LoboStele Posted March 4, 2011 Report Share Posted March 4, 2011 Says 'Sacrifice this model. Summon three Steampunk Arachnids into base contact...' So I don't see why not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratty Posted March 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 4, 2011 Your right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilikepizza Posted March 4, 2011 Report Share Posted March 4, 2011 wait....how do u bury hoffman??? havent got my book to hand but i just wanted to know how Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratty Posted March 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 4, 2011 wait....how do u bury hoffman??? havent got my book to hand but i just wanted to know how Hire a Soulstone Miner and copy it's digging ability Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Bigglesworth Posted March 5, 2011 Report Share Posted March 5, 2011 Keep in mind you can't take Ryle and the M&SU Constructs. This limits your cheap models to Watchers, Arachnids which are insignificant, and 2 hunters. Ryle has a lot of synergy but his special forces really limits the crew you can take with Hoffman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tadaka Posted March 5, 2011 Report Share Posted March 5, 2011 Good point must keep that limit in mind. Dont have the book handy tho what low cost models does this cost you. The lowest cost I can think of is the spider and its 6 ss for hoffman not exactly a cheap model. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tadaka Posted March 5, 2011 Report Share Posted March 5, 2011 You bring the Guardian, and then it uses it's (0) action to grant Armor +2 to Hoffman. Then, it also activates (1) Protect. Then, if Hoffman gets hit, he could elect to gain the armor of a Construct, which he could select as the Guardian, who has Armor +2. So, since Hoff got Armor +2 from the Guardian's (0) ability, would he then have Armor +4 total? So, Hoffman would take Wds (Dg-4...nice!), but the Guardian's Protect ability would allow the Guardian to take those Wounds instead. Is that correct? If so...pretty cool. Then the Guardian uses Self-Repair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zwergenkrieger Posted March 5, 2011 Report Share Posted March 5, 2011 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tadaka Posted March 5, 2011 Report Share Posted March 5, 2011 You´re right. Armor doesn´t stack this way. You can stack armor as long as they are from different effects that one effect on hoffman says it does not stack so it cant. You can stack other armor effects. One question here: What´s exactly the M&SU term? What rules are connected to it? Does it have any further impact on crew selection? M&SU is a type of special forces just like ryle is part of the Elite division special forces unit. You cant combine one special forces type with another so no M&SU with Elite division. (Keep in mind there is M&SU member that is not a special forces group and M&SU asset that is special forces) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
izikial Posted March 6, 2011 Report Share Posted March 6, 2011 just a thought, may have already been sead, armor is technicly a talant so if you shiald wall an armor 2 guy he gets armor 6 then assimalate it and the hoff gets to keep armor 6 for ever, i know he wants othere constructs to have armor but if you use him solo (dont) then it would be nice, also is reactivate tecnicly under the talants catagory like fast is, so if you make some one els reactivate can the hoff then steal it? my thought for him is to use the ss miner and tool kit, assimalate tunnaling and over drive the ss miner, move them bothe up using link in or tap power depending on witch i think will be more use full at the time (link in for alpha strikes and the like tap powere if i need to see more of the hoffs stuff), and the toll kit will spring to me when ever is most apropriat, secon turn steal melee master and heal the ss miner with toolkit or hoff if he can and from then on use a tunnaling, melee master, possibly fast hoff with ca 7 to beat face and then hide, backed up by the ss miner assasin and the toolkit of joy. ahhh i like the hoff he makes me happy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tadaka Posted March 6, 2011 Report Share Posted March 6, 2011 (edited) You cant copy an effect with assimilate. Just because armor can be a talent does not make all armor a talent. The model would have armor 4 as an effect and armor 2 as a talent. If you copy you would get armor 2 not 6. If attacked he could use the 6 armor to block the attack as he can copy the armor from a model when attacked but that only lasts for the single attack. Reactivate is also not a talent on any model in the game so it can not be taken through assimilate. Edited March 6, 2011 by tadaka Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
izikial Posted March 6, 2011 Report Share Posted March 6, 2011 ahh well it was just a though, but fair enough Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoboStele Posted March 7, 2011 Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 You cant copy an effect with assimilate. Just because armor can be a talent does not make all armor a talent. The model would have armor 4 as an effect and armor 2 as a talent. If you copy you would get armor 2 not 6. If attacked he could use the 6 armor to block the attack as he can copy the armor from a model when attacked but that only lasts for the single attack. Reactivate is also not a talent on any model in the game so it can not be taken through assimilate. Well, you could still use the trick I mentioned earlier where the Guardian grants Armor 2 to Hoffman first, and then Hoffman also borrows the Guardians own Armor 2 if Hoff gets hit, for a total of Armor 4. Still pretty awesome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tadaka Posted March 7, 2011 Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 You can't do that Lobo. Hoffs own ability to take armor can not stack with other armor it says so. Other armor can stack but not that ability Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoboStele Posted March 7, 2011 Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 You can't do that Lobo. Hoffs own ability to take armor can not stack with other armor it says so. Other armor can stack but not that ability Oh sheesh....How'd I miss that??? Ugh...OK, now I understand the