Pig bowling, more movement shenanigans

[Dogmantra]

I end up theorycrafting when I'm trying to sleep and I think I'm onto something here. More movement tricks, using the piggie trigger Bowled Over.

Take Som'er Teeth Jones, at least one Skeeter and one piglet for each model you want to push.

Deploy the piglets directly behind (but not quite in base contact with) the models you want to advance. First activation, move the Skeeter forwards so that the piglets are just within 8" and LoS, then use Do It Like Dis to discard a mask.

Have the piglets charge then attack their assigned model, relent with the defender and trigger Bowled Over for a 12" push forwards for both the piggie and its target. Repeat as many times as necessary, preferably with at least one Slop Hauler to patch up the targets at the end (or use Lenny to throw one into range) because of a minimum 2, very likely 3 damage to each pushed model.

BONUS: Masks is the same suit Som'er needs for his Squeal, which is a movement trick I've been using already anyway - shoot him a couple of times to push him forwards and have him blast some enemy with a focused shot turn 1. This just removes the need to get lucky with flips/have a lot of masks in hand.

Basically this was the result of me trying to get Lenny more mobile. I love to use him to toss two friends on his first activation, but that leaves him so far behind, especially with a Wk of just 4, that in some games he just can't catch up all that well and ends up taking pot shots and tossing stragglers back into the fray.

UPSIDES: a slightly longer Toss that allows interact actions on turn 1, a movement trick that doesn't make some models lag behind (e.g. Lenny with Toss, whoever shoots Som'er, pigs if they spend an AP on Truffles) because the pigs push into base contact.

DOWNSIDES: you need to succeed on the Do It Like Dis cast with the Skeeter and have a mask in hand. You're going to take 3 damage on your pushed models. You can only push in a totally straight line. If your opponent has a sniper, they may target and kill your skeeter, putting a damper on things.

 

Has anyone thought about and preferably done this before? Did it work? Thoughts to improve it? I'm seeing it probably more as a way to move Lenny and maybe a slop hauler forwards more than a way to advance a whole force, although the idea of pushing Rami into position to snipe anyone he pleases turn 1 does make me a littly giddy.

[Bengt]

Why only do it three times? You can do two pig charges (as you are never engaged with friendly models) for a total of four attacks, right? And with the ridiculous size of the Do it like this aura it should be possible stay inside it for four attacks.

When you charge you don't have to head towards the model you charge, just go in a straight line and end in range, so you can adjust direction between the two charges, going 8" in one direction and then another 8" in another.

[Dogmantra]

Ok so I assumed you can't charge a target you're in base contact with, since quite a few abilities that involve moving towards other models won't fire if you're in bsse contact, but you're absolutely right, you can charge as the second AP. You could even just bump the pig directly away as a charge, but cha ging directions makes ths even better.

[Dogmantra]

UPDATE: just finished turn 1 of a game with this tactic. Out of the first 10 cards I drew (6 + 2 for a ss, + 2 for killing my own gremlin), not ONE was a mask, so I was a bit behind but luckily the second gremlin i killed gave me a mask (it's ok I was using them to summon so i didn't lose any net)

I went through my entire deck flipping damage, and irritatingly hit lenny for severe on one of the attacks (he's ok tho, slop hauler + pet the piggy put him back at 0), THEN flipped the black joker on the slop hauler's healing flip, so he's only got 1 wound left (he's pretty safely positioned though). The mask aura was great once I finally got it off, I would have used it to summon with Sammy (instead I used her first to hurt/kill some gremlins via summoning for cards) and also trigger Som'er's squeal to move him up and get off a nifty shot. It's Interference too, so spreading out this quick means I've got a really good shot at  controlling those quarters.

 

I'm pretty sure this is like, the worst it could have gone so I'm looking forward to seeing how it might go in a slightly better game lol.

Edited September 1, 2015 by Dogmantra

[Omenbringer]

A decent tactic but I still prefer to use the pigs for the Truffle Shuffle via Pig Ladders. It is much more controlled and less damaging to a crew that already is prone to damaging themselves. It is also less stress on the Slop Haulers healing (and trying to keep up) and also results in controlled pigs that will do what you want. If playing Som'er over the years has taught me anything, it is that uncontrolled pigs are a hazard that rarely returns a value.

