A Piece For Me + Unkillable Models = Body Part Counter Factory?

[demkoenig]

So, a Nurse makes a Desperate Merc unkillable (Painkillers).

Then McMourning hits the Desperate Merc for everything he's got.

The trigger says, "After damaging defender"

The Merc is "unkillable," but still takes damage; however, he has no wounds left, so he takes no damage.

Therefore, McMourning cannot get more body part counters off of the Desperate Merc when the Desperate Merc runs out of wounds?

[G3ck0___]

Damage (Dg) and wounds (Wd) are two different things, If a model takes 3 damage but has armor 2 it'll only take 1 wound.

So for this situation it would seem to me that the desperate merc still takes damage but no wounds (non left), the only effect here is he only dies in the start closing fase.

But I could be wrong ofcourse...

[G3ck0___]

correction : at the end of its next activation (unless you give it some more painkillers, which will replace the previous effect)

[G3ck0___]

hmm that second painkiller wouldn't change things, missed something there the first time. It would only make sense if you could do it during the DM's activation. But currently i can't think of a way to do that.

[HeroZero]

My interpretation is that since wounds are different from damage they are still damaged even with no wounds. Example is a a model is considred damaged even if armor reduces that damage to zero. In this case unkillable equates to punching bag.

[Buhallin]

Example is a a model is considred damaged even if armor reduces that damage to zero.

Armor cannot reduce damage below 1.

But otherwise, I concur with the general direction this is going - Damage is damage, whether it actually turns into any wounds or not. I don't necessarily see this being all that useful anyway, to be honest - trading 1 AP for 1 body part is not good math.

[Stern]

I am sure that the merc would keep taking damage and stay at 0wounds to spit out bodypart counters... until sacrificed...

however @Crush_jansen that would be cheeky but shame there rare 1 (in a brawl that would be awesome)

[Stern]

dead cheeky

that bad joke made me have a right chuckle... Nice one

[HeroZero]

The way I'm reading it allows for the dm/painkiller combo to let you summon a flesh construct on one AND get mc mourning into position with a walk and scalpel sling push.

Way I see it

Dm/canine remains walks

Nurse moves up and painkillers the dm/canine remains

Zombie chihuahua moves up and wracks for pain the dm

+1 bp

Mcmourning blows a ss for two parts +2 bp

Mcmorning spends for a bp for fast 1 bp

Mcmorning walks and scalpel swings dm/remains pushing into base contact 3 bp.

Doug wracks for pain 4bp

Triggers scalpelswinging for 5bp

Doug summons flesh construct

Sebastian moves up and hacks the crap out of the zombie chihuahua collects 4 bp

Turn 2

Repeat nurse process on dm

Seabass activates hacks up dm

Gives mcmourning prsents 7bp

Dm walks shoots whatever

Mcmourning repeats turn 1 and should be at 10 bp at this point

Summon rogue necromancy

See how this keeps rolling ?

[demkoenig]

You would need two DMs for that. Painkillers sacs the DM at the end of the activation.

[Stern]

You would need two DMs for that. Painkillers sacs the DM at the end of the activation.

indeed... but for 2ss the unkillableness and crazy attack runs can make them go nuts and well thats alot of win right there

[Fetid Strumpet]

Not sure if I like this combo. I mean it's ok as resser combos go, but I'm really starting to dislike the combos where we try to manipulate our minions on the opening turns with our masters as it burns those activations away, and as ressers in particular we don't have that many actions in the game.

[HeroZero]

I think you guys are mis reading pain killers... sacrifice at end of NEXT activation. If you already have activated it doesn't trigger. Next turn the nurse has to painkiller before the dm activates but as long as its doped your good to go. Of course it is dependant on the nurse living.

As far as wasting turns how you figure with this one mcmournings still advancing and throwing an extra activation model each turn. Within two turns your at two flesh constructs or a flesh construct / rogue necromancy in their side of the table. Turn 3 your easily sticking mcmourning in the nasty choppy

[HeroZero]

That's not lulz that's awesome. I prefer flesh constructs to Rnecro but I see what you did there...

[CRC]

Mcmourning blows a ss for two parts +2 bp

Because I noticed it, and it's a subtle thing: I believe you only get 1 BP per SS.

