggy.

Mysterious Effigy-Of the effigies the neverborns own one seems to be rarely mentioned. Carrion, Brutal and Arcane are all popular whilst Hodgepodge is generally regarded as poor but I don't really hear anything about this guy (he dies look cool though visually).

Spawn mother/Gupps- Does it fit anywhere? It lacks any major tags like nightmare, nephillim or woe. Are they good for anything or not?

Waldgeist- Okay on this one at least I think I know why it's never talked about. It's just so situational. But still, does anyone use it/have strong views on it?

Hooded rider-Same as the spawn mother I guess (lakes any major tags) but hey, thoughts people?

Killjoy- Okay so he is technically an outcast but I'm surprised I don't see more mentioned about him in neverborn lists. It feels like the neverborn have all sorts of potential ways of getting killjoy into the action (Dreamer shenanigans, malifaux raptors, terror tots, collodi dolls) is he really just to expensive to be viable?

As for Iggy and the Mysterious Effigy I love them and need to get them.

I love my waldgeist, nice speed and armor two for 6 points. I also like to surf it when I have a good forest, I have seen some people surf it with Lilith. It trigger is ok. If I have 6 points and i do not know what I want to use the waldgeist is always an option.

I at one point thought about useing the mother and guppies with Zeroda but they are set a little out of my price range per a model.

Hooded rider seems ok but no master really loves him, Dreamer runs nightmares, and Pandora cause him to loose ITI. I think some outcast player have a better uderstanding of the hooded rider then I do.

[notmikehill]

Poltergeist-The only totem I don't really see talked about. Lilith I see people argue for both Primordial and the cherub, daydreams and the vodoo doll can both be summoned but I never see people mention this guy. Any reason why?

It was mentioned earlier that someone used persistant distraction on their entire crew so that the enemy crew had to activate everything first. I think that's an interesting trick and almost more than enough reason to merit using him as a totem!

Iggy-Unique models are always pretty cool but whilst I see people often placing WW in Zoraida o Collodi lists, Tuco in anything and arguing about Nekima being nice but overcosted I see nothing ever about Iggy.

The Gamer's Lounge guys were talking about him in the book 3 wrap up podcast. Being able to move him on an incite action is a really good tool. You can put him in position in a turn, or charge a model. Flurry the target his next activation, incite to get out of combat or to reposition him, then use his ranged expert AP to make another shot. He's quite useful, and argueably one of the better Woe kids.

Mysterious Effigy-Of the effigies the neverborns own one seems to be rarely mentioned. Carrion, Brutal and Arcane are all popular whilst Hodgepodge is generally regarded as poor but I don't really hear anything about this guy (he dies look cool though visually).

That effigy is a bullet. It's great when you have cards in your hand to manage to get off a good charge on a model that's out of position. After damaging the model you push X inches depending on the damage you dealt. He also has a great defense buff which can stack with the Arcane Effigy's magic resist buff, making it harder for your puppets to be the targets of blasts. I'm on a worldwide campaign to prove that the Hodgepodge effigy is better than what people think but I won't divulge on that here!

Spawn mother/Gupps- Does it fit anywhere? It lacks any major tags like nightmare, nephillim or woe. Are they good for anything or not?

No real play time with that model(s)

Waldgeist- Okay on this one at least I think I know why it's never talked about. It's just so situational. But still, does anyone use it/have strong views on it?

A big meh to me. Once I wrap my head around the Alilith lists I'll put more use to them. Someone else probably has better input there than I would.

Hooded rider-Same as the spawn mother I guess (lakes any major tags) but hey, thoughts people?

I love this model. He can safely move up the board. He can push out of combat, make devastating strikes, create great flanks, the list goes on. I almost always take him in a list that requires an objective.

---------- Post added at 03:24 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:20 PM ----------

Hooded rider seems ok but no master really loves him, Dreamer runs nightmares, and Pandora cause him to loose ITI. I think some outcast player have a better uderstanding of the hooded rider then I do.

I have to make a counter point to that statement. You're correct in saying it loses some benefits while being in a list with Pandora. With the Dreamer you get an 8 stone model that has reistance to ranged strikes and spells on turn one. If it engages you can switch it to give models it attacks slow with a hard to wound 1 on top of it's regen 1. Then, you can flip it's effects another turn and give him a critical strike on masks you draw while attacking. Add that to the fact that you can push him 9 inches on a mounted combat strike to get him out of trouble or into a position. He may seem lackluster to some other riders but I do think that he serves a very useful purpose as a flank model in any neverborn list.

Edited August 21, 2012 by notmikehill
i r spelling gewd

[Boshea]

Iggy-Unique models are always pretty cool but whilst I see people often placing WW in Zoraida o Collodi lists, Tuco in anything and arguing about Nekima being nice but overcosted I see nothing ever about Iggy.

Imo, I like him better as an arcanist minion than a neverborn minion.

[Kuro]

I recently played my first game with the Spawn Mother fish list. I'm still not sure if it's good or not, but I did enjoy playing it. It's very fluffy and thematic for Zoraida!

To give a more in-depth review of Spawn Mother, I have to say that she's tricky and does work well if you're running Silurids. Silurids did their hit-n-run thing, while the Spawn Mother pushed up the board behind her gupps. Between all the casualties, there were about 6 corpse counters in the bottle neck I was trying to defend, and my heavily wounded Spawn Mother was able to make a spawning pool and immediately hatch 2 more gupps at the end of that turn. The next turn she retreated and the gupps managed to deny an Ice Golem and then harangued Rasputina while I completed my objective. The spawn pool turned a pretty even game into a solid win for me with the 2 free gupps.

