Perdita's Spellbreaker spell

[dgraz]

Here is a funny thing that I have never noticed even though I've been playing Perdita since the beginning.

The description for Spellbreaker reads (please note the Bolded bit):

Discard all Counters and end all effects on the target model +1 additional model within 3” of the target per :rams in the casting total. Wounds on the model or Counters carried by the model cannot be discarded.

Even the V2 card carries this same mistake. I'm assuming one of those should be Tokens?

[Q'iq'el]

Here is a funny thing that I have never noticed even though I've been playing Perdita since the beginning.

The description for Spellbreaker reads (please note the Bolded bit):

Discard all Counters and end all effects on the target model +1 additional model within 3” of the target per :rams in the casting total. Wounds on the model or Counters carried by the model cannot be discarded.

Even the V2 card carries this same mistake. I'm assuming one of those should be Tokens?

I think so. The former refers to Blight and Poison and such. The later to Blood Counters, Corpse Counters, Body parts and such.

I think originally there was no difference in gaming terms between the former and the later. But there was a difference between Counters denoting effects on the model and the Counters a model actually carries. The later cannot be used or sacrificed by another model unless you get specific instruction to do so in the description of the Talent/Spell.

So basically, under the old rules, the last line is needed so that the first line cannot be misunderstood as a line permitting the removal of those counters which are carried by the target.

Now I'm not entirely clear if the term "token" is fully established in the current rules. Blood Counters for example are called Blood Tokens in some places and Blood Counters in others. :/

Edited March 26, 2012 by Q'iq'el

[benw]

Ha - you know I am in the same boat. Never noticed it before. It doesn't come up all that often but it is a curious contradiction.

We have been playing it as remove all counters - just not wounds. I think that is the way it is meant to be. An official ammendment would be great.

[SpiralngCadavr]

Yeah, can't tell. It seems like that ability would hose just about any summon-based group (resurrectionists (including kirai b/c of spells), leveticus, scavenger masters, etc.).

I'd hazard that something that powerful wouldn't both be super-long ranged and have no resist...

[Dezzo]

i guess the reason why the range is that long is because it targets only 1 model and you can target 1 more for every ram (and only within 3" from the first target). and you need LOS.

its not as devastating as LJ's Last Rites.

[marshimartian]

The game term "token"wasn't established until the rules manual. Anything printed before that still uses "counter" for what is now considered tokens.

[dgraz]

There aren't a lot of abilities that allow you to remove corpse/scrap counters and the like when they are actually carried so I believe that it allows you to drop things like blight and poison and such.

But that is only an assumption....an official response would be required.

[Q'iq'el]

The game term "token"wasn't established until the rules manual. Anything printed before that still uses "counter" for what is now considered tokens.

Exactly. And as such there is difference between counters on the model and counters carried by the model. Perdita's Spellbreaker differentiates between the two and so should it be played IMHO.

[Cadilon]

Exactly. And as such there is difference between counters on the model and counters carried by the model. Perdita's Spellbreaker differentiates between the two and so should it be played IMHO.

I agree. I would guess the difference would be that Spellbreaker removes effect causing counters on models, what we now call tokens (as has been mentioned) but doesn't remove counters that are being carried. Its very similar to the wording of Shrug Off that the other Ortegas have, with the difference being that the other Ortegas can only remove these things from themselves. So in that context it makes no sense that it would remove carried counters.

My sense is that Spellbreaker was intended to mostly remove effects from friendly models (the other Ortegas) and not so much to remove counters from enemy models, though it doesn't prohibit it.

[WEiRD sKeTCH]

Here is a funny thing that I have never noticed even though I've been playing Perdita since the beginning.

The description for Spellbreaker reads (please note the Bolded bit):

Discard all Counters and end all effects on the target model +1 additional model within 3” of the target per :rams in the casting total. Wounds on the model or Counters carried by the model cannot be discarded.

Even the V2 card carries this same mistake. I'm assuming one of those should be Tokens?

Should be:

Discard all Tokens and end all effects on the target model +1 additional model within 3” of the target per :rams in the casting total. Wounds on the model or Counters carried by the model cannot be discarded.

Counters pre-Rules manual was the catch all for Corpses, Scrap , Blood, as well as Poison and the like.

If you had a Poison Counter on you, you aren't assumed to be Carrying it. Corpse, Blood, Eye and Scrap Counters are carried. Spell Breaker was worded that way so you couldn't force the dropping of those kinds of counters.

Again, pre-Rules Manual.

[dgraz]

Thanks Sketch for the quick response. It appears that common sense prevailed with the forum members in the thread but having the official nod from you really helps.

[Vmag]

Is it too much to assume that this should be how Shrug Off is supposed to read now also? I think the Latigo version of Shrug Off is awfully similar ('Token' in place of 'Counter' and all). I just haven't seen an official change or update to the Clarifications page.