Da Big Baws Posted November 2, 2011 Report Share Posted November 2, 2011 (edited) 1. I have read Sybelle is pretty damn good. But I absolutely hate the model (based on the Wyrd/Studio picture). Is there a way to run Seamus without the model or is the model not as AS bad I think (pictures would be helpful)? 2. How good is his avatar? Auto-include? How much do you guys think it changes the way you build Seamus lists? 3. Out of the Box Set, what else would you get for 25SS? Then for 35SS? 4. For a Seamus player, is it better to buy Molly by herself or buy her Boxed set? More questions: 5. How many Rotten Belles should a Seamus player own? 6. How often do you summon Belles with Seamus and/or Molly? 7. Which Totem do you take the most (if you take any at all)? More questions: 8. How well/bad does Seamus handle Construct / Immune to Influence crews? 9. Would running Avatar Seamus at 25SS be a good move or is he better at higher SS games? Edited November 3, 2011 by Da Big Baws Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soundwave Posted November 2, 2011 Report Share Posted November 2, 2011 4. I think you're better off with just Molly. Crooligans doesn't add that much to a Seamus screw that it can't get elsewhere. Usually for less SS. 1. Sybelle's nice but by no means an auto-include. Only time you -need- her is if you want to do some "mini-alpha" belle shenanigans. And that's really not all of the time. 3. A convict gunslinger is always a nice way to expand on the starter set. Personally, I love me some Night terrors. Crooked men can work as well. 2. His avatar is very good, in the sense that it adds a whole new level to Seamus' already pretty extensive toolbox. You -can- build lists around him, but most of the time those 2ss are worth it just in order to have a backup plan, or if a really nice situation arises where aSeamus might be fitting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osoi Posted November 2, 2011 Report Share Posted November 2, 2011 Soundwave has it although I like the Los Blocking and extra movement from Crooligans I also like expanding with The Hanged Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mawdrigen Posted November 2, 2011 Report Share Posted November 2, 2011 CROOKED MEN!!! Seriously, with the Whores being able to drag people around with Lure, dropping Shafted markers and moving people onto them is a good laugh. The Convict Gunslinger is also awesome, but that is because he pretty much fits with everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike3838 Posted November 2, 2011 Report Share Posted November 2, 2011 (edited) Grave Spirit is an almost auto-include for me. If you're looking for a higher pts model, Hanged, Bête Noire or a Shikome all work well in different situations for Seamus. I usually drop Sybelle but for one exception. If you're playing Treasure Hunt or Shared Destroy Evidence. In those circumstances it's essential to get to the center of the board in your first activation of the first turn, and Companion + Call Belle is the only way I think Ressurectionists can do that. Although I'd love to know if someone else knows another way. As for the model: here's mine:http://malifauxnoob.blogspot.com/2011/04/014-madame-sybelle-mistress-of-pain.html Mike Edited November 2, 2011 by Mike3838 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike3838 Posted November 2, 2011 Report Share Posted November 2, 2011 (edited) - Edited November 2, 2011 by Mike3838 Accidental double post - damn phone! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JuJubee Posted November 2, 2011 Report Share Posted November 2, 2011 I haven't been using Sybelle in the last several Seamus games I have had. I like the Crooked men for their shafted markers and Belles. The Hanged are nice and work well. Night Terrors and Seamus are almost always a must. I take the Avatar in fun games but not in competitive play but that's more of a personal preference. I've only played a couple of games with Molly so far so I can't give any educated evaluations of her... yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rancor709 Posted November 2, 2011 Report Share Posted November 2, 2011 I tend to include sybelle when I want a multi-tool for seamus and don't really have the points for something harder. Sybelle has some nice tricks, and is incredible in treasure hunt/destroy evidence. I like her when facing spirits as her magic shrike attack is very good and has a range of 12. Now more often than not sybelle takes a sit for convict gunslinger, or the raw consistant damage of the a punk zombie and an extra stone. She does have a place in certain setups but she's not a consistant winner and not an auto include. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Da Big Baws Posted November 2, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 2, 2011 More questions: 5. How many Rotten Belles should a Seamus player own? 6. How often do you summon Belles with Seamus and/or Molly? 