Team Marcus

[brdparker]

Given recent tournament results maybe the above is more accurate. ;-)

Ferb

Niiice... I approve

[jdomin2]

The first game of our league was today, and I was pitted against Hamelin, 35 pts. Flip the black joker for strat, so he chose mine.

Hamelin:

strat Escape and Survive

schemes Thwart, Gather Soulstones (Both Outcast schemes, both announced).

He started with a small crew and knew he'd be summoning more, so the strat was fine for him. He started with more SS's than me, so he seemed to be fine there as well.

Marcus:

strat - chosen by himContain Power

schemes Sabotage and Primal Source (Arcanist/Marcus schemes, both announced).

Hamelin... I think he started with:

15 - x3 rat catchers

7 - nix

6 - x2 the stolen

2 - Obedient Wretch

5ss in cache

Marcus:

8 - Cerberus - so I could roar at the rats and catchers, but he ended up doing sooo much more than that.

9 - x3 Night Terrors - so I could attempt to match-activate him

10 - x2 Silurids - the entire terrain was considered severe and mobility with damage is always nice

5 - Hoarcat - 'cause I heard they were good against rats because of their devour... nah; I would have been better off with another silurid

1 - Jackolope - 'cause why not?

2 - AMarc

4ss cache

Highlights/thoughts:

- At some point, I (wisely, looking back on it) decide I'm just going to ignore the rats and gun for the guy controlling them), and surround Hamelin with night terrors, preventing him from striking, and doing many attacks worth of minor damage, enough to eat him almost dead. Nix walks over and sac's his master so he can come back with a stolen in play... damn.

- Mostly ignored the rats. Wasn't too scared of them, and most of my crew had flight/pass-through, or whatever.

-Sabertooth roared, making all of the (post-howl) 6 rats with 1 WP fall back, and all of the rat catchers. That was nice. A heavily wounded silurid and jackolope also fell back, but it was worth it.

- I got off the AMarc/Cerb combo to kill Hamelin w/o stolen in play! AMarc uses instinctive behavior on the cerb to give him a (1) action. The cerb was in base contact with Hamelin at the time, so he attacks. The cerb also gets +1 flip to attack and damage for the rest of the round... and activates after AMarc if I choose (and I did choose him, along with the silurid, since 2 guys can activate after AMarc). Cerb eats Hamelin's face, bringing him from 12 Wds to 3, draining his control hand and his SS cache (I had 1 SS remaining, so that denied him the 2 pts for having more than me!). The silurid finished him off with a tied opposed Cb/Df dual, so -2 damage flip... and I got the red joker with a moderate followup. I wiped sweat off my brow. That was one of the most exciting games I've played in a while.

Final score

Marc

2 (Contain Power, because my master didn't kill him)

+2 (primal source)

+2 sabotage

= 6

Hamelin

4 (75% of his guys remaining at game end)

=4

And this was my first play against Hamelin! Things I learned were basically to kill Hamelin (good thing I was told to get Contain Power, or I probably wouldn't have done that). Also, I had read somewhere that you should avoid cheating whenever possible; this is absolutely true. By restraining myself and waiting for just those right times, I starved him of cards sooo much. I should have dropped the hoarcats for a third silurid, but other than that... Team Marcus FTW!

Great game. Smart crew selection.

[Fetid Strumpet]

How did your night terrors prevent Hamlin from striking? They are spirits so he can walk right trough them, and they don't Block LoS. They are Ht 1 so they can't target him via Bully...

I just don't see how that works.

[brdparker]

How did your night terrors prevent Hamlin from striking? They are spirits so he can walk right trough them, and they don't Block LoS. They are Ht 1 so they can't target him via Bully...

I just don't see how that works.

Nifty Cb trigger they've got that needs a mask: "Blind [Claws]: If target suffers damage from this Strike, it cannot make Strikes until the End Close Phase."

I love my Night Terrors.

