Happy with Hans?

[Chucklemonkey]

Seeing as there had been a number of threads where the general feeling - with the exception of a few - was that Hans was not good for his points cost I was just wondering how people felt now that his damage output had been errata'd to 2/2/5?

For those that had used or considered using him, is this enough to get him back in your crew?

For me, I genuinely think it is but interested to hear other people's opinions.

[Hookers]

that change had been out before most of the posts about him. the main argument is that he is not as good as nino (which he isn't) but that he's more expensive (which he is). but they are different and the thing is that not everyone can take nino and even those that can, can't take two.

i'd say the jury is still out. i like him because he is very adaptive. is he worth his ss cost? maybe not, but he is highly situational and tough to use, so in the right spot used well he might be.

in all honesty i think reducing nino's range would be the most appropriate thing to do. why does his machine gun have the same range as a sniper rifle?

also the ram was added to his cb, so that helps the damage output as well.

[tenabrae]

that change had been out before most of the posts about him. the main argument is that he is not as good as nino (which he isn't) but that he's more expensive (which he is). but they are different and the thing is that not everyone can take nino and even those that can, can't take two.

Not just nino, the convict gunslinger as well.

[Gremlin Swarm]

The biggest difference I see is that Nino has Headshot, but it's not necessarily his primary thing, while for Hans, it basically is.

Hans is tricky to use, but he is a specialist, and if you can catch your opponent with less than 2 cards in their hand, he can be brutally lethal.

On the other hand, he might just make your opponent not use a high card (if they've got a really good hand) that might otherwise give you trouble.

He's also a mercenary, which means you can take him in most crews, even if he costs a bit more. (Most games I've seen, models with an ability like this tend to be a bit more expensive to take than other of similar ability.)

Basically, he's a support character, not really meant for front-line use. (A classic sniper.)

[Peterdita]

I still think he's 1SS too much and a bit underpowered.

Maybe add damage to headshot like the borgs decap.

I would agree on a range increase for him. Or maybe some sort advanced placement ability. Ninio's range is a bit much in comparison. Sniper should shoot further. Maybe a new custom ammo with increased range?

Or add a (2) Radpid fire at -2cb, and lose headhot trigger

I also think it would be cool for him to be able to set up (0) "firing lane": place a marker within range, anytime a model passes within 3" of the counter, Hans may take any unused actions to shoot at the target. something like that so he can sort of pin people down/dominate a lane.

IDK, I haven't played him in so long.. I'll hire him next game and see what I think.

Edited June 4, 2010 by Peterdita

[mylastnerv]

I'd like to know as well, I just acquired one in a trade, but I'm having a hard time fitting him in. It just seems that for the points I save more fielding a Convict Gunslinger, I don't get all the range, but I feel I get a model that is more survivable.

[Killionaire]

His damage is fine, but his accuracy is not. That's a bit of a problem, considering how much more accurate a Convict is than him. I can't think of nearly anyone else in his price range that only has that low of a CB.

His Custom Ammo also really never goes off basically. And most of the round types hardly matter.

[mylastnerv]

It's a shame, cause his model and idea is pretty cool, hopefully he gets beefed up a bit in some errata. If anything he'll look good on a shelf.

[Drool_bucket]

Hans does need some help.

While I don't ask that he becomes a "Nino for everyone", they could steer him more to the "One shot, one kill" type of model that has a greater range, more likely to hit, but in the end gets just a chance to do it in...

[Massaen]

Remember he now has critical strike built in as well! This makes his damage RELIABLE damage at a great range.

Hi CB is fine so long as you shoot atthe right target...

[tenabrae]

Hi CB is fine so long as you shoot atthe right target...

Not when you also take into account his speed/lack of ability to get out of melee/shooting restrictions.

[Massaen]

with a range like he has - i find if he is in combat I am about to be tabled...

Speed is a non issue again with a huge range and small board...

As for targeting restrictions - he ignores a bunch of them!

[tenabrae]

with a range like he has - i find if he is in combat I am about to be tabled...

Speed is a non issue again with a huge range and small board...

I take it you don't play vs neverborn, ramos, pedita family) much ? 16 inches is good, but it's far from unassailable... you're either assigning him a bodyguard or leavign him open to an alpha strike.

As for targeting restrictions - he ignores a bunch of them!

Sure, except the ones he introduces for himself.

[thaehl]

I have never personally seen him be particularly useful its such a shame, he is so cool looking and I wish he was a bit more well to be frank, fieldable. he is far too expensive I think the firing lane ability would be cool or just twenty inches of range, I mean he is a sniper, this means that either he is using a sniper rifle improperly or nino is using an automatic sniper rifle with greater efficancy.

[Hatchethead]

I recently purchased a Hans model because I love the sculpt and trust that Wyrd will sort him out.

[Massaen]

I take it you don't play vs neverborn, ramos, pedita family) much ? 16 inches is good, but it's far from unassailable... you're either assigning him a bodyguard or leavign him open to an alpha strike.

Actually, my main opponent is exclusively guild and maily perdita.

But i fail to see what the relevance is by listing thsoe 3...

Neverborn - Lilith and co are fast for sure but its only lilith herself that Hans can't take out... Pandora is a pain but slow with the changes to incite and pacifiy. Shoot the sorrows! Zoraida is a mixed bag but IMO the weakest of the NB.

Ramos - I use him regularly. Hans even has a good shot at worrying ramos from outside the range of ramos only offensive spell. Yes, spiders are fast but again, not unkillable for him with 1 shot...

Perdita - Yes, she is nasty. Yes, her crew is killable with Hans.

I am not saying hans is uber. I am just saying pick the right targets and make sure you mention he has head shot from time to time and you can make him work well

[tenabrae]

Actually, my main opponent is exclusively guild and maily perdita.

But i fail to see what the relevance is by listing thsoe 3...

All of those crews have models that can hit hans in the space of at most 2 activations from outside his range.... silurids, transposed mature neph, crazy guild shennanigans, reactivated steamborg, joss or spiders.

Like I said, Hans needs a bodyguard vs those, in general, nino won't because he can at least walk out of combat if he survives and the convict gunslinger can throw down a rapid fire in melee.

[poulpox]

Like I said, Hans needs a bodyguard vs those

I have to agree here, when playing Hans it's everytime what happened: turn 1, too far to shoot, turn 2 shoots but doesn't necessarily kills (or still no shoot if falling on a board with big obstacles like houses and such which Hans cannot shoot through), turn 2 or 3 charged by some Abomination of some sort which either reacivate or drags him around; the only option out of that was putting a tough fighter on the way which then you can't move away from Hans and limits the play style.

I think if taking Hold Out and Bodyguard, you can use Hans in the back of the board and protect him with other fighty models, whilst holding those back (but in front of hans) and avoid melee the longest possible (to allow Hans to make a few shots).

I like Hans but he's not an automatic choice to my crew, he's a situational one.

[Gremlin Swarm]

Another thing about Hans--He tends to draw fire/attacks, thanks to Headshot. It's an insta-kill ability, which no one is likely to just ignore. It'll tie up cards at least, since the opponent will want to make sure they've got the 2 to dump when he takes a shot. At most, Hans'll catch the target with less than 2 cards and kill them outright.

That's a classic 'threat that must be honored' (or at least not ignored).

Admittedly, he's not tough (like the Peacekeeper, which can fulfill that same role), but since he can hit from fairly far off, he should be able to get at least a couple of shots in.

You can also use him as a sort of lure to bring the models your opponent sends after him either out of position (for them) or into position (for you to nail them).

You need to plan more when using him, but he can still be quite useful. And he can go with almost any crew.