7. Which Totem do you take the most (if you take any at all)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rancor709 Posted November 2, 2011 Report Share Posted November 2, 2011 For me two belles and Sybelle are the max belles but more typically 2 will be what you field and maybe during the match you'll summon a 3. The most i ever got summoned was 2 for a total of 4 on the table. So typically 1 pack would do you. I tried copy cat and never got him to work he always disappointed me. Grave Spirit is the superior choice because giving armor 2 to your undead tank is better than maybe hitting something with a giant gun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osoi Posted November 2, 2011 Report Share Posted November 2, 2011 I would recommend owning 3 Rotten Belles, I start most games with 1-2. I only summon when its advantageous to do so, Seamus often has better uses of a high :crows and (0) action. I generally prefer the Grave Spirit depending on who I am facing (ie Ramos, Rasputina or Sonnia), sometimes no totem at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorian Posted November 2, 2011 Report Share Posted November 2, 2011 I play seamus quite a bit allow me to add my input: 1. I have read Sybelle is pretty damn good. But I absolutely hate the model (based on the Wyrd/Studio picture). Is there a way to run Seamus without the model or is the model not as AS bad I think (pictures would be helpful)? I hate her. Honestly the model and what it does.Her stat line looks great & she can provide some nice utility but in the end at 6 SS if I want more damage I just take a punk zombie. If I want something more durable there aren't many options as efficient but ressies don't really have a durability problem. Also do not fall into the trap of seamus MUST take belles. I run him 90% of the time with a dead rider & grave spirit. (Armor 2, HtW 2, Regen 1 & his adjust purpose). This way it is incredibly fast, Very durable, and downright beatface. The only downside being the cost, well worth it Vs anyone but collet imo. 2. How good is his avatar? Auto-include? How much do you guys think it changes the way you build Seamus lists? His avatar is ok. Takes away a lot of his utility & quirks but turns him into a melee monster. Personally I would rarely if ever take it because I love dead rider who fills that same role. 3. Out of the Box Set, what else would you get for 25SS? Then for 35SS? Punk zombies, canine remains. I can't say enough good about canine remains, they are fast, cheap objective grabbers who can debuff the enemy & bring you corpse counters. As for the punks, I run 2 teams of 2 (Before dead rider) Belle lures enemy models then the punk charges from behind the belle. It's a nasty combo. 4. For a Seamus player, is it better to buy Molly by herself or buy her Boxed set? Box set, no doubt. Crooligans are wonderful for things like destroy evidence & a line in the sand. Also, mobile cover with the mist. Rogue necromancy could be taken in place of dead rider & is a very scary beatstick that is also quite fast. 5. How many Rotten Belles should a Seamus player own? 3, I start with 1-2, maybe summon another any more and you're just gimping your damage. 6. How often do you summon Belles with Seamus and/or Molly? Not terribly often. It takes a fairly high card of crows to do it & often times I would rather use that card for undead psychosis or a melee strike (Hint: Seamus hands out insignificant) 7. Which Totem do you take the most (if you take any at all)? Grave spirit, 1SS for armor 2? Yes, yes please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Da Big Baws Posted November 3, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 3, 2011 More questions: 8. How well/bad does Seamus handle Construct / Immune to Influence crews? 9. Would running Avatar Seamus at 25SS be a good move or is he better at higher SS games? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fritz the cat Posted November 3, 2011 Report Share Posted November 3, 2011 More questions: 8. How well/bad does Seamus handle Construct / Immune to Influence crews? 9. Would running Avatar Seamus at 25SS be a good move or is he better at higher SS games? 8. Ive swapped over to someone else for construct/likely construct crews. His tricks involve wp duels and moral duels with not alot of straight face beating. Ive been hosed pretty heavily when trying to face all construct crews. 9. I see his avatar as a viable choice at 25 but not really optimal personally. It really kinda depends no what you have around him. the 2ss isnt much to pay for the option of it though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buhallin Posted November 3, 2011 Report Share Posted November 3, 2011 Seamus does lose some utility against non-living crews, but it's not overwhelming, IMHO. It depends a lot on what you actually end up facing, but he's still got a lot of toys in the box that work vs. constructs. Things like Undead Psychosis and Lure still function fine, and the gun hammers stuff either way. McMourning tends to be my first choice if I know/really expect constructs, but Seamus can certainly compete. As for the avatar... I think the lower the stones value, the better he is to include, personally. Fewer models on the board mean every failed Morale Duel is a huge deal. At fewer stones you have less flexibility in your crew for dealing with an opponent's choices (such as the above-mentioned constructs), but Anathema evens it up quickly. And finally, unlike many masters, his requirements don't get harder with fewer models on the board, which means he'll still be pretty easy to manifest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Da Big Baws Posted November 3, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 3, 2011 (edited) Seamus does lose some utility against non-living crews, but it's not overwhelming, IMHO. It