Edit: Reread what you wrote... crap, because their model includes the rocks they're on, I didn't notice they were Ht 1. That changes the game in its entirety. Well, hell, that kinda waters down the victory... And I was all proud of myself and stuff

Edited September 13, 2011 by brdparker

[dgraz]

That changes the game in its entirety. Well, hell, that kinda waters down the victory... And I was all proud of myself and stuff

That does change the game quite a bit - at least it is a league, so you can tell the Hamelin player what happened and offer to play again......so you can kick his butt proper!

[brdparker]

That does change the game quite a bit - at least it is a league, so you can tell the Hamelin player what happened and offer to play again......so you can kick his butt proper!

And I intend to!

[Wormstrum]

Come thursday I would like to join team marcus also. Preferrably with the number 56. Numbers that can be divided by both 8 and 7 make me happy cause it brings back memories of my khorne and nurgle armies in warhammer.

Speaking of numbers and Marcus, I personally feel that his theme song should be Iron Maiden - The Number of The Beast.

[Fulgrima]

Come thursday I would like to join team marcus also. Preferrably with the number 56. Numbers that can be divided by both 8 and 7 make me happy cause it brings back memories of my khorne and nurgle armies in warhammer.

Speaking of numbers and Marcus, I personally feel that his theme song should be Iron Maiden - The Number of The Beast.

Your in

[Wormstrum]

Now I'll go forth and unleash the beast all over the back of some neverborn heads.

[jdomin2]

Can someone make a banner that says "bandwagon marcus" instead of team marcus?

[Nephalumps]

Question to all the Marcus-ites out there: has anyone else been trying out his Avatar?

Despite the initial negative impressions of the rules, I picked it up during the GenCon pre-release, and I've used it twice.

My impressions: its....strange. Marcus himself is a flexible model that can deal a good amount of damage in melee, self buff to a good Df (with a solid defensive trigger,) and run all over the table with enhanced movement shenanigans.

Avatar Marcus, on the other hand, seems to focus almost entirely on turning enemy models into beasts (his (1) 8 ability can catch a lot of models, and he still has Feral,) and buffing his own beasts with his Mark of Instinct and Instinctive Behavior spell. He's also pretty consistently mobile, thanks to Fast and Flight, though his Wk is unchanged (despite growing 2 more legs.)

So, Avatar Marcus operates how normal Marcus "should" (buffing beasts, playing more support,) and normal Marcus operates how Avatar Marcus "should" (running around, hitting things on the head, and staring at everyone.)

Its an odd interaction. The Avatar has done well enough the times I've gotten him out. Instinctive Behavior is a really awesome spell, and Chimeric Assault is actually not a bad attack. Its really random, because it almost certainly depends on what "crap" cards you pick up at the start of the round, but you almost always have one or two cards you can use to fuel it, that would otherwise go to waste.

Also, the avatar requirements are complete cake. There is no way you're not naturally going to get one or both of those during the course of a normal Marcus game. So its very likely that you'll have the Avatar out turn 4, and its not at all unlikely to get it out as early as turn 3.

One of the biggest things I'm wondering is if Avatar Marcus demands a different type of list from normal Marcus. With normal Marcus, you can play a much more "enduring" game, thanks to his Wild Heart buffs, so you can afford to take a more dense crew.

However, Avatar Marcus seems to be much more of a "blitz" type of Master, and this makes me wonder if a more voluminous crew is the better approach. As awesome as Instinctive Behavior is, any beast you cast it on is very likely to die afterwards, as the -2 Df makes them easy targets and Beasts usually don't have the natural durability to endure a barrage. Combine that with the Mark of Instinct giving everyone -1 Wp, and I think you need to build an Avatar crew to be much more aggressive than normal.

I've been contemplating upping the model count for an Avatar crew, both to ensure that I have more stuff around when the Avatar manifests, and to give me potentially more cheap missiles to fire off under Instinctual Behavior.

Sane? Insane? Other experiences? Please share!

