Ramos list: Critique Appreciated.

[Jonas Albrecht]

25 SoulStones

Victor Ramos, Robot Gangster - SSC: 2

Mobile Toolkit - 3ss

Guardian - 7ss

Large Steampunk Arachnid x2 - 10ss

Steampunk Arachnid - 3ss

Total: 23ss, Cache 4

I am trying to put together a mobile command style list for Ramos. Mobile Toolkit follows Ramos, casting Arcing Screen (though it might be a soulstone sink), and provides Ramos with the extra Tome to secure his summons. The Large Arachnids act as the offensive arm of the group, both drawing away fire and pinning down ranged models, as well as attempting to deal with out of range objectives.

Depending on the Strategy, Ramos, the Guardian, and the Toolkit park in a secure location and begin to generate the appropriate contructs.

This is my first Ramos list, so feel free to point out any changes that you'd make, based on your experience playing him or playing against him.

[hippieshopper]

It looks alright to me but I have had a few Ramos players tell me that the big spider isn't as great as he could be.

[Wodschow]

The Guardian is out-of-faction so should be 8SS.

The large spiders seem a little uninteresting to me aswell ruleswise. It's not that they're necessarily bad, they just don't have any fancy rules.

The best thing they got going is that they're the cheapest scrap counters available, which is a so-so thing..

[Jonas Albrecht]

The Guardian is out-of-faction so should be 8SS.

The large spiders seem a little uninteresting to me aswell ruleswise. It's not that they're necessarily bad, they just don't have any fancy rules.

The best thing they got going is that they're the cheapest scrap counters available, which is a so-so thing..

My mistake, I thought that was only when hiring Mercenaries.

As for the LSA, they're seemingly durable models with Arachnid, and a card mill. I'm eager to see them in action.

[Wodschow]

Please do, and please tell us how they worked out for you!

They don't really seem like much of a card mill to me, a trigger on Df, that requires a suit and only have a ~1/4th chance to actually get a card if it triggers. Hmhmm..

I suppose their statline is okay though

[LoboStele]

I've not been all that impressed with the Large Arachnid, and especially not to take two of them. With only having one Arachnid to start with, you're going to be not getting a Swarm till Turn 2, and then not getting a 2nd swarm until turn 5. And for the most part, that means Ramos never leaving the deployment zone. Guess it depends on what strategy you pull though. I would almost rather start with a Swarm (or even 3 individual Spiders) rather than the Large Spider and the extra Spider. Granted, that only leaves you 3 SS, but in a 25 point game, that's probably enough.

[Jonas Albrecht]

Huh, so the Swarm is still king, even with all the toys Ramos gets in Rising Powers. I'm alright with that, I love those things.

The Guardian is great, and fulfills the role that Joss' fluff suggests. I'm looking forward to testing its abilities against the Ortegas.

[LoboStele]

Huh, so the Swarm is still king, even with all the toys Ramos gets in Rising Powers. I'm alright with that, I love those things.

The Guardian is great, and fulfills the role that Joss' fluff suggests. I'm looking forward to testing its abilities against the Ortegas.

Well, that said, I have not actually played any games with the Large arachnid yet, but just going off the straight stats. I've only played a couple games with Ramos so far. But one of the other guys in our group has tried the Large Arachnid and he wasn't that impressed with it. If you really need the scrap counters, I could see using it in order to more cheaply generate the small Spiders. Still though, only being able to summon one spider per turn really slows you down.

[HopelessHeretic]

I find that the large arachnids are great work horses and are a steal for 5 points. If you run them I feel that the mobile toolkit is a must since you will want to take advantage of brutal. The only issue I see with your list is the guardian. I don't know what it would do in this list. Wrote ting ramps is a bit redundant since he already has armor 2 and the spiders aren't evaluable enough to warrant his protection. I would drop him for more spiders. I personally feel that ramps struggles with objectives when you play games below 35 stones. Also don't be afraid of picking things that are not constructs cassandra and a Cerberus can be very useful.

-Heretic

[Jonas Albrecht]

He is there as a bulwark against shootey lists, and because I like him.

[tadaka]

If you are looking to buff up the list from rising powers guardian, hunter and soulstone miner all make great options for ramos.

Large spiders from my exp are not bad for 5 points however in jumping up to close double the cost they lose what makes the smaller spiders so great for ramos. They are no longer so cheep to make them easy to say hey lets just blow them up. Rare means you cant just spam them like little spiders. Unfortuently they are only have a little better stats, dont add any thing new that makes them stand out and no voltron tricks.

Guardian next to ramos basicly just makes him a rock. He was never fast and this guy wont help it. What it does do it make it so many crews are compleatly ineffective when trying to take him out. He makes a great tool for some missions. This is a model you need to look at the mission and decide if you want him.

Hunters add some great mobility and some lure ability to his crew. That being said dont let them get to far ahead of the crew or they will die.

Soulstone miners are a great addition for ramos. They can become invincible when needed and have great mobility. As long as you plan ahead they can be very nice for some mission objectives. Others they suck for but you will know that before you take them so plan acordingly. They can also dish out some nice damage if your willing to burn a soulstone. Like I said with the guardian this is another model you need to look at the mission and decide if its the tool for the job.

[Wodschow]

Well the Guardian doesn't steal any mobility from Ramos either, I think he's a solid addition - and would much rather include him with Ramos than Hoffman anyway.

... If you run them I feel that the mobile toolkit is a must since you will want to take advantage of brutal. ...

I fail to see how the Toolkit affects Brutal in any way at all.

[HopelessHeretic]

The toolkit frees ramos from the need of tome control cards from your hand.

-Heretic

[Doctor Amos]

Hm. ::reading rules:: Mobile toolkit is significant? That's odd.

[LastDinosaur]

The toolkit frees ramos from the need of tome control cards from your hand.

-Heretic

Ah yea, obviously. Point taken

[LoboStele]

Hm. ::reading rules:: Mobile toolkit is significant? That's odd.

Oh weird...I hadn't noticed that either. Unless the card is different from the book (I only have the book on hand at the moment). I hadn't considered casting Arcing Screen with the Toolkit either, which could be a neat trick. Or even casting it with BOTH the Toolkit and Ramos, that way it protects both of them. The Toolkit really needs that armor bonus, what with Easy to Wound and only have 3 Wds, with no Armor to start with. It's usually my first target whenever I play against a Ramos crew, as it's a piece of cake to take down most of the time.

[tadaka]

I pointed that out as the other options I listed do add mobility to the crew thats all.

Well the Guardian doesn't steal any mobility from Ramos either, I think he's a solid addition - and would much rather include him with Ramos than Hoffman anyway.

I fail to see how the Toolkit affects Brutal in any way at all.

[Adran]

I find Ramos is very slow and doesn't pull his weight in a lot of stratergies. This list doesn't do much to cover those deficiencies. If you can bunker up and generate scrap tokens, then it works, but if you are going to have to move him to do anything, then I'm not sure it does all that much, whilst the large spiders are good, they are almost the only thing you have that is going to be leaving your deployment, and they can't stand up to opponents heavy hitters.

Mind you saying that, I can't get Ramos to work consistantly in any form, so take my word with a pinch of salt.

[tadaka]

Dont feal bad ramos is by far one of the most difficult masters to work well with.

Ramos like everything in the game is mission based. For a mission where the goal is to not lose many models he works great. If your goal is more along the lines of line in the sand you will find him to be harder to use. I find the arcanist as a whole to be very mission based. Each of the masters has missions they are amazing at and some they have a hard time with.