GrottoKnight Posted August 23, 2009 Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 I have worked at two hobby shops. I have been gaming since 1993 and now run a gaming club called PART TIME GENERALS. Many of the members are friends, long time gamers, and former hobby employees. Six of the members decided to go down to GENCON and many for the first time. Being MINI enthusiasts many of us were excited about MALIFAUX. The first demo guy did a poor job for two members but was overlooked because of the excitement over the game. The next demo that was given to three members, two of the same, came off well. Throughout the four day trip we had these three members seek to buy a large amount of stuff at WYRD. These buyers sought to get ALL models of one faction, the cards, and the rule book. Two walked away witht their factions. The third, a long time friend, former hobby salesman, and a hardcore gamer had all things available in hand and ready to purchase and walked away with nothing. You see, we have lots of different games we invest in and this gamer wanted the stuff bad and was looking for an excuse to snap into reasonable purchasing sense and not compulsively buy MALIFAUX. The salesman gave him one. Now, $100 or so in sales is not that much but long term faction sales add up and the more hobby groups like mine take interest in the game the more those $ add up. So I get the small fish big pond idealogy. One of the members of PTG that bought MALIFAUX gave this member the free model since it would work for the faction he intended to buy. When he put all the stuff on the counter to buy and asked if HIS FREE alternate model (ya, i get free) could be replaced with one of the regular models and was denied, you lost a faction worth of sales. He put everything back on the shelf and walked away empty handed. You may have hurt my groups overall interest in the game as now we have only two members that bought in thus far. I will be buying now after reading this tremendously well written story and loving the models. There are others in my hobby group of 15 strong that have been turned away by what this member related or a poor demo. I will do my best to help support your cause and help WYRD become a BIGGER fish in the miniature gaming pond but please don't let little $6 snafus like this continue. Make it so that if you offer a alternate mini for free that it could be swapped or that it is at the same $ as the regular if not free. I am sure this may come off as petty to many forum'ites but I wish I had one of my buds playing a game that I am buying into but is not because of one salesman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WEiRD sKeTCH Posted August 23, 2009 Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 (edited) How was the "denial of a free model" phrased? I understand that getting something for free can be a big thing, but lets just throw a similar situation out there. My friends and I are CCG players. We take turns going to a Manufacturer's booth at BIG con. The Manufacturers are giving out "Promo" Cards to help their game sales. I don't need the promo card but my friend wants it. I give it to him. He goes to the booth and tells them, I don't want that promo card, I want to exchange it for X card... Seriously? Dropping out of getting into a game because they want free swag that's not part of the clearly stated promotion is pettier than most things I've ever heard of. And the regular Hog Whisperer is not just the Whisperer. It's packaged with a Piglet, and packaged differently (clamshell, backing paper). Everything costs. And quibbling over a freebie is pretty ridiculous in my opinion. EDIT: Just so you know, I'm not trying to flame here. I'm just stating my own personal opinions on the situation. Edited August 23, 2009 by WEiRD sKeTCH Not trying to sound mean. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrottoKnight Posted August 23, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 And the regular Hog Whisperer is not just the Whisperer. It's packaged with a Piglet, and packaged differently (clamshell, backing paper). Everything costs. And quibbling over a freebie is pretty ridiculous in my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WEiRD sKeTCH Posted August 23, 2009 Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 I hope the convincing works well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goblyn13 Posted August 23, 2009 Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 chase figures, limited versions, etc, are specifically designed to be "chase" figures or considered ot be marketing materials, from a financial standpoint the models are put out to help draw additional attention. Since they are not even considered part of a regular inventory they are written off of the whole batch as advertising. since they are advertising they have no intrinsic value. trying to trade the "free model" would be like going to the grocery store with $7 worth of coupon on a bunch of stuff and trying to buy a pack of cigarettes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cacuin Posted August 23, 2009 Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 hey glad you bought into the game at least:) hopefully your bud will see how much fun you have with the game and they will get over a problem of perception and get into the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WEiRD sKeTCH Posted August 23, 2009 Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 Hey man... Smokes are around 10 bucks where I live! At 7 you're getting them at a steal! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrottoKnight Posted August 23, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 Hey man... Smokes are around 10 bucks where I live! At 7 you're getting them at a steal! $6 here in MI lots of 2 fer $5 sales though, i expect the taxes to go up again hey, I only smoke when I drink which isn't so often anymore with 2 kids Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supervike Posted August 23, 2009 Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 Hmm...Sorry your bud had a bad experience. I'm sure it was no one's intention to piss someone off. Hope he comes around, and not let one bad experience scare him from seriously good gaming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricJ Posted August 23, 2009 Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 Of course we did not want to turn away someone wanting to get into Malifaux, and actually, I think more than many of the game companies out there, we do all we can to make sure we treat our customers right. This means living up to our side of everything we post without fail. This means every time you are missing an Samuri Punk Zombie arm, we will replace it. Every time you get damaged product we replace it. Every time the game will need errata to make it work right, we will take the time to fix the problem and errata it so the game is fully supported. We also had 4 promotions going at Gencon where we were doing everything we could to give you, the customer, added value for getting into Malifaux. This included the free tape measure for buying the game book, a free temporary tatoo for everyone, a Raffle for a free fully painted crew, and of course the FREE gremlinette for purchasing $100 of product. All of these items were clearly spelled out as to exactly what was required to get your free item, and due to how busy we were at the show, we decided that just as we stick to our word when we are giving customer support, we will stick to our word on promotional items. I think you would agree that you would want a game company that makes decisions for policies based on up-front honesty and integrity, rather than based on a salesman-like policies. You would be surprised how many people came looking for more free things, and exceptions made specifically for them. The only way we can really deal with the number of requests is to stick to our up front policies, and not make exceptions, as once we start making exceptions we start down a dangerous road. One person wanted a Gremlinette for a $97 purchase, then next is just $3 more at $94. Once people hear that one the web we get a host of complaints rolling in. If we start exchanging Gemlinettes for other models in the range for free, how do we deny the next person who wants to do the same thing? or the next 10 or 100 or 1000 people? Like I said, we very much value your business, and we are not dismissing this as an issue that is too small to worry about, but we decided early on to run the business based on a simple standard that we openly state our promises, and then live up to them. That includes dedication to customer service, that includes releasing Malifaux at Gencon as promised, and this includes sticking to the letter of our promotions. This is something that we will always value at Wyrd. I hope this makes sense, as unfortunately the only other option we would have if this becomes an unmanageable problem for us, is to discontinue the free miniature promotions. This isn't something we'd like to do. Eric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBugKing Posted August 23, 2009 Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 I for one am glad that this type of topic can be brought up and talked about and that the owners are willing to respond in a calm and sane manner. Thanks to both of you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricJ Posted August 23, 2009 Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 Another of our stated goals is to be available and accessible as we can, in the forums and at shows. We value being part of the Malifaux community, and we've made policies based on what we think are the right reasons so we have no reason to hide! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrottoKnight Posted August 23, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 Another of our stated goals is to be available and accessible as we can, in the forums and at shows. We value being part of the Malifaux community, and we've made policies based on what we think are the right reasons so we have no reason to hide! To your responses: Excellent, very surprised at the attentiveness, and even more excited at promoting a game that has so much love put into it. I WILL be making my friend read you response as will some of the other gamers in my group. I will print this off. Thank you kind forum'ites and Game Designer. Also, I must reiterate again how much I love the story and the models and am eager to find out how the game plays. I just started to read the rules after I spent 6 work breaks and 3 work lunch ours reading the story:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricJ Posted August 23, 2009 Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 Great! glad to hear you're liking it, I think you will like the rules too, we put lots of work into them, and I think we made something fun! Also we very much appreciate the support within your gaming group, we may have to recruit you as a henchman :vb_devil: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nerdelemental Posted August 23, 2009 Report Share Posted August 23, 2009 Recruit him a closer LGS first. That way he doesn't have to drive ~45 minutes every week down to mine! ...not