[sephiroa]

hey nephalumps, you ever thought about instinctive behavior to cast on an enemy model? you control them, lower their df and can kick the enemies butt, this is acctually an obay, but so annoying for the enemy, since you lower the df, and you have the pulse to make everything in a beast, and you have feral.

try that on something like a mature neph, or nekima. or some other heavy hitter. (do this when it has already activated though)

[Nephalumps]

hey nephalumps, you ever thought about instinctive behavior to cast on an enemy model? you control them, lower their df and can kick the enemies butt, this is acctually an obay, but so annoying for the enemy, since you lower the df, and you have the pulse to make everything in a beast, and you have feral.

try that on something like a mature neph, or nekima. or some other heavy hitter. (do this when it has already activated though)

I actually just considered that as I was typing up my previous post.

I think its potentially a very solid play. In the games I played, I didn't run into a situation where it would have been beneficial to try for it, but I can definitely see where it could work out well.

- Feral or Give Into It to turn them into a Beast.

- Stare Down to give them on the resist for Instinctive Behavior (and for the follow up beatdown.)

- Cast Instinctive Behavior on them, taking advantage of the (1) action or Charge to potentially soften something else up. [Question here: since it becomes a model under your control, would it still suffer from Stare Down during the action?]

- Follow up with any beasts you have nearby (who can activate thanks to Rise of the Beasts.) In this case, the defender would be at -2 Df and on their defense flips, making it very hard for them to not get clobbered.

Even if its a bit situational (need that :rams to get Instinctive Behavior off,) its definitely a powerful tool for taking down a strong enemy model.

Heck, with some luck you could affect several models with Give Into It, Instinctive Behavior twice to have them beat each other up, and then send in your beasts to clean up!

Damn that'd be fun. I now have a new mini-scheme.

[sephiroa]

I actually just considered that as I was typing up my previous post.

I think its potentially a very solid play. In the games I played, I didn't run into a situation where it would have been beneficial to try for it, but I can definitely see where it could work out well.

- Feral or Give Into It to turn them into a Beast.

- Stare Down to give them on the resist for Instinctive Behavior (and for the follow up beatdown.)

- Cast Instinctive Behavior on them, taking advantage of the (1) action or Charge to potentially soften something else up. [Question here: since it becomes a model under your control, would it still suffer from Stare Down during the action?]

- Follow up with any beasts you have nearby (who can activate thanks to Rise of the Beasts.) In this case, the defender would be at -2 Df and on their defense flips, making it very hard for them to not get clobbered.

Even if its a bit situational (need that :rams to get Instinctive Behavior off,) its definitely a powerful tool for taking down a strong enemy model.

Heck, with some luck you could affect several models with Give Into It, Instinctive Behavior twice to have them beat each other up, and then send in your beasts to clean up!

Damn that'd be fun. I now have a new mini-scheme.

jep something like that

and don't forget, when the enemy model resists he has because of enemy, when you control it, it becomes friendly, thus no . BUT, look at aMArcus his other talent friendly beasts get +1cb and -1wp. so the enemy model you are controlling, has +1 cb, +2cg and on damage flip.

but i don't know if you can do it twice, i think its like obey, only one time per activation (don't have book 3 with me)

agree you need the :rams but with a for the enemy, you only need a 8-ish :rams

[sephiroa]

who said aMarcus is a weak avatar i love him and everytime i read and try something with him, i love him even more

[Nephalumps]

jep something like that

and don't forget, when the enemy model resists he has because of enemy, when you control it, it becomes friendly, thus no . BUT, look at aMArcus his other talent friendly beasts get +1cb and -1wp. so the enemy model you are controlling, has +1 cb, +2cg and on damage flip.

but i don't know if you can do it twice, i think its like obey, only one time per activation (don't have book 3 with me)

agree you need the :rams but with a for the enemy, you only need a 8-ish :rams

Great points.

You are totally right about it being just like Obey: once per turn per model. You could, in theory, toss Myranda in there for an additional one, but now we're on the verge of over complicating it.