While the spawn mother can be tough in melee, she's not so tough that you want to send her straight into the fray. You want to use your gupps in front of her to soften up a minion or two, then let her charge in when the gupps get killed to finish the job. Then you can make a spawning pool and get your gupps back.

The models are fun to paint, a bear to assemble, and a bit rough on your pocketbook. I'm really glad I have them though.

[M_Ruckuss]

The hooded rider is great with an of the masters= he has a good damage arc and useful abilities.

The Hodgepodge can actually be a rather useful model to use. His card manipulation abilities arefun if not game changing when used with Zoraida and a:zoraida and his ability to ignore things like hard to wound and armor are also very useful. The arcane effigy is proving more useful to me at the moment but I really liked taking him when I played Hoffman- he formed a great tagteam with the brutal effigy.

[bigbopper]

Waldgiests are one of the few tank units that neverborn have. great with forests, being able to move terrain in game is fun and a big advantage. being able to strike through said terrain and potentialy trapping them there provides you with some great area control. armour +2 means they can take some punishment. try them with woods and you will find them handy.

[ForceVoid]

I am a huge advocate for the Poltergeist in any Pandora list. The sheer amount of WP duels it forces with Tantrum x2 is quite the boon for only 2 SS.

[Sybaris]

Waldgiests are one of the few tank units that neverborn have. great with forests, being able to move terrain in game is fun and a big advantage. being able to strike through said terrain and potentialy trapping them there provides you with some great area control. armour +2 means they can take some punishment. try them with woods and you will find them handy.

I agree. It is quite tough compared to many of our models, and can strike well too with Cb 6 and very decent moderate damage. Even if there are no woods, Lilith can create one and the Waldgeist will play hockey with it. With its camouflage, alot of enemy models will get :-fate to target them. It's been part of my regular crew for a bit of time.

Edited August 22, 2012 by Sybaris

[bigbopper]

I have only used Killjoy once with zorida and collodi. Turn two I got a wicked doll to teleport to collodi did a move action and then sacrificed to bring killjoy out into the middle of my opponents crew. He was good with zorida as she was able to get a few obeys off before he died. he killed three witchling stalkers, withchling handler, and S hoPkins before dying. Lots of fun. Just make sure you have a card to discard before activating, and keep him closer to the enemy's models than your models. Obey really helps here.

[Loxley]

I love my hooded rider! Bought him in April and have used him in about 70% of my games since.

Being able to run up board without being targeted is great! Virtually every time my opponent has fixated in him as an immediate threat. Playing with the Dreamer is also great, take him down 1 flank and he acts as a great distraction.

In fact in many games I've used him for this alone. Yes he's about 1/3 of the crew's points, but his distraction/sacrifice takes the attention away from the still buried 2/3rds moving down the other flank.

[psychocamel]

Not target able by ranged attacks, but don't ranged spells (without the gun icon) still get him?

Or are you more referring to people you've smacked into leaving him alone?

[notmikehill]

Not target able by ranged attacks, but don't ranged spells (without the gun icon) still get him?

Or are you more referring to people you've smacked into leaving him alone?

Night makes the rider untargettable by ranged attacks or spells. Since it's a spell, it falls under his "Can't hit me" clause.

Edited August 22, 2012 by notmikehill

[psychocamel]

Hmm, on the V2 card it just says ranged attacks, doesn't mention spells...

Night: This model receives:

Darkness: This model cannot be targeted by ranged attacks

Midnight Blade: Models hit by Saber Strikes cannot target this model during their next activation.

[011121]

a case of small "a" attack?

[notmikehill]

Hmm, on the V2 card it just says ranged attacks, doesn't mention spells...

Night: This model receives:

Darkness: This model cannot be targeted by ranged attacks

Midnight Blade: Models hit by Saber Strikes cannot target this model during their next activation.

ahhh my Mali-fu has failed me, still at the office so I don't have the card in front of me. On the plus side he is Immune to Influence so the only real ranged threats would be spells that target his defense.

[psychocamel]

That's true, he's still a very good model

EDIT: I double checked myself in the IRC and Ratty has corrected me.

A spell is an attack unless it doesn't have a resist or do Dg or Wds.

Page 18 of the rules lists all the different criteria for attacks

So the initial thing was correct and I'm very sorry for the confusion

Edited August 22, 2012 by psychocamel

[notmikehill]

I KNEW I WAS RIGHT ALL ALONG... I mean.... uh yeah

Nah but seriously thank you for the clarification. Being at work sucks, except for getting paid part haha

[M_Ruckuss]

It is a great ability but beware there are models with nasty spells out there. I dont have book 1 anymore but I am sure some of Levi's nasty spells have no range icon but are effective at range if you see what I mean (please correct me if I am wrong on this!)

[psychocamel]

Oh I should also mention it's still just no ranged attacks. Spells with the range icon are ranged attacks, other spells are simply 'attacks' and thus his power doesn't work.

[Neverectionist]

hooded rider is awsome for 8ss, better than the other riders, but as for killjoy, he costs 11 to begin with then another model, i know he is has the neverborn stat but i didnt know he could go with neverborn crews, in that case you could put him with zoraida and sacrifice a wicked doll for free, but tbh, although he is a decent model, not really worth the hassle, and iggy, i asume you just use him with kearis.

[011121]

iggy isn't just for kaeris. He gives neverborn something they sorely lacked before- ranged firepower (no pun intended). He does synergize well with kaeris but can work in other groups, especially pandora/zoraida.