Pandora's new player - Need for advices and help

[AndyP.]

Hi ladies and gents!

I'm a really new player of Neverborn and of Pandora.

I bought the special edition box set because is too amazing and now I also want to play her at the best.

I'd like to start with a little dimension crew of 25 SoulStones.

Could you help me with it and suggest me which is better to change or what models I have to improve?

Actually my list is:

Pandora 4 cache

+ Fear Given Form 1

+ Voices 1

+ The Box Open 2

Potergeist 5

Insidious Madness 5

Sorrow 5

Sorrow 5

25/25

I was fascinated by Candy and Baby Kade but using them I have not a lot models in play and as Ramos player I'm afraid about that.

I usually summon more models to have numeric superiority but now I'm really scared to have low quantity of models.

Do you have suggests for me?

Thanks in advance to everybody!!!

[Myth]

The main weakness of the list, I think, is that you are bringing a lot of very fragile models. Pandora herself is quite tough (since she can use her Wp 7 to defend against just about any attack, and can push away from harm whenever she wins a duel.) But the rest of the crew is potentially quite easy to kill, and relies strongly on Incorporeal to stay alive.

If using that crew, my big advice would be to take advantage of the real benefit of Incorporeal - the fact you can move freely through terrain. The Poltergeist and the Madness have fantastic movement, while the Sorrows can teleport to other models. Use your greater mobility to hide behind buildings and make the opponent come to you. Pandora can get engaged with the enemy and threaten them with Fears Given Form, with Inflict, with Misery, with Terrifying, etc. Once she has tied enemies up (and potentially given you some control over their activations), the others can move in to really pile on the pain. (Or you can simply have the Madness fly around the board dropping scheme markers or the like.)

Also, one thing of note - I don't believe Pandora can take both Voices and The Box opens, as they are both Limited upgrades. The Box Opens gives her Terrifying, which can be strong defensively. Voices lets her Paralyze enemies, which can help keep the rest of her crew safe.

[Phototoxin]

Llitu is pretty good with pandora or a doppleganger. I would go with 'boys before toys' and cut down on upgrades at the 25ss level. But yes you need to combo and out manoeuvre your opponent. To kill stuff use pandy in conjunction with sorrows - each failed duel = damage

[AndyP.]

The main weakness of the list, I think, is that you are bringing a lot of very fragile models. Pandora herself is quite tough (since she can use her Wp 7 to defend against just about any attack, and can push away from harm whenever she wins a duel.) But the rest of the crew is potentially quite easy to kill, and relies strongly on Incorporeal to stay alive.

Also, one thing of note - I don't believe Pandora can take both Voices and The Box opens, as they are both Limited upgrades. The Box Opens gives her Terrifying, which can be strong defensively. Voices lets her Paralyze enemies, which can help keep the rest of her crew safe.

Which model you suggest to use?

I like both Poltergeist for his ability to give -2Wp and his big movement and Insidious Madnes for the ability to discard control cards to cheat fate. So potentially you can empty opponent hand with 3 actions and he maybe have to discard high cards.

I really don't kow if could be a good idea to substitute 2 sorrows witha Doppleganger, I know she is great with Pandora but wouldn't I have too low amount of models in play?

About upkeep query, why I shouldn't use two different limited upgrades on one model? Is it forbidden by manual?

I never heard or read about that.

Again on upgrades, which should I avoid at 25ss?

I thinked that Fear Given Form and Voices are really helpful on Dora.

Thanks i advance for your help!

[Mason]

About upkeep query, why I shouldn't use two different limited upgrades on one model? Is it forbidden by manual?

I never heard or read about that.

A model can only ever have one upgrade with the Limited restriction. It's in the rulebook.

[Thaarup]

About upkeep query, why I shouldn't use two different limited upgrades on one model? Is it forbidden by manual?

I never heard or read about that.

Just to complete Mindshreds comment;

It is in the Rulebook page 72, under the "Upgrades" paragraph about restrictions on Upgrades.

• A model may only purchase one Upgrade with the Limited restriction.
  

[Myth]

Which model you suggest to use?

I like both Poltergeist for his ability to give -2Wp and his big movement and Insidious Madnes for the ability to discard control cards to cheat fate. So potentially you can empty opponent hand with 3 actions and he maybe have to discard high cards.

Yeah, all of them do add a bunch of power multipliers so that when they are all together, the enemy is really debuffed in a lot of ways. The problem is getting them all in position to do so and keeping them alive in the process.

If you keep Fears Given Form and Voices on Pandora, that would free up 2 SS. You could drop one Sorrow and replace it with an Illuminated, who adds some durability and decent offense to the crew, and whose low-level Terrifying will work well with the Wp debuffs. However, you won't get the full benefit of the Illuminated's Brilliance interactions, and acquiring a single Illuminated model might not be the easiest thing. Or, as noted, you could instead get a Doppelganger for the same cost, who is a very handy and versatile figure.

At 25 SS, there is only so much room overall, so I wouldn't say any major changes are needed. You just need to make sure you keep your models as safe as you can. If you do take Voices on Pandora, you can focus on Paralyzing the scariest enemy model, which can give you some freedom to get in position with a bit more safety.