depends a lot on what you actually end up facing, but he's still got a lot of toys in the box that work vs. constructs. Things like Undead Psychosis and Lure still function fine, and the gun hammers stuff either way. McMourning tends to be my first choice if I know/really expect constructs, but Seamus can certainly compete. As for the avatar... I think the lower the stones value, the better he is to include, personally. Fewer models on the board mean every failed Morale Duel is a huge deal. At fewer stones you have less flexibility in your crew for dealing with an opponent's choices (such as the above-mentioned constructs), but Anathema evens it up quickly. And finally, unlike many masters, his requirements don't get harder with fewer models on the board, which means he'll still be pretty easy to manifest. My only opponent uses Constructs or Lady Justice. I guess Ressurectionists in general are a bad idea so I may not go this path...too bad...Seamus and the others seemed cool... Edited November 3, 2011 by Da Big Baws Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratty Posted November 3, 2011 Report Share Posted November 3, 2011 I would say 5 Belled is the sweet spot.. Normally I will start with 3, and a lot of the time I will only replace casualties, however there is a large enough percentage of my games (15% or so) where I get 1 or 2 extra out on top of my starting 3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
micahwc Posted November 3, 2011 Report Share Posted November 3, 2011 Having just lost a very close game with Hoffman against Seamus, I would say that Seamus can do pretty well against construct crews. I finally killed him, but if I remember correctly it took 3 or 4 turns to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Da Big Baws Posted November 3, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 3, 2011 Having just lost a very close game with Hoffman against Seamus, I would say that Seamus can do pretty well against construct crews. I finally killed him, but if I remember correctly it took 3 or 4 turns to do. Are you both equally skilled? If I go with a new crew (I'm probably going to), I'm giving my Hoffman crew to my brother, who has a Lady Justice crew (new in box yet). Both kinda hurt Seamus it seems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buhallin Posted November 3, 2011 Report Share Posted November 3, 2011 Seamus can play against a lot of Hoffman's weaknesses. Hoffman (in my experience) tends to run tightly clustered crews with a pretty low model count, and 1-2 heavy hitters that he drives to do all the damage. Undead Psychoses shuts that down in a hurry. Protect also requires models to stay close, and Lure can easily break the Protect chain. You probably won't win a slugfest, as you just won't have enough damage output... But you can certainly control the flow of the battle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stonedog-7 Posted November 3, 2011 Report Share Posted November 3, 2011 and Lure can easily break the Protect chain. Sorry if i'm missing something, but wouldn't Immune to Influence on most of the Guild constructs stop you luring things Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorian Posted November 3, 2011 Report Share Posted November 3, 2011 More questions: 8. How well/bad does Seamus handle Construct / Immune to Influence crews? 9. Would running Avatar Seamus at 25SS be a good move or is he better at higher SS games? Constructs are fine, just dont plan on summoning a lot of things. As for immune to influence again don't run a "Seamus" crew of all belles. I ran my seamus crew in treasure hunt against a traditional seamus crew. 4 Belles, sybelle, bete, seamus, totem. I had dead rider who is immune to influence. He conceded turn 2. All I did was bunker & send the rider forward to get the treasure. Since I was immune to influence he couldn't pull me in. Since he couldnt do much damage or close the distance he couldn't kill the rider. My biggest piece of advice is while a "Fluffy" seamus list spams belles, don't do it you will only kick yourself later. As for avatar, again I don't know. Personally I dont see much use for him but I havent tried him much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buhallin Posted November 3, 2011 Report Share Posted November 3, 2011 Sorry if i'm missing something, but wouldn't Immune to Influence on most of the Guild constructs stop you luring things Yes, but Hoffman himself isn't. Since he's usually the one you're interested in killing anyway, pulling him out of the chain will usually do the job. But I do also like Onryo or the Carrion Effigy to get around that in general, as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JuJubee Posted November 3, 2011 Report Share Posted November 3, 2011 avatar Seamus is great against construct crew, and undead,and... well just about anybody because his terrifying even affects them. but in 25 i would be leary of taking him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merces Posted November 3, 2011 Report Share Posted November 3, 2011 question 8 about the construct/immune to influence sybelle taking away benifit for armor a onryo taking away immunities to wp duels and i would dare to use Taelor if you against an all construct crew. weapon ignores armor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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