Jump to content

Nekima as a henchman?


Sybaris
 Share

Recommended Posts

Just browsing rules and fluff from the books, it struck me as weird that Nekima isn't able to lead a scrap, at the very least.

Granted Lilith took the main seat when it comes to leading Nephilim, but according to the fluff Nekima is rebuilding a following and well...nobody would argue that she retains some influence (if only through fear of her prowess).

I had the feeling that if Molly can lead a crew, i wonder why Nekima can't.

Trouble i have is that Lilith and Nekima hate each other, and if i want a nephilim master, i am pretty much stuck with Lilith. I like both, but playing both in small games is sort of counter intuitive story-wise?

Or did i just read the fluff wrong :P

Edited by Sybaris
Link to comment
Share on other sites

You are correct.

It is widely speculated that there will be future rules released to upgrade some models to henchmen status. This comes from a rule on the card for the Ronin minion, which states it can never be upgraded to a henchman. It is also believed commonly that these rules will be released in the next book. Nekima is widely thought to be one of these minions that will be able to be upgraded. There are other minions people have suggested will be able to get this upgrade as well. Misaki and Sam Hopkins being the two which stand out the most to me at this time.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A couple players from our local community ran her with just Use Soulstones (not as a Henchman but...) and the general concensus was that it was pretty sick (though some of this might have been due to the pre Nephlim Heart fix). Perhaps the players involved will chime in (or maybe I'll prod them).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A couple players from our local community ran her with just Use Soulstones (not as a Henchman but...) and the general concensus was that it was pretty sick (though some of this might have been due to the pre Nephlim Heart fix). Perhaps the players involved will chime in (or maybe I'll prod them).

Ow! That cattle prod hurts!

Any who, I ran Nekima as a henchman in a 30ss game, gave her a henchman reserve of 5 (i think, I can't remember because it was a while ago), and ran a basic nephilim list. Tots, youngs, and the twins. When all was said and done, my opponent and I both came to the conclusion that Nekima has no problems leading a crew. The only thing I would change about her is lowering her Irresistible to 11 and raising her Df to 5.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ow! That cattle prod hurts!

Any who, I ran Nekima as a henchman in a 30ss game, gave her a henchman reserve of 5 (i think, I can't remember because it was a while ago), and ran a basic nephilim list. Tots, youngs, and the twins. When all was said and done, my opponent and I both came to the conclusion that Nekima has no problems leading a crew. The only thing I would change about her is lowering her Irresistible to 11 and raising her Df to 5.

Well if they made her a henchman as is there is no way she would have a henchman reserve of 5, since she is worth 13ss as is and most masters are valued in missions at 10ss thoguh they are worth more. I don't think she would get a bigger reserve then von schill since as is she is better then him. I think she would serve better at a reservive of 2 or 3. I would like her better as a master with 2ss.

Though being 13ss normaly getting her for free as a leader is scary good it is hard to think of her reserve being that big after that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'd have no problem seeing her as a master either, because in a way she certainly has enough influence to move a brawl's worth of nephilims.

With Lilith's avatar...it seems that she's going more into the nature's revenge aspect. This leaves room for a "true" leader of Nephilims.

Imagine Nekima in avatar form?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

since she is worth 13ss as is and most masters are valued in missions at 10ss thoguh they are worth more. I don't think she would get a bigger reserve then von schill since as is she is better then him. I think she would serve better at a reservive of 2 or 3. I would like her better as a master with 2ss.

Though being 13ss normaly getting her for free as a leader is scary good it is hard to think of her reserve being that big after that.

I seem to recall reading (perhaps during one of the playtest cycles) that Masters were generally supposed to be valued at between 14-16 Soulstones (even though as you point out in strategies/schemes they are only valued at 10).

I definately agree that she would not have a very large Henchman Reserve (though not because I think she is better than VonSchill, I dont). I think she would have a low Reserve because of her ability to grow models very easily (between Nurture Nephilim and Nephilim Heart she can almost guarantee the model change) netting 3SS advantage for a Tot to a Young and 4 for a Young to a Mature.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

From a thematic PoV I would love to see some of the minions become henchmen in the game. The background so far certainly suggests that this might happen (Joss, Misaki, Samael etc), and some in-game character progression is always fun. ;)

Of course on the other hand, I'll be very curious to see HOW they end up doing it. Creating a new henchman based on an existing rule is a tricky balancing act. Basically both the minion and henchmen versions need to fill their own niche, otherwise one will almost always be selected over the other.

Basically then, I guess each henchman needs to feel like a progression from their minion rules and background, but still be different enough to fulfil its own niche in the game.

I guess it's the same design philosophy as with the Avatars. If each Avatar was just a straight upgrade to the original Master then people would always want to take them. And that would lead to all the problems associated with having auto-includes like that in the game.

Damn, I'd love to have a crack at writing up some Henchmen. I wonder how one gets a place on the Alpha testing team? ;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree that could be a similar process to the avatar mechanism.

I just don't know what master to get for Nekima until then, since she's obviously tailored for Nephilim (Tots and Young) grow crews, and only Lilith fits that bill. Going for any other minions seems to remove most incentives to pick Nekima.

Edited by Sybaris
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Zoraida works well with a lot of crews. I just got Nekima for an early Christmas present and have Zoraida on order, that said, I think she's probably a better fit with Zoraida, even in an all Nephilim build. (The idea of Obeying greatsword attacks from Nekima makes me happy). Aside from growing tots her damage profile is nice with Zoraida but not something Lilith doesn't already do (better with Use Soulstone)

Fluff wise it's pretty easy for me to imagine Zoraida as willing and able to manipulate Nekima into rounding up a bunch of Nephilim to help her accomplish something.

Edited by Kabosan
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 5 months later...
I'd have no problem seeing her as a master either, because in a way she certainly has enough influence to move a brawl's worth of nephilims.

With Lilith's avatar...it seems that she's going more into the nature's revenge aspect. This leaves room for a "true" leader of Nephilims.

Imagine Nekima in avatar form?

I imagine her to an almost rewrite like Hamlin's minion to master upgrade

Link to comment
Share on other sites

She works well with Zoraida. The 18 stone "package" of Nekima, Desperate Merc, Terror Tot gives you two expensive Obey-able beaters from turn two onward. She's also useful with Pandora. The -2 willpower to defenders synergises well with Pandora, and she draws some attention away from your master as well.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree that could be a similar process to the avatar mechanism.

I just don't know what master to get for Nekima until then, since she's obviously tailored for Nephilim (Tots and Young) grow crews, and only Lilith fits that bill. Going for any other minions seems to remove most incentives to pick Nekima.

My thought is that she will gain a special forces of young nephilim

her Soul stone cost will go down

New weapon/s

Possible spell that can only be cast once per turn, but forces a tot to grow

Cant be hired by Lilith in scraps?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The good news is that we know the designers are aware of the issue, and that they'll actually do something about it.

As for the rules themselves, i really have no idea what's cooking, but so far i am testing my own set (in a separate thread).

I surely hope they consider giving her a proeminent role in the Special Forces book that is coming, and her background surely puts her as a good candidate for one of the Neverborn's special forces leader, at least as a Henchwoman.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information