Why I Am Not Quitting Malifaux...

[wrabbit37]

It seems to be all the rage to be quitting Malifaux at the moment, and I wish I could jump onto the wave and ride it through, indignation held high, but try as I might, I just can’t seem to want to quit playing Malifuax. My wife might appreciate it if I did (and would certainly prefer I quit before GenCon when our bank account takes a little bit of a hiccup) but I can find no reason to quit.

Is the game perfect? No. But there are certainly strides being taken to make the game better. The problem is that there is no final “perfect”. What I think would make the game better is not the same thing others do. In our local meta, Nicodem is good, the Viktorias clean through opposition, and the Dreamer was never really a big issue. But that’s just my meta. Others were very different. So while I was not on the wagon of people who wanted the Dreamer to see massive changes, and I did not think he was the best master in the game, I accept that others did. Wyrd did what they should do – they listened, both to people who said it was a problem and people who said it wasn’t – and decided where to go with the model. I am glad they didn’t jump into the changes immediately. Of course, on the flip side, if they were going to make those changes, I wish they had made them quicker.

I feel like we’re at an exciting time in Malifaux right now. Book 4 is coming out with a brand new faction. The FAQ and Errata document just hit not too long ago. Dead Heat has injected some real worldwide competition into the game. Podcasts have been spawning more podcasts and the community feels energized. Story Packs are upcoming. GenCon is upcoming. Book 3 is nearly entirely released.

I used to play Warmachine and I loved my time there too. I feel like Malifaux is about to reach the same point that was my favorite time playing Warmachine. I, for one, don’t want to miss what’s coming down the pipe.

As for the question of balance in the game, one forum-goer once said that it’s an asymmetrical game. That’s the design of the game. There will be times where one crew has an advantage over the other. There will be some minions that have very niche places to operate and won’t see a lot of play outside them. Guess what: that’s not a problem. The game is designed around the idea that you know what your plan is to do before you figure out what you’re taking with you to do it. So if you pull up an objective that requires you to get into your opponent’s deployment zone, don’t choose to play the guy who has WK 3”. Choose to play someone different. And if you choose to play the guy who does not have the tools to win the game, that’s okay too. Just don’t point to the game as an example of how terrible that guy is.

Because of its asymmetry, Malifaux has kept me interested in it far more than other games have. With Warmachine (again, a game I loved in its prime), it was always the same goal: kill the opposing caster. Yes, there were other objectives, but killing the caster always won anyway. With Malifaux, there are so many variables beyond just the models my opponent takes. I have to consider what he’s doing, what I’m doing, and then possibly consider what I don’t know he’s doing but have to figure out from his moves if I can stop whatever it looks like he might be doing. All while obfuscating what my actual plans are too. I could flip Supply Wagon thirteen times and have thirteen VERY different games based on what my opponent flipped too, and that’s not even taking into account Schemes, Terrain, or model choices.

There will be one day, I’m sure, where I play my last Malifaux game. I have told my friends that I have the unfortunate dueling desires of wanting to get a lot of new things while also not having the game expand any. One day, the tipping point will get too far and I’ll decide to pack up the models and move on to the next great game. But that’s not today. Today, as much as I want to be on the in-crowd and quit the game, I simply can find no reason to do so.

In the meantime, I hope that most everyone else feels the same as I do. No sense in leaving the game when it's just pulling into the first station. Better to stay seated for the whole ride.

Sorry for the length. I thought these were supposed to be long.

---------- Post added at 01:44 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:40 PM ----------

To clarify a little - I am not suggesting that those quitting Malifaux should not, or should be thought less of for doing so. I just wanted to offer an opposite viewpoint as to why I decided against quitting the game when I was inspired to think about it.

Edited July 10, 2012 by Justin

[Dorian]

Let's not forget. A key component I absolutely LOVE in malifaux, Deny. I played a game against Nayte yesterday and got an early lead. I realized he could still tie by delivering the message to Ramos, who is quite slow, so I had his mobile toolkit blast him with electrical fire and red joker the damage.

No other game can I say, alright I've got X points locked up guaranteed even if I get tabled here and now, so I just need to deny my opponent Y points and I can secure a win. I absolutely love that mechanic which may stem from LoL and the old deny-plank.

[dgraz]

If we both didn't already have wives, I'd ask you to marry me.

[Sandwich]

I'm not sure this was the right time to post this as the author(s) of the original thread are going to take it as far more offensive than you intended, or, if you did intend to offend, then I believe it will certainly be received as such.

That said, I'm absolutely here to stay.

With my annoying opinions and non-biased statements.

;D

[wrabbit37]

If we both didn't already have wives, I'd ask you to marry me.

