Tournament slow play

[cryion]

Hi. A question to both TOs and players... How do you handle "slowplay"?

In our tournaments a round is limited to 2 hours. In the rulebook it's even less. Now in general games in our shop outside of tournaments last longer than that. That's fine (even though it might be good to try to play as fast as possible to get used to playing in little time).
But obviously in tournaments there is a need to get everything done faster.

What if one player plays slower than the other player? What do you do? As a player? As a TO?

Our TO was thinking about deathclocks (like in chess) and give everyone 1 hour for their actions and if they run out of time, the other play can keep on playing until his time ran out (or the game ends, obviously).
But it seems this brings many issues (punching a clock, my activation doesnt only consist of actions by me, punishing newer players, etc.)

(Btw this is an issue with a lot of our players - including me. I dont see how a game with a ton of situations that can be very complex can be played this fast heh).

So, what to do? (Would also be interested in how this is handled in bigger, "official" tournaments.

Thanks!

[Adran]

I think "Deathclock" has been tried, and seen not to work well, as there is a lot of player interaction in each turn. 

If you are just playign slowly, and don't complete the 5 turns, then most of the time, you just have to live with that in tournements. If you think your opponent is deliberatly playing slow, call over the judge/T.O. to keep an eye on it. 

A lot of the time issue does come down to how used you are to your crew and your opponents crew. I personally will normally finish the 5 turns well before the 2 hours. I would suggest practising playing games in 2 hours if there are a group of you going to a tournement soon. Practise and familiarity really are the best answers to time. 

 

[PeregrineFalcon]

some of the best ways you as a TO can help combat slow play. Is by actively observing the games and being timely in letting players know how much time is left well before the final 15 minutes. One bit that I was suggested to add to my score sheet was a place to note what turn the game reached. It simply puts emphasis on it without doing anything other than having people record what turn they got 2. By placing a target people often hit it because they have something they are aiming for. Those 2 things tend to be the best remedies for slow play. 

Also will trumpet the benefits of the henchman hardcore format to helping players get faster.

Very true. These are key things to do. I could just 'like' this but I want to really emphasis how important it is for the TO to be involved with mitigating slow play. Joe gives some great ideas, all which I've tried and can attest DO really work. 

Out of all of the things though, I'd say the single most important is 100% without a doubt tell your players at the START of the event when you'll be calling times so they know when they hear your voice to not only pay attention but really process the amount of time left. 

Next is something that I personally do because I don't like hearing after from players saying "Oh I didn't hear you". Well I go around to EACH and EVERY table and look both players in the eye and say how much time is left. Sure it takes a little time but its not bad, and for me it helps save my voice so I don't have to constantly yell and assume people heard me. The eye to eye contact is assurance that each player heard me, I wait for a nod or thumbs up or gesture to make sure they received the message. I find this sort of approach vital in the last hour of a round. My typical announcements are:

• Broadcasted ROUND START
• 15min later - Go around to each table and make sure players are deployed and have STARTED turn 1.
• Broadcasted 90 MINUTES LEFT
• Broadcasted 60 MINUTES LEFT (then proceed to go around to every table and get assurance each person heard); I also get a gauge of what turn everyone is one and make sure they are on turn 3 at least, otherwise I kindly say, you need to pick up speed and should be on turn 3.
• Broadcasted 30 MINUTES LEFT (again follow-up to each table)
• Broadcasted 10 MINUTES LEFT (again follow-up to each table)
• At this point I'm constantly walking around to tables (there aren't many games going on at this point)
• 5min remaining - broadcast and make sure everyone knows last turn (i.e. don't start a new turn)
• 1min remaining - broadcast last activation and check that every table is doing so

This may seem excessive but it helps everyone. Me as a TO make sure I get score sheets on time, and that players are moving at a healthy pace in their games. Honestly there isn't much else to do as a TO during a round unless rules questions pop-up. 

[hippodruid]

Just to echo Adran, it all comes down to familiarity.  I routinely finish tournament games with 20+ minutes on the clock, but I've played a good amount of Malifaux.  I play a lot slower in friendly games, usually around 2-3 hours.