prior comments as well. Even if you have the Guardian grant the +2 armor to something else, Hoffman would still only be able to copy the other piece's original Talent armor, and not the extra +2 because it's an effect. OK, got it. Sorry for the confusion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tadaka Posted March 7, 2011 Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 (edited) Um lol not exactly. Hoffman has 2 copy abilities. One says when he is hit he copy's the armor of a model and it does not stack with other armor. Another can copy a talent or a spell from another model. If a model has 2 armor from Guardian and 2 base armor when Hoffman is hit he can copy the 4 armor because the right now the guy has 4 armor. However the guys "talent" never changes his "talent" has only 2 armor. So before he is hit Hoffman could take his talent that would have him 2 armor because even tho his has a bonus the talent is only 2. You just have to keep in mind its 2 different abilities. More often then not Hoffman will not use Assimilate for armor but he can. The best you will see most games is Guardian with shield wall would give hoffman 6 armor when struck in combat to copy. You can hit 8 with 2 Guardians however. Edited March 7, 2011 by tadaka Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wulfen Posted March 7, 2011 Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 IMO, there's no reason you'd want or even need to run cheap grunts with Hoffman. He was plenty potent when I ran him with a Peacekeeper, Guardians, Hunters, and Watchers. Even better with the added Steamborg Executioner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zwergenkrieger Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 IMO, there's no reason you'd want or even need to run cheap grunts with Hoffman. He was plenty potent when I ran him with a Peacekeeper, Guardians, Hunters, and Watchers. Even better with the added Steamborg Executioner. What´s the benefit in fielding a Steamborg Executioner? Not that I´m full of doubts, it´s just that I got the Ramos boxed set because of this model and then I realized that the Steamborg isn´t the best model to run with Ramos... Therefore I like to hear good news about the combo Hoffman / Steamborg, because I hope that Hoffman will revive my hopes for fielding a Steamborg. ZK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wodschow Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 What´s the benefit in fielding a Steamborg Executioner? Not that I´m full of doubts, it´s just that I got the Ramos boxed set because of this model and then I realized that the Steamborg isn´t the best model to run with Ramos... Therefore I like to hear good news about the combo Hoffman / Steamborg, because I hope that Hoffman will revive my hopes for fielding a Steamborg. ZK Humm.. Yeah I wonder about that aswell. Given the choice I think I'd go with the Peacekeeper most of the time.. Better utility for the stones in my opinion. (2SS cheaper, faster, much better defensive capabilities, ranged attack, etc. - for the price of a slightly weaker attack and no decapitation) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WUWU Posted March 9, 2011 Report Share Posted March 9, 2011 Hoffman is starting to sound pretty cool after reading this thread, I might end up picking up his box set. So, after flipping through the book I just noticed that his Totem is no insignificant. Do you guys think this is just an oversight, or was there already an errata on this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liono Posted March 10, 2011 Report Share Posted March 10, 2011 You´re right. Armor doesn´t stack this way. You can stack armor as long as they are from different effects that one effect on hoffman says it does not stack so it cant. You can stack other armor effects. One question here: What´s exactly the M&SU term? What rules are connected to it? Does it have any further impact on crew selection? M&SU is a type of special forces just like ryle is part of the Elite division special forces unit. You cant combine one special forces type with another so no M&SU with Elite division. (Keep in mind there is M&SU member that is not a special forces group and M&SU asset that is special forces) So Hoffman, who has M&SU, can't take his brother? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WUWU Posted March 10, 2011 Report Share Posted March 10, 2011 I don't have my books in front of me, but I believe what Tadaka was trying to point out is that since Ryle is Special Forces (Elite Division) if you hired him to your crew you can only take one other (Elite Division) model as a mercenary, and this would preclude you from taking any other model from a different special force, like the Soulstone Miner. Hoffman is a M&SU Member, which doesn't change the above in anyway. It really only effects what crews he could join in a brawl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoboStele Posted March 11, 2011 Report Share Posted March 11, 2011 It's the difference between M&SU Member, the general group, same as Ramos and Johan, and M&SU Asset, which is the Arcanist's Special Forces group. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liono Posted March 11, 2011 Report Share Posted March 11, 2011 Thanks for the clarification. As a neophyte I'm still trying to come to grips with the rules. I don't necessarily understand the Ramos / Johan example but I understand the intended difference between a master and minion/mercenary and that is the reason that the M&SU and Elite Division don't conflict for Hoffman and Ryle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Bigglesworth Posted March 12, 2011 Report Share Posted March 12, 2011 Thanks for the clarification. As a neophyte I'm still trying to come to grips with the rules. I don't necessarily understand the Ramos / Johan example but I understand the intended difference between a master and minion/mercenary and that is the reason that the M&SU and Elite Division don't conflict for Hoffman and Ryle. It does, only one group of special force can be chosen in any given army, even if the master/henchman in the crew has a special force characteristic. Second masters and henchman are limited to only 2 special force models unless they have the special forces characteristic associated with the models. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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