[Dogmantra]

I was worried this might be too similar to the truffle shuffle or whatever so I looked it up but all I could find was a first edition description, which doesn't work anymore.

Also I'm confused why you think slop haulers might have trouble keeping up? You can push one of them with the piggos.

And the pigs aren't uncontrolled? You have 'em charge and push a gremlin, and they end in base contact with their target.

Edited September 1, 2015 by Dogmantra

[Omenbringer]

The Truffle Shuffle still works this edition, though is slightly less potent (you can't really cover the entire board unless you spend a few turns building the ladders). The only change was the loss of Skeeter controllers. Truthfully even the Pig Boomerang still works though you will require 2 Hog Whisperers now.

You are not confused at all, in fact you are proving my point. Without a pig tender Slop Haulers are fairly slow, with one they can keep up.

I am not saying that it cant work, merely that there are more efficient and less damaging alternatives to do it. The big key is the damaging part, gremlins aren't the most durable things. Even with a Slop Hauler, they have to live long enough to receive the healing.

[Astrella]

Saying the Truffle Shuffle works but then not really explaining it isn't the most helpful though...

[Omenbringer]

It is fully explained over on Pullmyfinger (1st edition subdivision) here. Literally the only thing different is that you cant use the Skeeters anymore to position the piglets. Oh and perhaps that the Hog Whisperer no longer has Never Happen, but that really was a neat extra, not required thing. Same goes for the Pig Boomerang, which now requires two Hog Whisperers (one forward and one back) to do instead of only one in last edition.

Edited September 1, 2015 by Omenbringer

[Dogmantra]

Besides Sooey not being available to Skeeters anymore, Never Happen doesn't exist on hog whisperers, pigs don't have reckless, and they're too far away from the hog whisperers/gremlin at points and would have to charge instead of casting Truffles.

I don't doubt that you can use truffles to move a gremlin quite far, I just don't understand how you would do so in M2e without a huge amount of effort and a ton of soulstones.

[Omenbringer]

Why would you need soul stones? Also have never thought of it as much effort for the potential payoffs and most of what it requires is contributing to what the crew is trying to do anyway. It is an intuitive action for me at this point honestly. Probably the most difficult portion to really grasp (and this is true of most of the Gremlin faction) is the sequencing of activation. Get it right and it is great, get it wrong and it will usually cost you big. I enjoy the discussion though. Always good to see how others are doing things.

[Math Mathonwy]

Saying the Truffle Shuffle works but then not really explaining it isn't the most helpful though...

It's very simple these days: use the Truffles ability that the Piglets have. That's it.

You can add stuff to get the Piglets into position (summoning with Lenny, tossing with Lenny, Luring with Trixie) but those are sorta incidental.

I do like this Pig Bowling - a very fun idea. I do agree that it is pretty damaging so care should be taken - especially when going against a ranged crew. Note that aside from Slop Haulers, Lightning Bugs can also make for very efficient healers since you already have the Mask Aura on.

[Kofibrake]

you can use Never happen with the Taxidermist.

 

[Omenbringer]

Yes you can. Fairly sure that the reason behind the action shifts and AP changes this edition was because of the potential of the Pig Ladders in 1st edition. It is still possible, but requires more effort, more models, and has diminished first turn range. Given the new environment, that kind of movement potential could be game breaking.

The balancing factor with Dogmantra's method is the damage that is incurred performing it, the balancing factor with the Truffle Shuffle is the effort required to maximize it as well as the hiring cost of mandatory models.

[Dogmantra]

Speaking of damage it just occurred to me that if you felt like your crew just needed to take more damage, since you have the mask aura anyway, if you wanted some extra movement at the cost of a couple more wounds on Som'er, deliberately hit with your bayou gremlins who are shooting him and trigger I Got 'im Pa, so you get a push on the attacker as well to make up for the walk you're not taking. Probably wouldn't recommend this one, but still useful to know I guess.