that I don't want him coming - I love the group Grotto brings. You guys are good, solid, play-for-the-joy-of-it gamers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DangerousBeans Posted August 24, 2009 Report Share Posted August 24, 2009 It sounds like your friend took it personally. I'm very used to working with sales (worked for a big horrible stationary shop beginning and ending with S for 7 long, soul destroying years) and the problem is, if you compromise with one person, you have to do it for everyone. If your mate had got something else free, then went up to people and went "cool I got this thing free instead of the Gremlinette", then other people would expect the same and consequently, chaos ensues! I'm certain that your mate could have sold it on for at the very least $10 to someone, or wait a while and put it on ebay. It's a shame he came out of it feeling the way he did but it's just bidness yo'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilus Posted August 24, 2009 Report Share Posted August 24, 2009 Sorry to here about your friends bad experience. Honestly I am more concerned about the demos. Is there anything you friends said about the demo they didn't like? I know from personal experience running them that everyone is looking for something different in a demo and the really trick is to read the person and figure out what they care about. Some people want to just here about the rules, others want to here the storyline and others still just want to know which faction gets the killer baby. But any feedback on how the demos went would be great so we demoers can see what we can do differently next time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrottoKnight Posted August 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2009 Sorry to here about your friends bad experience. Honestly But any feedback on how the demos went would be great so we demoers can see what we can do differently next time. To Nilus, WED is our weekly PTG meeting so I will ask the couple guys there and/or email them so I can forward along their feedback. :listen: I am glad to help. Don't forget these same guys went back and had a good experience but I get the fact that you are looking for the differences. I will direct IM you if you like just let me know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wren Posted August 25, 2009 Report Share Posted August 25, 2009 I understand both the lost customer POV and Wyrd's, probably coming down on Wyrd's side a little more as I understand from personal experience that any deviation from a consistent, stated policy for one person can turn into opening of worm cans on a wider front. And I'm very happy to see everyone involved expressing themselves politely and rationally. What puzzles me about this story is this... the free model is limited in availability. The buyer could have easily accepted a second one and come on here and found a Wyrd fan who couldn't make it to Gen Con or couldn't spend $100 there who would be happy to buy the Gremlinette or exchange it for another Wyrd model he was interested in. I'd certainly be happy to buy or trade for one! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jubilee Posted August 25, 2009 Report Share Posted August 25, 2009 I also find the concept of a gamer who is not instantly enamoured of anything "limited" quite baffling.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewartoad Posted August 25, 2009 Report Share Posted August 25, 2009 If for some reason Wyrd stops it's promotional mini's...I'm going head hunting! LOL I just wish I could have made one purchase to get that mini...but had to make two instead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paradox Posted August 27, 2009 Report Share Posted August 27, 2009 Rob, who walked away from buying? Just curious. I'd like some clearer detail, but it sounds a little silly to dump a buy over not getting to swap a free mini. I also have a sales position (in addition to the many other things I do) and when you have clearly worded promotions, going outside the stated deal often ends badly for the company, resulting in potential $$ losses for having to give that deal to X others because people talk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paradox Posted August 27, 2009 Report Share Posted August 27, 2009 Recruit him a closer LGS first. That way he doesn't have to drive ~45 minutes every week down to mine! ...not that I don't want him coming - I love the group Grotto brings. You guys are good, solid, play-for-the-joy-of-it gamers. They have to have an LGS first. So far as I know, the Gamers Square thing didn't happen. So much for an east side game store. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrottoKnight Posted August 31, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 31, 2009 Rob, who walked away from buying? Just curious. . We game at his place currently Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magno Posted September 1, 2009 Report Share Posted September 1, 2009 Bad salesmanship? Let you friend know that the owner and creator of this game has been sending out a SINGLE bit lost in a starter set to multiple people amidst the massive bum rush of LGSs and distributors across the nation putting in huge orders and being sold out of gear. Within days of asking for them. At GenCon, the top demoers were aanswering questions in the middle of another demo, giving painting and terrain advice, while other companies through out a flibberty jibbet or shotgunned and explanation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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