The best thing to do to increase your speed of play is to play with a known, hard time limit.  We did that at the local store, playing "tournament mode" in the run up to tourneys just to get the timing and speed down.

As far as penalizing slow play, as a TO, I wouldn't do it unless it was intentional.  New players should still feel welcome to play, even if they're not 100% familiar with the game.  As a player, I've had opponents who played slow.  My second or third tournament, my first opponent and I only made it to Turn 2, and that was at Gencon.  No hard feelings about that game.

I'd also stay away from the use of paired clocks.  Just set an alarm or timer and play as quickly as you can.  When the alarm goes off, the game is over.  Nervously, but not unkindly remind each other that you have a time limit for this game if things are taking a bit longer.

[Adran]

The Hardcore format is a 20 ss henchmen lead game that is played in 20-30 minutes. There are various rules around, but typically, its exactly 4 models, you can't add to your henchmans cache, its a turf war game and the only scheme is assasinate. 

Its very fast paced

[PeregrineFalcon]

1. Playing more Hardcore (which got us used to quick play)

What exactly does that mean? ^^

Take a look at this zip file, in it contains the Official Hardcore Rules. In particular the file "Alternate Tournament Formats Printer Friendly.pdf", page 1

http://www.wyrd-games.net/s/Organized-Play-Formats.zip

 

[rancor709]

some of the best ways you as a TO can help combat slow play. Is by actively observing the games and being timely in letting players know how much time is left well before the final 15 minutes. One bit that I was suggested to add to my score sheet was a place to note what turn the game reached. It simply puts emphasis on it without doing anything other than having people record what turn they got 2. By placing a target people often hit it because they have something they are aiming for. Those 2 things tend to be the best remedies for slow play. 

Also will trumpet the benefits of the henchman hardcore format to helping players get faster.

[valhallan42nd]

We had a few problems with this in our area. We lowered player times by:
 

1. Playing more Hardcore (which got us used to quick play)
2. Setting the game's pace ourselves
3. Clearly communicating -politely, but firmly- when a player was playing slowly.

[cryion]

1. Playing more Hardcore (which got us used to quick play)

What exactly does that mean? ^^

[cryion]

...

Take a look at this zip file, in it contains the Official Hardcore Rules. In particular the file "Alternate Tournament Formats Printer Friendly.pdf", page 1

http://www.wyrd-games.net/s/Organized-Play-Formats.zip

 

I like it. I need to try this.

[sharpobjects]

If a player feels they are being slow played near the end of the game they should notify the T.O. and the T.O then monitors the final 5-10 min of the game and ensures the player activates his models in a timely fasion and moves along so both players can finish the turn before the time ends. If the player is still moving slowly in the prescence of the T.O. after he has been warned then the T.O. can disqualify that player. 

Slow play is not about a player who plays the game slow from the start of the game. If the player is playing the same way through out the whole game then you just got stuck with a player who is slow and probably is new. So you better have picked schemes you can accomplish in 3 turns. Since round 1 of an event can pair you with any random player its best to pick schemes you can accomplish quickly in case your first opponent is new and slow. If you win your first round more often than not your going to be playing against a more experienced player in round 2 since they won their first round as well. 

The issue is when you have an opponent who is playing quickly for the most part all game but in the final turn all of a sudden slows down because they are winning and if they allow the turn to be completed they will lose and they can see it right away. Thats when the T.O. needs to get involved. It is very unfortunate because this creates tension and bad feelings and we play the game to have fun. 

Slow play is not a tactic for a player to use to win the game. It should be discouraged. At the start of a tournament a T.O. should announce and remind all players that slow playing will not be tolerated. Show sportsmanship and play quickly even if playing quickly may ensure your defeat.

Because Malifaux does not work with death clocks like in other Miniature games we must ensure players are fair to each other. Players need the chance to move their models and do the things they need to do in order to score points. A player taking several minuttes to decide his course of action near the end of the game to run out the clock is poor sportsmanship. 

 

 

 

 

[Gnomezilla]

Did Hardcore help all the players to play more quickly? Did the summoners still play slow because they were not practicing putting their new models out on the board?