[Gorbad]

One thing I'd say with Pandora is a don't put all your eggs in the Wp basket. Its tempting to make every model about that, but its going to make for a very one sides crew and leave you short of options. Especially at 25 points I'd focus more on self sufficient models and less on bringing buff/debuff models, espwically fragile ones like here. Personally I'd drop Voices (I find the Box Opens better) and then drop probably a Sorrow and the Poltergeist. That would give you 11ss to get something else for, a Tot and an Illuminated/Silurid/Beckoner could be an option. The dobbleganger is cool, but its a model Of personally leave for bigger games as you want to make sure she have something good to copy.

[HalcyonSeraph]

One thing I'd say with Pandora is a don't put all your eggs in the Wp basket. Its tempting to make every model about that, but its going to make for a very one sides crew and leave you short of options. Especially at 25 points I'd focus more on self sufficient models and less on bringing buff/debuff models, espwically fragile ones like here. Personally I'd drop Voices (I find the Box Opens better) and then drop probably a Sorrow and the Poltergeist. That would give you 11ss to get something else for, a Tot and an Illuminated/Silurid/Beckoner could be an option. The dobbleganger is cool, but its a model Of personally leave for bigger games as you want to make sure she have something good to copy.

This. Make sure you can still do SOMETHING if you come up against a crew that is hard as nails against WP attacks. You can do this while still having synergy with Pandora by using someone like Kade, Teddy, or Lelu, who provide Df attacks and some resilience while still benefitting from Woe buffs and offering some WP synergy.

At 25 I would definitely drop Voices, Poltergeist and one of the Sorrows and add either Teddy or a Tot plus one of the 7 cost guys.

[phreaker187]

I'd take out an Insidious Madness, Fears Given Form, and Voices and replace them with a Doppleganger.

Neverborn plays a low model count 90% of the time, that's just how they work. They make up for it in killing and tricks though, so it evens out.

---------- Post added at 08:41 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:20 PM ----------

Just notice you need to take out Voices or The Box Opens anyway. You can only have 1 limited upgrade on her.

[AndyP.]

Thanks everybody guys for your advices.

Maybe I'll try different lists with all your suggets and see which is better way to play.

Soon there will be a tournament in Italy at 40ss and I don't know who I will use...

Maybe you will see me again asking about advices on a list for that purpose

___________________________________________

As I said before here I add my sketch of a list 40ss

I can use only one list that cannot change during all the event.

Pandora 6

+ Fear Given Form 1

+ Voices 1

+ Fugue State 2

Poltergeist 5

Widow Weaver 8

+ Hand Bag 2

+ Pact 1

Doppleganger 7

Insidious Madness 5

Sorrow 5

40/40

Here I don't know if only one sorrow is enough, but also is difficult to avoid use IM.

Is really helpful with a lot of WP duels and the ability to discard to cheat on opponent.

What do you think about that list?

I was also thinking to remove the sorrow and 2ss from the pool to add Baby Kade and use him in combo with teddy when and if I'll be able to create him with the WW.

Suggests and opinions are welcome as always

Edited January 30, 2014 by AndyP.

[phreaker187]

Looks good.  Pretty close to what I run, but I swap out Widow Weaver and a Madness at 40 and plug in Nekima.  Pact and Obsidian Talons are amazing on Nekima, but should probably come in at the 50 point level.

[Patzer]

I would suggest a copuple of things regarding what upgrades to take with Pandora.

First, aether connection is a really good upgrade for Pandora. She is quite fragile when she is taking damage and this helps to keep those

precious wounds stay a little longer. Secondly, I will piggyback Gorbad and say that you should not overlook The Box Opens, especially if you are already taking Fears Given Form. The two auras can together get your opponent to throw away quite a lot of cards, which will protect Pandora and her crew.

Nevertheless, if you are going with Voices, have a look at the Depression upgrade. It makes it easier to get those crows in order to paralyze models.

Regarding what crew to take with her, I will suggest that you look to ad some resilience and hitting power. The models you have in your list atm are quite squishy. Some suggestions: Bishop can attack WP and brings overall versatility; Kade/Teddy-combo works really well with Pandora and can attack both wp/defense; at last, Terror Tots are just great objective grabbers.

[Gorbad]

Yeah, The Box Opens and Fears Given Form is a resource drain first and foremost. In most games they probably won't 'do' very much, but your opponent will have to waste a lot of cards on not making them do anything. And that's easily worth the price of admission.

 

Oh, and lastly remember that everyone is disposable. I often get Pandora killed, but if she have done her job it doesn't matter. So don't be afraid to throw her out there to be a big fat distraction and wreck your opponents crew/plan. That's what she does best and hopefully she can command enough attention that your objective runners can do their thing.

 

 

 

Edit: I've not tried the Weaver, or even really looked at the rules, so I have no idea what she does. It's a summoner/debuff model isn't it?

[Tuttleboy]

WW has a 0 that creates a marker that gives a -1 Wp to enemies within 3" and LoS and has Terror (All) 11. She's also got a 8" Ca attack that causes a model that takes damage to make a TN 12 Horror duel. She can bring something to almost every Neverborn crew, but she's expensive.