I'm.... not sure how to take that. Sincerest admiration, perhaps?

[dgraz]

I'm not sure this was the right time to post this as the author(s) of the original thread are going to take it as far more offensive than you intended, or, if you did intend to offend, then I believe it will certainly be received as such.

That said, I'm absolutely here to stay.

With my annoying opinions and non-biased statements.

;D

I'm guessing that it has nothing to do with offense. Only providing the counter to the negativity for newer players that posts like the original create.

I'm.... not sure how to take that. Sincerest admiration, perhaps?

I do enjoy keeping people guessing.

[Guy in Suit]

I will keep playing Malifaux as long as it's players continue to have the best personal hygiene - a sadly overlooked quality in other table-top games.

[Justin]

That said, I'm absolutely here to stay.

I should clarify: I thanked your post because of this part.

[Malandres]

I could flip Supply Wagon thirteen times and have thirteen VERY different games based on what my opponent flipped too, and that’s not even taking into account Schemes, Terrain, or model choices.

This is because as they only really play tournaments here in the UK and the majority are all shared

[Sliver Chocobo]

I've just started demoing, of cause I'm going to stay

That and my soul is legal property of Wyrd, so I really have no say

[Dumb Luck]

I'm not quitting because golf.

[Vargas79]

I will keep playing Malifaux as long as it's players continue to have the best personal hygiene - a sadly overlooked quality in other table-top games.

This was my gaming group's unnoficial pre-requisite for allowing others to game with us. Malifaux was by far the best. 40k/Warmahordes by far the worst (not that I've ever played Warmahordes, Ive just always been able to smell the gamers who do).

[Pierowmaniac]

With my annoying opinions and non-biased statements.

;D

Thats why I thanked you

[Gruesome]

I'm not quitting because golf.

Hey!

[Dumb Luck]

Hey!

It's going on a t shirt, son.

[TeeCee]

malifaux was the first (and really only) table top game i've ever played. it's something that my husband and i can do together. compared to what i have heard from my gaming group, who have been playing table top games for almost decades and some have left malifaux for other games, malifaux is the game for me. i love the whole complexity of this game and the fact that it's not just tabling your opponent. as long as their are enjoyable players and the game grows and keeps being interesting... i'm not leaving either.

[Twisted Metal]

What happens in the UK has no influence on my entertainment in the US. I'm here to stay.

[Omenbringer]

I will keep playing Malifaux as long as it's players continue to have the best personal hygiene - a sadly overlooked quality in other table-top games.

I got to admit this made me laugh a lot.

As for the game and original topic...

I love the game and its intricacies (overt and subtle tactics/strategy), player interactions (it feels more like roleplaying than mini gaming to me) and the story (you never have the whole picture so can fill in the blanks yourself).

I have had times where I considered leaving because of "power gamers" that defined themselves by their win record instead of the fun (present in all games but in my experience significantly lower in Malifaux) and I have always stayed. As long as it doesn't evolve from a skirmish game into something bigger, I will continue to enjoy and promote it.

[Cornelious1424]

As long as it doesn't evolve from a skirmish game into something bigger, I will continue to enjoy and promote it.

Agree with you 100% on this.

Malifaux is the only system I've played in the past 3 years I have not taken a break from. I've sold both my 40k and Warmachine stuff in that time span due to the systems getting too stale, too expensive, no interest in the direction of the game. I've taken multiple, extended breaks from WHFB as well (can't quite cut my ties there). Maybe I'm blessed to be in a community that isn't highly competitive and would rather a more casual playing experience, because it seems to me that the players that are "up and leaving" are in highly competitive environment. No game is going to be perfect and Malifaux is no different, but the rules and the interactions between models (for the most part) is the most balanced I've come across.

Hi, my name is Tim and I love Malifaux, I won't be leaving any time soon!

[fishtank]

I just read the "Why I'm quitting thread" and can sympathise with the reasons expressed for leaving.

however, I also think that the issues are being blown out of proportion, at least to a degree.

Does Malifaux have problems with balance: yes it does.

Are these being addressed?: If you read the quit letters you'd say no. I disagree. The errata to the Dreamer was well thought out and left him doing many of the tricks he could before but removing the ridiculous unfun elements. We are told that some of the issues raised are being looked at.