I also agree: the :rams requirement isn't really that bad, all things considered. The helps a lot, and its not like aMarcus can't burn a Soulstone to bump the casting total if you have to lean on a lower :rams card to get the suit you need.

aMarcus is definitely interesting. Like his normal form, he's not obviously strong, but there's definitely some interesting ideas there. I still wish they had been less harsh with the Chimeric Assault attack and self-buff requirements, but hey, no changing that now.

The biggest issue I'm going to have with aMarcus is that he only pops out mid/late game, so its harder to get a handle on what to do with him!

[HeaDHunTeRfs]

jep something like that

and don't forget, when the enemy model resists he has because of enemy, when you control it, it becomes friendly

I'm sorry to point this one out, but if you control them, they don't become friendly, but they aren't enemy either... Its weird, I know But otherwise you could Alfa an opposing master and let him sacrifice himself for a soulstone...

Also, dominance gives flips to resist duels... So it is less powerfull than Staredown

[Nephalumps]

I'm sorry to point this one out, but if you control them, they don't become friendly, but they aren't enemy either... Its weird, I know But otherwise you could Alfa an opposing master and let him sacrifice himself for a soulstone...

Gotta love nebulous "neutral" states. Still, this does mean that the model wouldn't suffer from Stare Down/Dominance, because they're not an enemy for the duration of the spell, correct?

Also, dominance gives flips to resist duels... So it is less powerfull than Staredown

Good catch! Stare Down is all duels, whereas Dominance is only opposed duels. I wonder why the difference? I guess there were balance concerns with aMarcus being Ht 3, and chain using Give Into It to ultra-bone the opposing crew. Interesting.

Since spells are actually a pair of simple duels instead of one opposed duel, it looks like Dominance wouldn't help out with the casting of Instinctive Behavior.

It would help out with the follow-up beatdown, since all the attacks would be opposed duels.

[sephiroa]

I'm sorry to point this one out, but if you control them, they don't become friendly, but they aren't enemy either... Its weird, I know But otherwise you could Alfa an opposing master and let him sacrifice himself for a soulstone...

Also, dominance gives flips to resist duels... So it is less powerfull than Staredown

hmm, RM: a model is friendly when you control them, seems straightforward to me

[Nephalumps]

Also, almost double post: Did anyone else notice changes between Twisting Fates and the cards for aMarcus?

One I definitely caught was his Ht change (2 in the book, 3 on the card.) I haven't done a side-by-side yet, but has anyone else noticed any changes?

I haven't noticed anything major aside from the height change, but maybe there's some other small stuff.

EDIT: Finally got a chance to sit down and do a side-by-side, and it looks like the Ht change is the only thing different from the book.

Edited September 14, 2011 by Nephalumps
RIF

[HeaDHunTeRfs]

hmm, RM: a model is friendly when you control them, seems straightforward to me

It's also an enemy when hired by the other crew... I know it isn't that clear... But imagine you could alfa a master into drain souling himself? You would even get the ss xD

[Nephalumps]

It's also an enemy when hired by the other crew... I know it isn't that clear... But imagine you could alfa a master into drain souling himself? You would even get the ss xD

I'm really not seeing the problem here.

:evil:

[poulpox]

It's also an enemy when hired by the other crew... I know it isn't that clear... But imagine you could alfa a master into drain souling himself? You would even get the ss xD

Hiya!

There's no issue really here as Instinctual Behaviour stipulates a "non-master model" as well as the (1) action cannot cause the model to directly sacrifice/kill itself.

When under control by aMarcus the ennemy beast becomes friendly, therefore while under the Instinctive Behavior effect, Dominance would not apply to the model but as soon as IB ends the model resumes being an ennemy beast and receives the (-) flip; it's a great combo!

Edited September 15, 2011 by poulpox

[jdomin2]

Give in to it also allows you to use instinctive behavior and healing spells on non beasts. So any mercs or non beasties near marcus (gunsmith, kaeris,mctavish, etc) get the obey benefits, sadly not many need or want the charge or melee buffs.

[sephiroa]

It's also an enemy when hired by the other crew... I know it isn't that clear... But imagine you could alfa a master into drain souling himself? You would even get the ss xD

i don't think you can kill yourself with drain soul