You can also pull the victim forward on round two, allowing a second scalpel slingin' push. That way you can get up to 12" of move.

Edited September 22, 2011 by CRC

[Stern]

Mcmourning blows a ss for two parts +2 bp

I read the 'a ss ' bit a lil wrong when I glazed over this

but true only 1 ss per bodypart counter and that is pre-game stuff too

[Buhallin]

Your Turn 1 plan doesn't work either - Scalpel Slingin' and his McMourning's summon are both (0) Actions. And "The Nurse moves up and Painkillers the two models" doesn't work, since that would take 3 AP. Reversing the order doesn't work, since that would cause the models to die via Painkillers.

All in all this one needs a bit of refinement, but I'd suggest that the rules forum is the wrong place to do it

[Cunning]

You might want to wait for an RM to answer this. There was a recent ruling about inflicting 0 wounds means on damage triggers don't take effect even if Damage inflicted was above 0, unless the damage of the weapon specifically causes 0 damage.

Which is pretty confusing but there you go.

[Akujie]

That ruling was a model with say a 0/0/1 damage flip that flips moderate damage does 0 damage and 0 wounds.

A model with say 1/2/3 damage flip that flips moderate damage does 2 damage (if left unmodified) and 2 wounds...however, if a prevention flip is done and they flip a moderate prevention, then no damage and no wounds are done.

So 0 dmg is 0 dmg, but 2 - 2 is no damage. basically if a prevention is flipped, that flip can turn it into no damage by matching or beating the damage done, so if you want to make 0 damage into no damage, you would have to make a prevention flip and not flip the black joker.

So my line of logic...which prolly means $$$$$$$$ all... is that if you keep wacking the dead dog that doesn't die, you should keep inflicting damage (unless black joker shows), and that in the wound translation is where all the trouble begins.

[Cunning]

But since the target has 0 wounds then that's actually a 3rd scenario from the other 2 and it would be up to a RM to decided which side it fell. In the 0 damage or no damage.

[Attila]

Sorry 4 resurrecting this topic

Following situation

Turn 1

(a) Canine activates, 2x pass

( Nurse activates, casts painkillers on Canine

© Sebastian activates, strikes 3x on Canine for some bodyparts

(d) McM activates, casts and strikes on Canine for some bodyparts

Does the Canine have 1 Wd or 0 Wd left (cause of painkillers)?

(e) If 0 Wds: Nurse2 activates, heals Canine

Is the effect of painkillers removed in the resolve effects step

so that the Canine won't die in his next activation in turn 2?

[Wolfgar]

This is going to need further clarification at some point. I'm getting an antacid.

[lminer]

This has come up and I would like to know as well if it is possible to claim body parts from an unkillable model after it has lost all of it's wounds.

[Ratty]

Does the Canine have 1 Wd or 0 Wd left (cause of painkillers)?

OK. The model remains on 0 Wd, it doesn't check for death as he can't be killed

.

(e) If 0 Wds: Nurse2 activates, heals Canine

Is the effect of painkillers removed in the resolve effects step

so that the Canine won't die in his next activation in turn 2?

The effect has a defined end time, IE it gets sacrificed at the end of it's next activation. Therefore it does not drop off as normal in the Resolve Effect Step.

[lminer]

Can you get body parts from a model with 0 Wds?

[CannonFodder]

Not sure of Official response, but below is my McMourning grow list.

Nurse give reactivate to totem, and usually McTavish (Shrug off, and potentially 3 corpse tokens later)

Totem goes Def Stance, and cast Wracked with Pain on Nurse (+1 BP)

Totem Focuses Wracked with Pain on Nurse (+1BP)

Mortimer makes a Corpse token (+2 BP)

McM Attacks Totem doing weak (+1 BP), Repeat (+1 BP), Takes totems corpse (+2 BP), Optional Fast to Move (-1 BP), Summon Flesh Construct (-5 BP),

McTavish activates last, using 2 activations long range to take out what he can.

Turn 2, nurse Positions, so that turn 3 can activate late in turn and reactivate McMourning if McMourning was able to make manifest requirements before hand. Preferable after a second flesh construct is summoned.