Much is being made of the time being taken by Wyrd to rectify the perceived imblances. I think the expectations are FAR too high here. I can look at Warmachine - a game which I think Malifaux can be easily compared to, as I think Wyrd are walking a very similar path to Privateer - and point at a host of balance and power creep issues which are pushing me away from that game....not least the fact that Scenarios are completely unimportant most of the time,as the majority of games come down to Caster Kill. That's a game which has gone through a 1.5 and 2nd edition. Thing is that I still trust Privateer, and I still trust Wyrd. Unlike a certain other company they listen to the players and seem to be doing their best to sort things out. I understand one company erratas their game based on the forum chatter pretty much weekly...same company whose rulebook is an unreadable, unfathomable mess.

People complain about Wyrd being "All about the money"...I wonder how they expect the company to rectify the problems if they can't pay the bills.

I got annihilated just last night by a single gremlin with a big gun and insane cards. It wasn't much fun. I've been on both ends of similar games in just about every system I've ever played though, and it's not something that is the Norm in any of them.

Anyway, I don't think Malifaux lends itself well to competitive play. GOOD. It DOES lend itself brilliantly to telling a story in the medium of a miniatures game, and that is exactly what I want. If you want a competitive game then Warmachine and the Page 5 attitude is probably where you want to be. (note: I do not consider this a bad thing per se)

Malifaux has issues. I don't consider them a reason to quit yet. So I'm going to keep loving this awesome mashed up background and the fascinating game built around it.

Edited July 7, 2012 by fishtank

[muribundi]

I'm not going anywhere, though I have noticed I get bored every year in late spring early summer. Then in august the fire get's reignited with the gencon releases.

I would like to see some book 1 stuff get a power bump. So I will be around when version 2 happens. I love the background and aesthetic too much to ever quit , unless I quit gaming altogether.

Hell I wont even quit when the game scale increases beyond skirmish as long as they support equal new options for small and large scale games.

I do agree with calmdowns assessment of rasputina's gang not supporting an optimal fluffy background list, and I always play pandora with a kid list wich is less than optimal.

However I do not agree that the game as a whole doesn't support fluffy lists.

Actually I think this game for the most part supports fluff lists better than any other tabletop game out there.

I think this game is still evolving , and will get much better in the future.

I think I am losing my most regular competitor though (plays nothing but resser,s).

That being said I am not a competetive gamer, I hate magic , and don't care for Warmachine.

So Wyrd could consider the fact that some tournament gamers aren't happy , but most casual gamers are when they tweak their rules in the future , and plot the ongoing direction of the game in year's to come.

Edited July 7, 2012 by muribundi

[ravenborne]

I agree the game could be entering a new golden era. I believe errata will be out eventually for some of the more imbalanced models, hopefully it will come sooner than later. I imagine some of the old guard will quit, early players are the ones that have to go through the growing pains of a game and sometimes it gets too much. The same thing has happened in many other games like MTG, and yet it prospers.

I've played Warhammer Fantasy for years and suffered through all of Games Workshop nonsense. I finally just decided there were better games out there and I needed to stop throwing money at a company that doesn't really seem to care about game play, but just selling models. Didn't rage quit, just decided I wasn't going to give them my money any more.

From what I can tell, Wyrd isn't like this. The owners and designers interact with the community and take feedback. They cannot just go throwing errata around and be reactionary, and they have a lot of other things to do that take priority. but I think were going to see some good stuff in the future.

[dgraz]

Hell I wont even quit when the game scale increases beyond skirmish as long as they support equal new options for small and large scale games.

The designers of the game have stated numerous times that this flat-out will not happen. Malifaux will always be a skirmish game.

I imagine some of the old guard will quit, early players are the ones that have to go through the growing pains of a game and sometimes it gets too much.

I believe I qualify as 'old guard'. I love this game more now than I ever did. The nay-sayers make me a little crazy because they blow the little things that bother them way out of proportion but totally ignore all of the cool and innovative ideas that have been implemented.

I played Warmachine from its infancy and I did finally walk away from that but I knew for a long time that it was going in a direction that I wouldn't like. Malifaux has shown over and over that it will remain something I want to play.

My only complaint is that I don't have more time to play!!

[Calmdown]

From what I can tell, Wyrd isn't like this. The owners and designers interact with the community and take feedback. They cannot just go throwing errata around and be reactionary, and they have a lot of other things to do that take priority. but I think were going to see some good stuff in the future.

With respect, that's a bit of a rosy and/or blinkered view. Having a couple of juniors posting on the forums a little and passing the odd, year-late ruling, does not equal 'great community interaction'.

What it does do, is wonders for PR - because as you can see, a lot of people are satisfied by said interactions, even when the actual effect on the game is incredibly minimal.

[Joel]

With respect, that's a bit of a rosy and/or blinkered view. Having a couple of juniors posting on the forums a little and passing the odd, year-late ruling, does not equal 'great community interaction'.

It does compared to GW. Everything is relative.